Death to Google Ads! Texans Talk Tip Jar! 🍺😎👍
Thanks for your support!

Texans sign safety Nick Ferguson

drewmar74

disgruntled
another former bronco...
Personally, I don't care where he's from. If we can get above-average safety play with some depth by hiring nothing but rodeo clowns I'm all for it.

Additionally if we can get some decent safety depth and then target other areas in the draft I'm all for that, too.
 

Ole Miss Texan

Hall of Fame
another former bronco...
and another STRONG safety...


in all seriousness though, I don't think it can hurt. We do have CC Brown and Glenn Earl that I think are more than sufficient at SS. I'm fine with bringing in Ferguson is he's paid to be the backup he will be.

I'm interested to see how some of the young guys like Brandon Harrisson are developing. I havn't really seen him play (practice or at Stanford). For those that have, will he be in the SS mix or is he a viable option as a FS for us down the road?
 

beerlover

Hall of Fame
I could see this signing happening with opening day roster of CC Brown & Harrison @ SS Demps & Ferguson @ FS.

Glenn Earl is an unrestricted free agent next season, think his status is on shaky ground, not sure how much dead money or cap savings if released outright?
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Ferguson's play showed a down turn in 2007 after having suffered an 2006 season ending knee injury which required surgery. The Broncos have taken the direction of essentially youthening their safety position. It's interesting to note that he was nicknamed "train wreck" while in NFLE when he mowed over one of his own team mates on his way to a tackle................sort of gives me flash backs of Spencer........
 

Errant Hothy

Hypermediocrity
and another STRONG safety...
I think we all need to reevluate the safety position for this team.

I'm not sold on the fact that Kubiak and Co. feel the need for one safety to be the designated in the box guy and the other to be the centerfielder type. I think they are looking for a pair of safeties capable of playing both roles equally well.

Now is this the right idea? I have no idea, but from looking over the past signings and draftings of safeties I'm starting to think that we the fans do not have the good of a grasp on what the coaches want from the SS and the FS.
 
I think we all need to reevluate the safety position for this team.

I'm not sold on the fact that Kubiak and Co. fell the need for one safety to be the designated in the box guy and the other to be the centerfielder type. I think they are looking for a pair of safeties capable of playing both roles equally well.

Now is this the right idea? I have no idea, but from looking over the past signings and draftings of safeties I'm starting to think that we the fans do not have the good of a grasp on what the coaches want from the SS and the FS.
You are right for the most part. There are a handful on this sight that understand that the Texans are running a combo safety package where effectively the safties play both positions. So there isnt neccesarily a designation of FS or SS in this system that is why Brandon Harrison was a smart pick since that is the system he ran in college. And also why there is no chance(IMO) the Texans take Kenny Philips in the draft.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
I think we all need to reevluate the safety position for this team.

I'm not sold on the fact that Kubiak and Co. fell the need for one safety to be the designated in the box guy and the other to be the centerfielder type. I think they are looking for a pair of safeties capable of playing both roles equally well.

Now is this the right idea? I have no idea, but from looking over the past signings and draftings of safeties I'm starting to think that we the fans do not have the good of a grasp on what the coaches want from the SS and the FS.
Up to last year, our safety play has been relatively poor, especially the free safety play. There has not seemed to have been a priority to fixing that position ( we had so many other holes ). But if you look at how Smithiak is approaching things, they're always looking for 2-fers............ie., versatility.
I see this as no exception, if they are out there to be gotten.
 

drewmar74

disgruntled
I think we all need to reevluate the safety position for this team.

I'm not sold on the fact that Kubiak and Co. fell the need for one safety to be the designated in the box guy and the other to be the centerfielder type. I think they are looking for a pair of safeties capable of playing both roles equally well.

Now is this the right idea? I have no idea, but from looking over the past signings and draftings of safeties I'm starting to think that we the fans do not have the good of a grasp on what the coaches want from the SS and the FS.
Interesting theory and reason number 459 why I love this board: Intelligent people with intelligent thought processes.
 

RipTraxx

Free Agent
Up to last year, our safety play has been relatively poor, especially the free safety play. There has not seemed to have been a priority to fixing that position ( we had so many other holes ). But if you look at how Smithiak is approaching things, they're always looking for 2-fers............ie., versatility.
I see this as no exception, if they are out there to be gotten.
Anyone ever get the feeling that our D Coord. sucks?
 
Anyone ever get the feeling that our D Coord. sucks?
Apparently you do. What did that have to do with the post you quoted. This is not the first time you have popped a 1 liner in a tread like this. Sub par safety play thru the first part of last season and the previous 5 had alot more to do with talent level than it did the DC employed by this franchise.
 

Ole Miss Texan

Hall of Fame
I think we all need to reevluate the safety position for this team.

I'm not sold on the fact that Kubiak and Co. fell the need for one safety to be the designated in the box guy and the other to be the centerfielder type. I think they are looking for a pair of safeties capable of playing both roles equally well.

Now is this the right idea? I have no idea, but from looking over the past signings and draftings of safeties I'm starting to think that we the fans do not have the good of a grasp on what the coaches want from the SS and the FS.
I'll definitely agree with pretty much all of this-nice post. I'm still wanting a ballhawking FS that can either deflect the ball in the air or intercept it instead of what we have now, but am slowly realizing that's not going to happen. Demps, imo has been a big improvement. I constantly saw him get to the WR as the guy was catching the ball. It'd be a catch if Demps didn't hit him... but i'm still wanting a guy that can get there before the WR even touches it- outlook is doubtful.

I was big on LaRon Landry last year over Reggie Nelson for the fact Landry was excellent in run support and tackling, where I was not fond of Nelson. This is when I thought the staff really valued the tackling issue over pure ballskills- in both safety and corner play. Moot point since Landry was selected before us and we got Amobi :) This is also why I think Mike Jenkins would not be a good fit for our team- he's one of the worst tackling CB's in the draft (or at least of the 1st round talent).

I also think that the coaching staff doesn't place a lot of value in the safety play. By that I mean investing a high draft pick in one. I think Phillips actually fits into what this staff likes in a safety. I think Phillips would probably have better cover skills than most on our team. Supposedly he's suited more for SS on most teams but for a team like ours he could be on the field because of the guys we're trying to go for. I'm not trying to say I want Phillips to be the pick at #18, but just saying he ties more into the kind of safety we're actually looking for than a pure cover safety, imo.
 

Goldensilence

hipster elite
So did I. Same with Hutchins which is why i wondered why they let him go. But Rick knows what he's doin....
I think guys like Simmons and Hutchins are nice for a building team; far as versatility is concerned.

Moving forward I expect to see less of guys like that around.
 
P

Polo

Guest
Maybe I understood wrong, but I disagree with our defensive scheme being built around our safeties being interchangeable...

Maybe the type of guys they want in those positions is not what most fans envision, but I think our FS and SS have defined roles...

Anything less would be uncivilized.
 

AcresHomesTexan

No Longer Arlington: Escaped From Jerry's World
Staff member
Maybe I understood wrong, but I disagree with our defensive scheme being built around our safeties being interchangeable...

Maybe the type of guys they want in those positions is not what most fans envision, but I think our FS and SS have defined roles...

Anything less would be uncivilized.
From everything I understand, they are probably closer to left saftey and right saftey than true SS and FS. That said, offense line-up string to the defenses left side more than its right, our LS will have more SS characteristics than FS. I would have to see coaches tape or concentrate at a live game in order to confirm that the Texans don't do much flipping side with the safeties.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Maybe I understood wrong, but I disagree with our defensive scheme being built around our safeties being interchangeable...

Maybe the type of guys they want in those positions is not what most fans envision, but I think our FS and SS have defined roles...

Anything less would be uncivilized.
You might want to look at the guys who are on team for those two positions.
 
P

Polo

Guest
You might want to look at the guys who are on team for those two positions.
What does that have to do with their roles ? They could have Travis Johnson back there, but that wouldn't mean that the responsibilities of the position have changed...
 

infantrycak

Hall of Fame
What does that have to do with their roles ? They could have Travis Johnson back there, but that wouldn't mean that the responsibilities of the position have changed...
The difference in a LS and RS system (such as the system Harrison came from at Stanford) is they stay on one side of the field and are expected to play either traditional or SS or FS role on their assigned side of the field depending on how the O lines up instead of flipping sides with the O to keep the SS on the strong side.
 
P

Polo

Guest
From everything I understand, they are probably closer to left saftey and right saftey than true SS and FS. That said, offense line-up string to the defenses left side more than its right, our LS will have more SS characteristics than FS. I would have to see coaches tape or concentrate at a live game in order to confirm that the Texans don't do much flipping side with the safeties.

I don't recall too many times CC and demps were in the game together where CC was actually the deep man while Demps came up into the box to play off the TE...

That'd be pretty nutty IMHO...Seems like it'd cause a little confusion on our end not to mention it make it hella-easy for teams to exploit mis-matches...
 

infantrycak

Hall of Fame
That'd be pretty nutty IMHO...Seems like it'd cause a little confusion on our end not to mention it make it hella-easy for teams to exploit mis-matches...
Fans say this every year about playing LCB and RCB instead of playing #1 CB on #1 WR, etc. Teams don't always agree with what fans consider nutty or easy to exploit.
 
P

Polo

Guest
The difference in a LS and RS system (such as the system Harrison came from at Stanford) is they stay on one side of the field and are expected to play either traditional or SS or FS role on their assigned side of the field depending on how the O lines up instead of flipping sides with the O to keep the SS on the strong side.
I understand that...

That makes sense...@least for college and highschool....

But what does the personnel (that the Texans prefer) have to do with the actual responsibilities of the positions? How can you look at "who" is back there and make a determination about responsibilities and roles ?
 

HJam72

Hall of Fame
If that's how it's going to be, I'd like to see our "hybrid" safeties be a little more like FSs than they have in the past. Hard hits and good run support are fine, but I don't like watching safeties chase WRs from behind.

Just my :twocents:
 
P

Polo

Guest
Fans say this every year about playing LCB and RCB instead of playing #1 CB on #1 WR, etc. Teams don't always agree with what fans consider nutty or easy to exploit.
That's why I said IMO..

But SS and FS have two vastly different roles, vs a LCB and RCB...

You don't want a FS (normally a cover guy) playing down in the box all game and you don't want your SS (normally an in the box guy) playing deep all game because of how the offense is lining up...

LCB vs RCB is not really that big of a difference in the responsibilities...both are primarily going to be covereing recievers all game...

I'd prefer to have a corner capable of following a #1, but maybe the Texans just don't feel we have those kind of guys on our roster....Dunta's good, but he's not what I'd consider to be an elite cover guy...
 

infantrycak

Hall of Fame
But what does the personnel (that the Texans prefer) have to do with the actual responsibilities of the positions? How can you look at "who" is back there and make a determination about responsibilities and roles ?
Well at least to some degree you can look at the skill sets. Some safeties excel in the box but suck in coverage. You don't see the Texans pursuing those guys so far (caveat here--I am not totally convinced this is their ultimate goal so much as dealing with the personnel they have). At the other end is the almost CB FS who can't hold up in run support. Instead, the Texans keep getting guys with better coverage skills than most SS but not as good as most FS but who can play run support as well.
 
P

Polo

Guest
Well at least to some degree you can look at the skill sets. Some safeties excel in the box but suck in coverage. You don't see the Texans pursuing those guys so far (caveat here--I am not totally convinced this is their ultimate goal so much as dealing with the personnel they have). At the other end is the almost CB FS who can't hold up in run support. Instead, the Texans keep getting guys with better coverage skills than most SS but not as good as most FS but who can play run support as well.
The same thing can be said for most of the players they aquire...

It's no secret that they like guys who can play multiple roles...Especially...O-line and defensive players...

But what does their choice in personnel have to do with actual player roles within the scheme ?

This same logic could be applied to the O-line...They like guys who can play different positions...ok...

That doesn't mean that on one play our LT is going to play RG and then go back to playing LT the next....it just means that "IF" something happens they like to have guys that can switch around...
 

AcresHomesTexan

No Longer Arlington: Escaped From Jerry's World
Staff member
I don't recall too many times CC and demps were in the game together where CC was actually the deep man while Demps came up into the box to play off the TE...

That'd be pretty nutty IMHO...Seems like it'd cause a little confusion on our end not to mention it make it hella-easy for teams to exploit mis-matches...
Teams that don't flip the safeties are trying minimize having offenses exploit the guy in the box who can't cover and the range guys who can't hit. by having players who in theory do both well enough, a team is supposed to tip its hand less not more.

Someone who sees games live more can confirm (televsion angles are horrible for safety play), but the texans SS does not play often in the box either...i.e. both safeties play somewhat deep. Hince why the Texans have (and target) guys with the similiar skill sets who are pretty interchangeable.
 

AcresHomesTexan

No Longer Arlington: Escaped From Jerry's World
Staff member
The same thing can be said for most of the players they aquire...

It's no secret that they like guys who can play multiple roles...Especially...O-line and defensive players...

But what does their choice in personnel have to do with actual player roles within the scheme ?
This same logic could be applied to the O-line...They like guys who can play different positions...ok...

That doesn't mean that on one play our LT is going to play RG and then go back to playing LT the next....it just means that "IF" something happens they like to have guys that can switch around...
Choice of personnel and how they are used in the scheme have everything to do with each other. Overall, what we are saying is that the Texans don't use SS and FS in the stereotypical way in which you are trying apply the terms.
 
P

Polo

Guest
Teams that don't flip the safeties are trying minimize having offenses exploit the guy in the box who can't cover and the range guys who can't hit. by having players who in theory do both well enough, a team is supposed to tip its hand less not more.

Someone who sees games live more can confirm (televsion angles are horrible for safety play), but the texans SS does not play often in the box either...i.e. both safeties play somewhat deep. Hince why the Texans have (and target) guys with the similiar skill sets who are pretty interchangeable.
I understand what everyone is saying about the personnel...

The Texans like guys who can play diff. postions and minimize the chances of explotation...

My point is: That doesn't neccessarily mean that our safeties are actually switching roles during a game.

Someone who sees games live more can confirm (televsion angles are horrible for safety play), but the texans SS does not play often in the box either
I tend to see Demps back deep more, and I tend to see CC up in run support more...But I do agree that watching the games live is the best way to tell
 
P

Polo

Guest
Choice of personnel and how they are used in the scheme have everything to do with each other.
Ok, and that's where we disagree...

Overall, what we are saying is that the Texans don't use SS and FS in the stereotypical way in which you are trying apply the terms.
Personally I think they do, but that's a pretty bold statement to make seeing that you just said the only way to tell would be to actually study the scheme...


Also, This is the same organization that has two LDE's on the field IMHO...They wised up towards the end of the year when they started moving Mario over in passing situations...

What can you tell me about their D-Line scheme based on what they put out there ?

IMHO, nothing...Seems like they kinda feel things out as they go...as they should..

My whole point is that you cannot look at the personnel and make determinations about the kind of scheme we're playing...
 
P

Polo

Guest
Another example: Travis Johnson and Amobi

Are you guys telling me that because we have two DT's of the same skill set on the field that these guys are switching between who's playing the 1-gap and whose playing the 3-gap ?

If so I disagree again.
 

AcresHomesTexan

No Longer Arlington: Escaped From Jerry's World
Staff member
Ok, and that's where we disagree...



Personally I think they do, but that's a pretty bold statement to make seeing that you just said the only way to tell would be to actually study the scheme...


Also, This is the same organization that has two LDE's on the field IMHO...They wised up towards the end of the year when they started moving Mario over in passing situations...

What can you tell me about their D-Line scheme based on what they put out there ?

IMHO, nothing...Seems like they kinda feel things out as they go...as they should..

My whole point is that you cannot look at the personnel and make determinations about the kind of scheme we're playing...
I am not just making these determiniation blindly on personnel. There have been quotes from the team and coaching staff that claim that the responsibilites are similar. I want to say this was discussed heavily around time earl and simmons getting hurt last year.
 
P

Polo

Guest
I am not just making these determiniation blindly on personnel. There have been quotes from the team and coaching staff that claim that the responsibilites are similar. I want to say this was discussed heavily around time earl and simmons getting hurt last year.
Really...That's strange cuz I don't remember that...

But I'm not even disagreeing with you guys...really I'm not...

I'm just expressing my opinion that the choice of personnel doesn't mean our guys don't have defined roles thus they are somewhat interchanging during the game...I disagree with that assertion...that's all...
 

The Pencil Neck

Hall of Fame
Personally I think they do, but that's a pretty bold statement to make seeing that you just said the only way to tell would be to actually study the scheme...
Well, it's not a bold statement since the coaches have been saying this for the past couple of years. One of the Brandons we drafted last year even said that he had been in a similar system in Stanford (two interchangeable safeties) and that was why he expected to fit in quickly even though he had to miss a lot of the training camp because of Stanford's late graduation date.
 

The Pencil Neck

Hall of Fame
I am not just making these determiniation blindly on personnel. There have been quotes from the team and coaching staff that claim that the responsibilites are similar. I want to say this was discussed heavily around time earl and simmons getting hurt last year.

Oops. I posted a response before I saw yours.
 
P

Polo

Guest
Well, it's not a bold statement since the coaches have been saying this for the past couple of years. One of the Brandons we drafted last year even said that he had been in a similar system in Stanford (two interchangeable safeties) and that was why he expected to fit in quickly even though he had to miss a lot of the training camp because of Stanford's late graduation date.

????

Keep up, yo'....

A guy being able to play multiple positions has what to do with the scheme the Texans use ?
 
P

Polo

Guest
Seriously, I've yet to see something from the Texans saying that our safeties are switching roles during the game....

I'm not saying that they don't...

I just haven't seen it and I really don't have a reason to believe it...
 

infantrycak

Hall of Fame
The same thing can be said for most of the players they aquire...

It's no secret that they like guys who can play multiple roles...Especially...O-line and defensive players...

But what does their choice in personnel have to do with actual player roles within the scheme ?

This same logic could be applied to the O-line...They like guys who can play different positions...ok...
The two scenarios are not analogous. Traditionally, the SS could be weaker in pass protection because he was going to consistently float to the side the O picked as the strong side for that play. The Texans have not been having their safeties switch sides. That means if they swap the strong side to Demps side of the field, he now has to take on more of the traditional SS responsibilities. In short hand, there are two safeties on the field who depending on how the O lines up shift the emphasis of their responsibilities instead of shifting their side of the field and maintaining the same responsibilities in order to always have the same responsibilities. That isn't anything like saying, well if Dunta or CC Brown went down, we could have Simmons come in for either.
 

Lucky

Ride, Captain, Ride!
Staff member
Ferguson was a pretty good safety for the Broncos, a couple of years ago. Not so good, recently. I think fans tend to think that just because a player is signed, he's a lock to make the team. I don't think that's the case here.
 

b0ng

Bad Hombre
Ferguson was a pretty good safety for the Broncos, a couple of years ago. Not so good, recently. I think fans tend to think that just because a player is signed, he's a lock to make the team. I don't think that's the case here.
It feels like when we signed Keenan McCardell last off season. He's going to push the other safeties during camp and probably get cut.

Also, Polo, the Texans are probably designing their scheme to fit the players. So pretty much, the players, their skill sets and traits are what make up the Texans schemes. This is why most people are trying to tell you that the Texans are running a 2 safety scheme rather than a FS/SS scheme.
 

Ole Miss Texan

Hall of Fame
It feels like when we signed Keenan McCardell last off season. He's going to push the other safeties during camp and probably get cut.
I think that's a perfect analogy!

You never know when a player is going to stick that you weren't really expecting (Andre Davis)... but for every Davis there are 10 McCardells. I think bringing Ferguson (McCardell) in only helps our competition but I don't see him making any sort of big impact when all's said and done.
 

Rex King

Waterboy
The two scenarios are not analogous. Traditionally, the SS could be weaker in pass protection because he was going to consistently float to the side the O picked as the strong side for that play. The Texans have not been having their safeties switch sides. That means if they swap the strong side to Demps side of the field, he now has to take on more of the traditional SS responsibilities. In short hand, there are two safeties on the field who depending on how the O lines up shift the emphasis of their responsibilities instead of shifting their side of the field and maintaining the same responsibilities in order to always have the same responsibilities. That isn't anything like saying, well if Dunta or CC Brown went down, we could have Simmons come in for either.
None of this contradicts what Polo is saying he is seeing (and what I saw) - that when Demps was playing FS, he was more often deeper than CC. However, I think I remember Demps making a couple plays in the run game on the left side (o-line's right). I'd have to go back to see where he lined up to start the play.
 
Top