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Old 08-05-2008   #1
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Default Where does Eric Winston rank at his position?

I think Erik Winston is a dark horse player for us this year. At the end of the year I believe he will be thought of as a top 3 RT in the league. Unfortunately, RTs usually get skipped over when it comes to postseason awards such as pro bowl/All Pro consideration in favor of LTs.

Being a RT along with the "Houston Texans OL" label has affected Erik Winston from getting the credit he deserves as one of the best young OL in the game today. As of now I think he's a solid top 10 RT, but end of season once Alex Gibbs gets the running game going on the level of our passing game I think he'll be considered top 3.

Its just amazing how the 06 draft is turning out for us. We've got Williams, Meco, and Winston as players who could end up being perennially elite at their position. Then we've got Daniels who could end up being considered "very good" year in year out but just outside elite because its hard to break through the Gates/Gonzo/Heap/Winslow pro bowl lock the AFC has.
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Old 08-05-2008   #2
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

It's Eric.

He's doing well and hopefully continues to improve. He is already getting national attention. Wouldn't know where to rank him exactly.
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Old 08-05-2008   #3
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

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Originally Posted by TheRealJoker View Post
Unfortunately, RTs usually get skipped over when it comes to postseason awards such as pro bowl/All Pro consideration in favor of LTs.
I completely agree that Winston will be, or is already, a top 5 RT in the league. The kid is just plain good.

Unfortunately, I don't agree with the above statement. The pro bowl has to take both positions, equally. I understand that not as many people know the right tackles of many teams. But, the average football fan won't know the left tackle either.
Also, don't forget that coaches and players vote for all pro/pro bowl. After not being able to get around the right hand side, Winston will get all the recognition that he well deserves.
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Old 08-05-2008   #4
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

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Originally Posted by Line_Producer View Post
I completely agree that Winston will be, or is already, a top 5 RT in the league. The kid is just plain good.

Unfortunately, I don't agree with the above statement. The pro bowl has to take both positions, equally. I understand that not as many people know the right tackles of many teams. But, the average football fan won't know the left tackle either.
Also, don't forget that coaches and players vote for all pro/pro bowl. After not being able to get around the right hand side, Winston will get all the recognition that he well deserves.
All Pro roster:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=090...o&confirm=true

All the OTs are LTs.

Pro Bowl Roster:

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/16287024/

Only 1 OT on either team was a RT (Willie Anderson). That's 1 RT and 8 LTs on the Pro Bowl roster...not proportional.
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Last edited by TheRealJoker; 08-05-2008 at 11:06 AM.
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Old 08-05-2008   #5
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

The weighting for pro bowl voting is a combination of fans, coaches and players (isn't it?). I think the % weighted towards fan voting is way too much and that's one reason why I think the pro bowl isn't as highly coveted. You want to get voted to the Pro Bowl and go to Hawaii, but it's a meaningless game to play in and run the risk of getting injured. Fans vote on their favorite player and/or only know skill positions because of Fantasy football.

I think the Texans OL is taking a huge turn this season. We've got young guys at all the positions that fit the scheme, it's getting nat'l attention because of Gibbs, our Rushing offense should be improving... so I think the days of Houston's OL being the laughing stock of the NFL is close to over. Sacks were way down last year, but QB hurries were most likely the same... we just did a better job of getting rid of the ball. I still think we need to improve in pass protection because Schaub got hit way too much.

Winston is a beast- he was such a great pick. A 3rd round gem.
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Old 08-05-2008   #6
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

Pro Bowl Tackles from last season

Walter Jones (injured)
Flozell Adams
Chris Samuels
Chad Clifton (injury replacement)
Matt Light
Jason Peters (injured)
Jonathan Ogden (injured)
Marcus McNeil (injury replacement)
Joe Thomas (injury replacement)

All LTs. It is very difficult for a RT like Winston to gain positive attention. The Colts' RT, Ryan Diem, is another good RT who doesn't get the accolades. I'm very happy with the progres Eric has made, thus far. He may never make a ProBowl, but can be a big part of a championship team here in Houston.
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Old 08-05-2008   #7
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealJoker View Post
All Pro roster:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=090...o&confirm=true

All the OTs are LTs.

Pro Bowl Roster:

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/16287024/

Only 1 OT on either team was a RT (Willie Anderson). That's 1 RT and 8 LTs on the Pro Bowl roster...not proportional.
That's really surprising. I didn't know that. Doesn't seem right that LT's are chosen to play RT in the Pro Bowl. And from everything I've ever heard from the players themselves, the two positions aren't interchangeable.
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Old 08-05-2008   #8
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

I'm guessing its gonna be hard for ERIC to get proper just dues until he has a RB to follow his lead blocks down the field. A great RB can make a great RT & vise versa. The Texans need to draft that Wells kid out of Ohio State if anyway possible, then he'll get the accolades
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Old 08-05-2008   #9
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

better get him resigned
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Old 08-05-2008   #10
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

It will be interesting to see if they go through the whole RFA tender thing with him and negotiate off that, or just extend him outright. He has shown that if healthy, he can be a solid bookend for many years to come. I think the Texans know that and will take care of him since he is so young and just entering his prime playing years.
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Old 08-05-2008   #11
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

i agree. i doubt he'd even make it to the free agent stage. i've listed him as one of our four "must keep" guys along with Johnson Ryans and Williams. Guys you lock up for a long, long time.

http://texanstalk.com/forums/showthr...373#post965373

and I have faith in Smith that he'll reward the guys who deserve it before it even becomes an issue.
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Old 08-05-2008   #12
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

Quote:
Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
I'm guessing its gonna be hard for ERIC to get proper just dues until he has a RB to follow his lead blocks down the field. A great RB can make a great RT & vise versa. The Texans need to draft that Wells kid out of Ohio State if anyway possible, then he'll get the accolades
Lets hope he'd work out better than the last Wells kid out of OSU that we drafted...
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Old 08-05-2008   #13
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

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Originally Posted by aj. View Post
It will be interesting to see if they go through the whole RFA tender thing with him and negotiate off that, or just extend him outright. He has shown that if healthy, he can be a solid bookend for many years to come. I think the Texans know that and will take care of him since he is so young and just entering his prime playing years.

Hope so.

He is a Drew Rosenhaus guy so it could be a little ooky.

The good news is that Winston is originally from Texas. The not as good news is that it didn't stop him from going to Miami for college.
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Old 08-05-2008   #14
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

I think continued improvement of the team, especially making the playoffs, would influence the players more than anything besides money. There's a buzz developing around the team - a young core on both offense and defense, smart coaches, Kubiak a players' coach.

For the record, Lindy's already rates Winston as the 3rd best RT in the league, tabbed for a breakout season, behind Jordan Gross and Vernon Carey. Some other Texans in their rankings:
No.1 WR - AJ - 3
Underrated Tandem - AJ and Walter
TE - Owen Daniels - 9th
Passing Game - Worthy of Mention (8-13th)
LG - Pitts - 9th
RDE - Mario - 5th
Underrated Tandem - Mario, Kalu/Weaver
DT - Amobi - 6th
MLB - DeMeco - 9th
K - Brown - 8th
P - Turk - 10th
Returner - AD - 7th
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Old 08-05-2008   #15
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

Chris Myers is also a Rosenhaus client. (and Darius Walker and Dominique Barber)

Luke Petitguot is about the only other T on Drew's client list but his recent deal with the Bucs is hardly a fair compare to Winston's given the very different circumstances (one a rising star potential RFA and the other a cap casualty coming off injury)

Not sure how much Drew is behind Anquan Boldin's whining earlier this summer but that's the only sticky one of his that I can recall being in the news recently.

http://www.rosenhaussports.com/athletes.php

Marion Barber, another Drew client, recently signed a seven-year deal worth $21 million over the first three years with a $16 million signing bonus. That's large. While the cowboys were negotiating that deal, they used the 1st and 3rd round tender on Barber.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...e.73ddffb.html

With Duane Brown affordably locked up for 5 years (assuming he can't void), they have some money to give to Winston. I know one thing... Winston will get a lot more than what Chester Pitts got for his extension a few years back (4 yrs $20 million w/$8.1 million in guarantees). The more I think about it, Winston's deal may go down in a similar way as Barber's - with the total value slightly less - given the RB1/RT comparison isn't 100% apples to apples either.

Last edited by aj.; 08-05-2008 at 05:10 PM.
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Old 08-05-2008   #16
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj. View Post
Marion Barber, another Drew client, recently signed a seven-year deal worth $21 million over the first three years with a $16 million signing bonus. That's large. While the cowboys were negotiating that deal, they used the 1st and 3rd round tender on Barber.
Cowboys had a heck of draft in '05. Demarcus Ware and Marcus Spears for their front 7... then snagged Marion Barber in the 4th round. That's the way for a 4th rounder to play in 2 seasons!

And to think we selected Vernand Morency a full 36 picks before Barber.
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Old 08-06-2008   #17
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

I hate to curb the enthusiasm, especially this early.
But Captain Caveman still has work to do before he can justify being mentioned in the top 5.

Take the Chargers game for example, (arghh, it just kills me everytime I rewatch that game) Winston was the culprit for ending our first two drives.
One play resulting with MS on the floor after throwing the ball away.
The other a frantic dump off to Dayne (I think) for a 3 yd loss that bring up 3-13 sumthing like that.

Before we knew it, the Texans were looking at 0-14.
Then another QB pressure and a QB hurry in the second quarter allowed by our RT. Then a few more mistakes in the second half.

I don't need to single out Winston (there were enough bad plays to go around), but it was probably his worse game (hopefully).
And that was not a performance of a solid RT, let alone top 5.

Sorry, but I'd rather not build on false hope!
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Old 08-06-2008   #18
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
I hate to curb the enthusiasm, especially this early.
But Captain Caveman still has work to do before he can justify being mentioned in the top 5.

Take the Chargers game for example, (arghh, it just kills me everytime I rewatch that game) Winston was the culprit for ending our first two drives.
One play resulting with MS on the floor after throwing the ball away.
The other a frantic dump off to Dayne (I think) for a 3 yd loss that bring up 3-13 sumthing like that.

Before we knew it, the Texans were looking at 0-14.
Then another QB pressure and a QB hurry in the second quarter allowed by our RT. Then a few more mistakes in the second half.

I don't need to single out Winston (there were enough bad plays to go around), but it was probably his worse game (hopefully).
And that was not a performance of a solid RT, let alone top 5.

Sorry, but I'd rather not build on false hope!
I can recall a hall of fame LT getting destroyed by a Dwight Freeney, over and over again.... Hmm Jonothan Ogden. My point is this, every player has his day or nemisis for that matter, and when he is not totally up to par. But as for Eric Winston, Caveman is putting in work and has since he took over the job. Is he top 5, heck yeah and soon to be #1
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Old 08-06-2008   #19
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Default Re: Where does Erik Winston rank at his position?

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Originally Posted by pittbull3 View Post
I can recall a hall of fame LT getting destroyed by a Dwight Freeney, over and over again.... Hmm Jonothan Ogden. My point is this, every player has his day or nemisis for that matter, and when he is not totally up to par. But as for Eric Winston, Caveman is putting in work and has since he took over the job. Is he top 5, heck yeah and soon to be #1
I can only hope that it was one of those days for Winston, 'cause he was going against different OLBs (at least 3) and also the 3-4 DE here and there.

His footwork and hand techniques need improvement, simple as that!
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Old 08-06-2008   #20
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Default Re: Where does Eric Winston rank at his position?

Anybody care to speculate what kind of a coin Winston will get, whether with the Texans or another team ? Use to be Olineman didn't get humoungous coin, except for the "glamor" guys among them at LT.
But everything changed a couple years ago when the Vikings shelled out 'bout 15-16 M guaranteed for Steve Hutchinson's services, who of course was a mere guard. I'm still trying to understand that one, but it happened and whatever the market says is in fact what the economic reality of a players value is, atleast to one team which is all that really matters.
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