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Old 05-12-2008   #1
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Default Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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There are times when Jethro Franklin is a very likable guy. There are times he is not.

Is hateable a word? Matters not, as it is the word used by one Texans defensive lineman to describe how Franklin is on the football field.

Franklin seems to enjoy getting under players' skin. The players don't like it. They openly discuss doing harm to the assistant coach.

Logic leads one to assume they are joking, but the delivery of said threats comes with nary a wink or a smile.

"There are times you just want to choke Jethro," Mario Williams said matter-of-factly after a particularly grueling (and grilling) workout at Texans minicamp. "I hope it doesn't happen one day, but if it does ... "

Long list of suspects
If it does, the authorities will have a difficult time zeroing in on a suspect. Every defensive lineman on the roster has at one time or another — and probably at the same time for that matter — vowed to end Franklin's torture.

You could put together several CSI-worthy flashback scenes from Saturday's practice alone.

They only owed him five reps. At least that is what Franklin kept yelling at them.

So it is understandable that they were a bit disheartened when they lined up in three-point stances for what was their sixth repetition of this particular drill.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/5771546.html
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Old 05-12-2008   #2
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

On the radio this morning LZ mentioned that he saw Franklin chewing out Amobi. Apparently they are making it a point to not let his laziness become an issue this season. Or at least trying to.

I'm really excited about the way they are talking up Mario, but I think it is essential that Amobi becomes a consistent contributor, at least with his pass rush. With Okam on the line it is not as essential (though preferred) that his run play take a big step forward, but with the lack of another pass rushing DE, he has to be able to consistently put pressure on the QB. Hopefully he can step up one aspect of his game.
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Old 05-12-2008   #3
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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Originally Posted by nero THE zero View Post
On the radio this morning LZ mentioned that he saw Franklin chewing out Amobi. Apparently they are making it a point to not let his laziness become an issue this season. Or at least trying to.

I'm really excited about the way they are talking up Mario, but I think it is essential that Amobi becomes a consistent contributor, at least with his pass rush. With Okam on the line it is not as essential (though preferred) that his run play take a big step forward, but with the lack of another pass rushing DE, he has to be able to consistently put pressure on the QB. Hopefully he can step up one aspect of his game.
I never heard of Amobi being lazy, I heard a lot about him hitting the wall alst year like all rookie lineman do but not about him not working hard.
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Old 05-12-2008   #4
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Cool Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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I never heard of Amobi being lazy, I heard a lot about him hitting the wall alst year like all rookie lineman do but not about him not working hard.
It was never said, but there was a "read between the lines" type of thing.
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Old 05-12-2008   #5
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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Originally Posted by Yankee_In_TX View Post
It was never said, but there was a "read between the lines" type of thing.
Who was reading and where were these "lines"?
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Old 05-12-2008   #6
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
Who was reading and where were these "lines"?
There were a number of indicators, from pressers to Amobi being taken out of the starting line-up one game last season, that there was something in his play that the coaches didn't like. Franklin also eluded to it in his interview on 1560 that TC blogged about.

What that "problem" was has never been explicitly stated, but all indications are laziness.
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Old 05-12-2008   #7
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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Originally Posted by Yankee_In_TX View Post
It was never said, but there was a "read between the lines" type of thing.
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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
Who was reading and where were these "lines"?
Just curious if it was lines of a white powder? I am not saying, I'm just asking.
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Old 05-12-2008   #8
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

Great, now we'll have "Amobi needs to stop being lazy!" Threads every game he doesn't get a sack.
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Old 05-12-2008   #9
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

He must be hanging with TJ - King of Lazy.

I think all three of them will be much better this year. But then again, what do I know?
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Old 05-12-2008   #10
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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Originally Posted by nero THE zero View Post
What that "problem" was has never been explicitly stated, but all indications are laziness.
I'm not sure how one can differentiate from hitting the rookie wall and laziness. Okoye didn't seem so lazy in the 1st half of the season when he was racking up RBs and QBs. The drafting of Okam should allow Travis Johnson to split time between the 1 & 3 technique DT spots and keep Okoye fresh to rush the passer in the 2nd half of the season.
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Old 05-12-2008   #11
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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I'm not sure how one can differentiate from hitting the rookie wall and laziness. Okoye didn't seem so lazy in the 1st half of the season when he was racking up RBs and QBs. The drafting of Okam should allow Travis Johnson to split time between the 1 & 3 technique DT spots and keep Okoye fresh to rush the passer in the 2nd half of the season.
Well, like I said, nothing has been explicitly stated. But there were several indicators last season that there was something in Amobi's work ethic that they didn't like. As I mentioned, there was a game last season that he didn't start because he was "in trouble." I don't really have the time or the means to go back and find a link, but Franklin speaks of it in the 1560 interview:

http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2008/...ario-and-more/
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3:25 On defensive tackle Amobi Okoye: His youth is no excuse as he has always played against older guys. He has some things to work on that are private between Franklin and Okoye. One of the things that he needs to work on is finishing plays.
So, call it what you will, but I'm not making up things here.
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Old 05-12-2008   #12
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

I don't see a problem with Franklin riding their butts and making life miserable, of course they feel that way, but it's called pushing your players as hard as you can to be better. It's not always roses and buckets of sunshine, but that's how its got to be sometimes.

When I was in the USAF, I had a civilian boss, he rode my butt everyday. Just me and a couple othere guys, not everyone. We absolutely hated his guts at the time, but he saw something in me and pushed me to be better, he didn't care if I liked him or not, but he was training me for things later on in my professional life that I didn't see as 22-23 years old. Now, I am grateful for him and for him being so hard on me, I wouldn't have gotten to where I am at if he did care enough to push me.

That being said, he was a HUGE pain in the ass though.
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Old 05-12-2008   #13
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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Originally Posted by nero THE zero View Post
So, call it what you will, but I'm not making up things here.
I'm not saying you are. And Franklin should use whatever motivational techniques he deems fit. But if you look at Okoye's numbers from the 1st 9 games (24 tackles, 5 sacks), and his last 7 (8 tackles, 0.5 sacks), it seems like an obvious example of hitting the rookie wall.
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Old 05-12-2008   #14
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

So, if I'm reading this thread correctly, Amobi is getting lazy because he is doing lines with TJ?
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Old 05-12-2008   #15
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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Originally Posted by nero THE zero View Post
There were a number of indicators, from pressers to Amobi being taken out of the starting line-up one game last season, that there was something in his play that the coaches didn't like. Franklin also eluded to it in his interview on 1560 that TC blogged about.

What that "problem" was has never been explicitly stated, but all indications are laziness.
For what it is worth, I had the same impression as well. I don't know if it is just a criticism of d-lineman in general, but it seems that a lot of our d-lineman have had "motor" issues. When we drafted TJ (and even after his first two seasons in the league) he was crtiticized for not giving his best effort. In know coming out of college, Mario was knocked for taking plays off.

I think the coaches approach to the players is at least in part, to these issues. Clearly, Mario and TJ have responded to this approach. I don't know why, but I have a feeling that this won't be a problem for Amobi - my gut tells me that this guy is a hard worker and that his issues were more of a conditioning/ rookie issue last year.

Of all of these guys, I think Okam has the most to gain from this coaching technique. A lot has been said about Okam and his production late in his college career. I don't think we should under estimate that he went through several different d-coordinators at UT. Also, don't under estimate that the UT coaches have develpoed a reputation dealing too softly with their players. In Okam's case (as well as other UT players), I think this resulted in relying too much on physical ability (rather than technique) and just not giving in 100% on every play. If Okam responds to this approach, I think we will have gotten a steal late in the draft.
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Old 05-12-2008   #16
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

depending on P.O.V. and being on the field seeing the guy..only coaches would know.


Was he not trying anymore half way to though the season?

or
Has his young body hit the wall and the coaches were trying to push(*edit* motivate) him through that wall that rookies go through and continue to press on even if the "stats" weren't there
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Old 05-12-2008   #17
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

Yeah, I'm not buying the "Lazy issuses" crap.

He certainly wasn't "Lazy" in the Denver game (week 15) when his pressure up the middle lead to two Mario Williams sacks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dImtYvSUKc

(min 1:13) Okoye collapses the pocket and ties up Cutler long enough for Mario to get there.....later you can see Okoye beating his hand into the turf upset that he didn't get Cutler down.

(min 2:19) Okoye brings pressure straight up the middle again flushing Cutler out straight towards Mario.

The kid was 19 when we dafted him.........and he had a fantastic rookie season. I mean I'm glad the Texans coaching staff is setting the bar high, but I think Okoye met all expectations last year. (well he atleast met mine). I expect even a bigger year out of him this season.

Rookies hit walls, same thing happened to Dunta Robinson when his fantastic Rookie season all of a sudden tailed off.

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Old 05-12-2008   #18
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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Yeah, I'm not buying the "Lazy issuses" crap.

He certainly wasn't "Lazy" in the Denver game (week 15) when his pressure up the middle lead to two Mario Williams sacks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dImtYvSUKc

The kid was 19 when we dafted him.........and he had a fantastic rookie season. I mean I'm glad the Texans coaching staff is setting the bar high, but I think Okoye met all expectations last year. (well he atleast met mine). I expect even a bigger year out of him this season.

Rookies hit walls, same thing happened to Dunta Robinson when his fantastic Rookie season all of a sudden tailed off.
I agree CB...
and off the subject for a second
and last season a thought ran through my mind, about the best thing that happened to Adrian Peterson was the slight injury middle of the season...Gave his body time to heal and other parts to rest for a second or two, because I did wonder if he would it that Rookie wall...

anyway back on topic.. I am thinking the coaches were just trying to motivate him through that period that rookies go through...they aren't aware of how much different the NFL is compared to college and w/ more games (including preseason)
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Old 05-12-2008   #19
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

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For what it is worth, I had the same impression as well. I don't know if it is just a criticism of d-lineman in general, but it seems that a lot of our d-lineman have had "motor" issues. When we drafted TJ (and even after his first two seasons in the league) he was crtiticized for not giving his best effort. In know coming out of college, Mario was knocked for taking plays off.

I think the coaches approach to the players is at least in part, to these issues. Clearly, Mario and TJ have responded to this approach. I don't know why, but I have a feeling that this won't be a problem for Amobi - my gut tells me that this guy is a hard worker and that his issues were more of a conditioning/ rookie issue last year.

Of all of these guys, I think Okam has the most to gain from this coaching technique. A lot has been said about Okam and his production late in his college career. I don't think we should under estimate that he went through several different d-coordinators at UT. Also, don't under estimate that the UT coaches have develpoed a reputation dealing too softly with their players. In Okam's case (as well as other UT players), I think this resulted in relying too much on physical ability (rather than technique) and just not giving in 100% on every play. If Okam responds to this approach, I think we will have gotten a steal late in the draft.
Not sure I agree with your thought. IMO Mario last year was healed and had the benefit of a year in NFL behind him and all the hoopla of being #1 chosen over Bush. TJ had a private talk in Kubes office that was well documented that the coach expected more and quickly. TJ first efforts on the field prior to last season seemed to indicate he got the message.

I am not one of those that believe that Gibbs or Franklin yelling at players is successful. There is more to their approach than pointing out to the player with profanity and volume that the player screwed up. Some people of that age group respond well to a drill instructor mentality and others do not. Okoye is a very smart person who has adapted will to his first year in the NFL. He did not compete last year with players just a few years older & still in his age group with college experience. Rather against players with several years of NFL training and game experience. He did remarkably well & there is nothing to indicate he will not advance this season. I believe the two coaches definitely get into a player's head ( and others within the area) but also have the ability to motivate. There is more going on besides the teaching seen on the field.
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Old 05-12-2008   #20
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Default Re: Solomon: Texans' Franklin gives players something to gripe about

We usually hear what we expect to hear, and if Franklin wanting to keep things between him and Amobi is heard by some as laziness, maybe they're right. To me, it means for one of what could be several reasons (laziness included), he doesn't want folks outside of the organization to know.

It just seems like whenever it becomes a consensus of "Even though we have no way of knowing the answer - this is what we know the answer to be", we are usually wrong.
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