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Old 12-10-2004   #41
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Manning isn't good enough of a QB for you? He strikes me as 'pretty good' myself.
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Old 12-10-2004   #42
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I didn't say he wasn't a good QB. I said I don't respect the way he tries to throw off the DFence by faking audibles. He shouldn't have to do that. It just seems like a bush league tactic to me.
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Old 12-10-2004   #43
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QB's have been barking out fake audibles as far as I can remember, but not many QB's call plays at the line of scrimage like Peyton. If he didn't throw in a few bogus calls then all you would have to do is find a pattern to blow up calling plays in front of the defense.
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Old 12-10-2004   #44
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you can say the same thing about always calling audibles whether they are real or not. You can't tell me that he does not tip his hand at the line. By doing it so much there is alot more info on finding a pattern, ask any poker player. I watched one game where the direction he pointed tipped which way the play was going. That was only one obvious tell seen on tv. You add in the head movement, face and voice, the D should have 1 up on him. Maybe they do and he is good enough to execute the play, but if that's the case, just make the play and quit wasting my time. As the ancient Chinese saying goes: "He who use deception, need help completing the reception".
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Old 12-10-2004   #45
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Originally Posted by BullPenAndy
I didn't say he wasn't a good QB. I said I don't respect the way he tries to throw off the DFence by faking audibles. He shouldn't have to do that. It just seems like a bush league tactic to me.
There is a great article on ESPNInsiders about this but I can't link to it here. Essentially they tongue in cheek say that even his own line doesn't like all the audibles but that they like the result. In addition, they say the majority of the audibles are not fakes. Peyton goes to the line with 3 plays called, but on the pass play will have as many as 10 options. He designates the play and a whole tree of options with those audibles.
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Old 12-10-2004   #46
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Personally as an offense I would think if you can throw the defense off and gain an upper hand by calling multiple audibles it's a good thing...

I don't remember him doing that at Tennessee but perhaps he did.

Irregardless it works; the guy is playing out of his mind this year and has taken his game to a level most QB's would love to be at.

I think it's well documented that few in the league are as studious as Peyton is. I think he's just trying to get an edge and he obviously is successful.
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Old 12-10-2004   #47
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Here are a couple of quotes from the article about how extensive his audible options are:

Quote:
All 300 plays in the Colts' game plan each week can be audibled, verbally or by hand signal.
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Moore sends Manning into the huddle with three or four options to choose from at the line. For example, Manning may call two runs, 43 Iso and 42 Power, as well as a passing package, such as the "check" package. The runs are basic. The passing packages, though, branch out once the Colts get set at the line of scrimmage. The "check" contains up to 10 plays for Manning to choose from, as though he's mentally clicking a start button and selecting from programs that pop up. Each of those 10 "check" plays has its own variations and deviations, depending on whether the defense is in one of a dozen or more defensive looks. Should a defensive end move one gap over, or a corner shade just a bit toward the middle of the field should any one of a hundred different things happen on the defensive side of the ballManning is once again barking and waving, annoying fans everywhere.
After reading this article, gotta say he may be the one QB that can take such an offensively unbalanced team all the way. He is just so studious it's ridiculous--it would be a shame not to put enough talent around him to take full advantage of his skills.
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Old 12-10-2004   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BullPenAndy
I don't respect him and here's why. If he is supposed to be the great QB everyone says, why does he waste my time with all the fake audibles? If he is "that good", he should not have to trick the opponent. Line up, call an audible if its warranted, and execute the play.
yes, you have officially made the dumbest point I've ever read. Sorry if I won't elaborate much, but that was incredibly unintellegent. You don't respect him because he tricks the defense!?!?!?!? Then you better not respect Carr when he runs play action, becuse if hes good enough, he can always drop back and never need to cruely trick anyone. Wow, I have lost about 50 IQ points for reading this post!
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Old 12-10-2004   #49
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Originally Posted by infantrycak
Well gee, you think that might be because Manning was pulled in the Bears, Lions and Titans games after hearing the criticism not just from fans but the game announcers at the Texans game?
yeah, I am sure dungy and polian listen to you guys and and form their game plan around that. You guys are babys and couldn't handle the game or a loss. this is all your team has to get them fired up? Please. Talk about something else.
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Old 12-10-2004   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BullPenAndy
I don't respect him and here's why. If he is supposed to be the great QB everyone says, why does he waste my time with all the fake audibles? If he is "that good", he should not have to trick the opponent. Line up, call an audible if its warranted, and execute the play.
This is the dumbest post i have ever read. What your saying is, if peyton sees a blitz, not to change the play to give his team an advatage? So he should just get sacked, when he has a chance to turn it into a big play? I doubt you would say the same thing if carr was doing it...i can't believe you said that...lol

I put your post on the indystar colts message board...so all can see your ignorance....

http://www.indystar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88646

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Old 12-10-2004   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BullPenAndy
I don't respect him and here's why. If he is supposed to be the great QB everyone says, why does he waste my time with all the fake audibles? If he is "that good", he should not have to trick the opponent. Line up, call an audible if its warranted, and execute the play.
So what did you think of Manning's manipulation of the clock in the Green Bay game? 2:40 remained in the second quarter. Peyton comes to the line, proceeds to 'call' about 15 audibles and simply allows the play clock to run out.

The Packers were suckered into not calling a time out prior to the two minute warning, thereby losing about 30-35 seconds of valuable time.

Was that a case of brilliance on the part of a very smart quarterback?

Or was it simply another case of someone cheating?
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Old 12-11-2004   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SandersIsTheFuture
yeah, I am sure dungy and polian listen to you guys and and form their game plan around that. You guys are babys and couldn't handle the game or a loss. this is all your team has to get them fired up? Please. Talk about something else.
if ya dont like it leave ! That sound simple enough for ya ???
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Old 12-11-2004   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BullPenAndy
I don't respect him and here's why. If he is supposed to be the great QB everyone says, why does he waste my time with all the fake audibles? If he is "that good", he should not have to trick the opponent. Line up, call an audible if its warranted, and execute the play.
LMAO!! andy i know, its almost like peyton is picking on the defense huh? LOL, come on man i guess your against a hard count to make the defense jump off sides on 3rd and short also ? how dare peyton try to confuse the defense, i mean its not like they dont try to do the same to him, they do, they just cant out fox a fox. what is the difference between a defense showing blitz and dropping into coverage instead of blitzing? they are trying to throw the QB off and make him check to a play that wont work. you are just trying to find something to nag about because he is the best and not on your team, if peyton came to the texans you all would be all over his sack, but since he plays for a rival team you have to find something childish to cry about. that without a doubt is the dumbest reason i have ever heard to not like a qb because hes to good. he is going to give you nother reason not to like him come sunday, in fact id say he will give several new reasons when you look up at the scoreboard. the texans will have to pay peyton for making sure all the lights on the scoreboard work.
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Old 12-11-2004   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SandersIsTheFuture
yeah, I am sure dungy and polian listen to you guys and and form their game plan around that. You guys are babys and couldn't handle the game or a loss. this is all your team has to get them fired up? Please. Talk about something else.
Hey Mr. Readingisfundamental--try reading what my post you quoted was in response to--specifically one of your compatriots saying the Bears, Lions & Titans didn't complain about Peyton throwing down field late in the game--well, duh, he was pulled in those games unlike ours. As for the cause of the decision to pull him in those games, there sure is a coincidence that after the game announcers and press questioned the decision one week, the Colts actions changed in the next few weeks--hardly a great leap of faith to fill in that gap.
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Old 12-11-2004   #55
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You people are not understanding what I said. I didn't say I don't like the audibles he calls at the line. I said I don't like the FAKE ones. What is the point of calling a fake audible. To throw off the Defence? I don't think he should have to do it. I an sorry for not explaining it to you fully. I will try to type slower next time.
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Old 12-11-2004   #56
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How can you tell which ones are fake or not? THAT'S THE POINT!!!
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Old 12-11-2004   #57
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On espn radio, Kiper and the other host (just an hour ago or so) were basically calling the Texans a bunch of whiners for crying about the Colts running up the score.
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Old 12-11-2004   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BullPenAndy
You people are not understanding what I said. I didn't say I don't like the audibles he calls at the line. I said I don't like the FAKE ones. What is the point of calling a fake audible. To throw off the Defence? I don't think he should have to do it. I an sorry for not explaining it to you fully. I will try to type slower next time.


the POINT is to win the game
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Old 12-11-2004   #59
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My point is.... He is too good of a QB to have to call fake audibles. He reads the defense, and then calls a REAL audible to make a play against you. He does that all the time. What is the point of trying to confuse the D when you can out execute them.

You people need to learn to read what is written before you comment. I love how you "put words in my mouth" and tell me what I think. The best one is setting up another thread with select quotes that make it seem like I am saying something else. I never said he was a bad QB, I never said he shouldn't call audibles at the line. I said he should not have to call fake audibles. But thats just my opinion.
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Old 12-11-2004   #60
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and you are intitiled to your opinion no matter how crazy or baffling it is
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