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Old 03-11-2008   #61
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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Originally Posted by Porky View Post
If Shcaub goes down with a career injury, we are looking for a QB either way. I realize that. But, if you trade Sage away, you are either looking at starting a rookie QB or a true journeyman veteran. Niether scenerio is conducive to winning. Do we want to yet again go through the proverbial rebuuilding program? Sage may not be an elite QB as a starter, but you can win with him if you have some pieces around him which we do. He is better than Trent Dilfer, who won a SB with a dominant defense.
sage was the definition of a journeyman qb when he came here and look at what kubiak did for him and how he improved.. compare how david looked in his last yr with kubiak (bad but looked like an nfl backup qb) to how he looked at carolina (pop warner level).. face it gary can make most qbs play at their optimum level imo

and if we trade sage, i think we can go out and get a rookie or especially a harrington-type qb and they'll do a job if necessary
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Old 03-11-2008   #62
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

Sage has gotten better in Houston and if we can get a low 2nd rounder or a 3rd round pick for a career backup I say do it in a heartbeat and we can take that pick and get a player of need. Lets move this guy before we can't nothing for him there are other NFL QB's that they can do the same as the texans did with Sage or we can draft a young signal caller in the 4th or 5th round.
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Old 03-11-2008   #63
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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Originally Posted by PHAROAH View Post
Sage has gotten better in Houston and if we can get a low 2nd rounder or a 3rd round pick for a career backup I say do it in a heartbeat and we can take that pick and get a player of need. Lets move this guy before we can't nothing for him there are other NFL QB's that they can do the same as the texans did with Sage or we can draft a young signal caller in the 4th or 5th round.
Who are the "other NFL QBs"? I am not oppopsed for taking a 2nd for Sage and then drafting Colt Brennan in 4th but if that is done we have to risk Schaub being replaced by a rookie or sign a vet and I don't see many left.
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Old 03-11-2008   #64
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush Grasshopper.
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Old 03-11-2008   #65
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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Originally Posted by Porky View Post
A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush Grasshopper.
Bird in hand can lead to poop on toes.
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Old 03-11-2008   #66
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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Originally Posted by Maddict5 View Post
sage was the definition of a journeyman qb when he came here and look at what kubiak did for him and how he improved.. compare how david looked in his last yr with kubiak (bad but looked like an nfl backup qb) to how he looked at carolina (pop warner level).. face it gary can make most qbs play at their optimum level imo

and if we trade sage, i think we can go out and get a rookie or especially a harrington-type qb and they'll do a job if necessary
I'm not sure where I stand in this...except liking the idea of picks....and I realize Sage is insurance but you hit the nail on the head with the bolded comments. I mean people are acting like after 8 season in that Sage is this just stud we stumbled upon. I think coaching and system made him a little more than what we thought coming in. I'd trust them to be able to do it again if needed. But he does know the system now.
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Old 03-11-2008   #67
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

Guys, I just keep coming back to these things in my mind when the possibility of trading our backup QB comes up.

Rick Smith can find players. He's in his second season and we've talked almost endlessly about how he can find a player when the Texans need one.

Gary Kubiak can coach up a QB. He coached David Carr up to the level of "almost adequat" and that's saying a lot for that guy. He brought in Sage Rosenfels who was (already been mentioned) the definition of "average journeyman backup" and now people are inquiring about his availablity in a trade. Basically he's gone from an almost under-the-radar free agent signing to being a player with value in very little time.

Last year we traded Babin for Boulware and at that time both Smith and Kubiak explained that we had an area of the team we were deep at and we sacrificed some of that depth to shore up another area where we needed help. We have other areas of the team that need help, obviously.

When you have a backup QB who is capable of starting and other teams know it then you're going to lose him eventually unless you start him.

I just think they'll move him sometime between now and the draft. It just feels to me like the situation is perfect for a trade.
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Old 03-11-2008   #68
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

No They Don't!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They Don't Want To Trade Chester For Sage, So Lock Up This Frickin Thread

I Can't Take Opening This Page Everyday And Falling For It Again!! I'm Not At My Best In The Morning!
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Old 03-11-2008   #69
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
Guys, I just keep coming back to these things in my mind when the possibility of trading our backup QB comes up.

Rick Smith can find players. He's in his second season and we've talked almost endlessly about how he can find a player when the Texans need one.

Gary Kubiak can coach up a QB. He coached David Carr up to the level of "almost adequat" and that's saying a lot for that guy. He brought in Sage Rosenfels who was (already been mentioned) the definition of "average journeyman backup" and now people are inquiring about his availablity in a trade. Basically he's gone from an almost under-the-radar free agent signing to being a player with value in very little time.

Last year we traded Babin for Boulware and at that time both Smith and Kubiak explained that we had an area of the team we were deep at and we sacrificed some of that depth to shore up another area where we needed help. We have other areas of the team that need help, obviously.

When you have a backup QB who is capable of starting and other teams know it then you're going to lose him eventually unless you start him.

I just think they'll move him sometime between now and the draft. It just feels to me like the situation is perfect for a trade.
I agree with most of your view but when you have only two players where is the depth?
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Old 03-11-2008   #70
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
Guys, I just keep coming back to these things in my mind when the possibility of trading our backup QB comes up.

Rick Smith can find players. He's in his second season and we've talked almost endlessly about how he can find a player when the Texans need one.

Gary Kubiak can coach up a QB. He coached David Carr up to the level of "almost adequat" and that's saying a lot for that guy. He brought in Sage Rosenfels who was (already been mentioned) the definition of "average journeyman backup" and now people are inquiring about his availablity in a trade. Basically he's gone from an almost under-the-radar free agent signing to being a player with value in very little time.

Last year we traded Babin for Boulware and at that time both Smith and Kubiak explained that we had an area of the team we were deep at and we sacrificed some of that depth to shore up another area where we needed help. We have other areas of the team that need help, obviously.

When you have a backup QB who is capable of starting and other teams know it then you're going to lose him eventually unless you start him.

I just think they'll move him sometime between now and the draft. It just feels to me like the situation is perfect for a trade.
Almost my feelings exactly
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Old 03-11-2008   #71
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

I see a lot of revionsist history here. David Carr was absouloute dogcrap in 2006, except he stunk a whole lot worse. End of story. To say he was ok doesn't pass the smell test. That dog won't hunt so let's not even go there.

As for Sage, he fits the system to a tee. Why do you think Kubes recruited him in the first place? You cannot just coach up any QB and expect the same results. This isn't instant pudding. You don't open a box, add some milk and violet' instant QB. I don't get this passion for getting rid of Sage for a box of crackerjacks and a slinky. In Sage you have a very capable backup who, oh by the way, happens to fit the system the coach wants to run perfectly. He might not look good in another offense, who knows. But we know he fits wells here. In addition, you either get in trade what - an ok RB in the mold of a Dominick Davis or whatever name he goes by this week, or a draft choice which is sort of like being blindfolded and asked to go pick out the prettiest girl in the room. It's a total crapshoot.

And mark my words if this comes to fruition, the very same people wanting to trade Sage for next to nothing will be the same ones bitching and moaning when we have poor QB play if Schaub goes down. Nope, until Matt proves that he can last a year without getting nicked I am not interested in the least by these offers. Now, 2 #2 draft picks of course. But, I am of the mind that yes a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
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Old 03-11-2008   #72
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

Quote:
Originally Posted by Porky View Post
I see a lot of revionsist history here. David Carr was absouloute dogcrap in 2006, except he stunk a whole lot worse. End of story. To say he was ok doesn't pass the smell test. That dog won't hunt so let's not even go there.

As for Sage, he fits the system to a tee. Why do you think Kubes recruited him in the first place? You cannot just coach up any QB and expect the same results. This isn't instant pudding. You don't open a box, add some milk and violet' instant QB. I don't get this passion for getting rid of Sage for a box of crackerjacks and a slinky. In Sage you have a very capable backup who, oh by the way, happens to fit the system the coach wants to run perfectly. He might not look good in another offense, who knows. But we know he fits wells here. In addition, you either get in trade what - an ok RB in the mold of a Dominick Davis or whatever name he goes by this week, or a draft choice which is sort of like being blindfolded and asked to go pick out the prettiest girl in the room. It's a total crapshoot.

And mark my words if this comes to fruition, the very same people wanting to trade Sage for next to nothing will be the same ones bitching and moaning when we have poor QB play if Schaub goes down. Nope, until Matt proves that he can last a year without getting nicked I am not interested in the least by these offers. Now, 2 #2 draft picks of course. But, I am of the mind that yes a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
Well, as I said above, I'm torn but at the same time you are on a far spectrum regarding this. They thought Sage fit the system but there was no guarantee. The guy had been a journeyman. If you trust his taste in Sage then they might have Sage II eyed before they make this move. I think many of us still live in the Casserly world of "WTF is going to happen now." In reality, its all trust. I'm not saying I'd do THIS deal but I'd do a deal if the price is right...2nd rounder or such. Different thing all togther but there were some that thought the Rockets screwed up trading Bonzi Wells and now people act like the guy never existed. There is risk/reward in every thing you do.

I said last week or the week before that this is a year where it is make or break. No 8-8 pillow to lay or heads on. If Schaub goes down I think there is going to be alot of problems to start. Without planning that I'd like to think they are putting the best team they can out there and think that a pick or a certain player might put us over the top. I also don't think people believe Carr was good. They just saw that the team could revert to grind it out play with the right back and win.
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Old 03-11-2008   #73
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

Sage is nothing more than another A.J. Feely do you guys remember him? He started like six games while Donovan Mcnabb was hurt and the Miami Dolphins gave up 2nd round pick for him and he was a complete bust for the dolphins. I say hurry up grab a a 2nd or 3rd round pick for Sage because he didn't do much in Miami or Washington. Sage has only started 7 games since he has been in the NFL for 7 seasons so I would gladly take a 3rd round pick for him look at the stats they don't lie.


Career Statistics
Year Team G GS att cmp pct yds avg lg td rtg
2001 WAS 0 0 0 0 0.0 0 0.0 0 0 0.0
2002 MIA 4 0 3 0 0.0 0 0.0 0 0 2.1
2003 MIA 2 0 6 4 66.7 50 12.5 21 1 131.9
2004 MIA 3 1 39 16 41.0 264 16.5 76 1 41.0
2005 MIA 4 1 61 34 55.7 462 13.6 77 4 81.5
2006 HOU 3 0 39 27 69.2 265 9.8 28 3 103.0
2007 HOU 10 5 240 154 64.2 1684 10.9 53 15 84.8
Totals 26 7 388 235 60.6 2,725 11.6 77 24 82.0
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Old 03-11-2008   #74
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

Quote:
Originally Posted by Porky View Post
I see a lot of revionsist history here. David Carr was absouloute dogcrap in 2006, except he stunk a whole lot worse. End of story. To say he was ok doesn't pass the smell test. That dog won't hunt so let's not even go there.

As for Sage, he fits the system to a tee. Why do you think Kubes recruited him in the first place? You cannot just coach up any QB and expect the same results. This isn't instant pudding. You don't open a box, add some milk and violet' instant QB. I don't get this passion for getting rid of Sage for a box of crackerjacks and a slinky. In Sage you have a very capable backup who, oh by the way, happens to fit the system the coach wants to run perfectly. He might not look good in another offense, who knows. But we know he fits wells here. In addition, you either get in trade what - an ok RB in the mold of a Dominick Davis or whatever name he goes by this week, or a draft choice which is sort of like being blindfolded and asked to go pick out the prettiest girl in the room. It's a total crapshoot.

And mark my words if this comes to fruition, the very same people wanting to trade Sage for next to nothing will be the same ones bitching and moaning when we have poor QB play if Schaub goes down. Nope, until Matt proves that he can last a year without getting nicked I am not interested in the least by these offers. Now, 2 #2 draft picks of course. But, I am of the mind that yes a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
lol i said carr was 'bad but looked like nfl backup'material.. herv said 'nearly adequate'..neither is 'ok'

how does sage 'fit the system to a tee' more than other possible qb's we could get? like i said, i believe the system is a good system that brings out the best in most qb's

all we're saying is look at the history of this staff instead of your fear theory of 'WHEN schaub goes down, the new backup WILL play crap'...

based on this staff's history, you can say:
- whoever the qb is, they'll play almost at their optimum level within the system, whatever that optimum is (carr, sage, schaub)
- our staff has shown an innate ability to hit on nearly all their draft picks.. which is why it isnt a 'shot in the dark' like with other staff's especially if we manage to land a 2nd
- our staff have shown a good ability to find serviceable street FA's.. and i believe gary will find a suitable backup qb if he has to

look you probably wont change your opinion and i understand why.. but you can see the benefits of a potential trade too
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Old 03-11-2008   #75
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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I agree with most of your view but when you have only two players where is the depth?
As of March 6th QBs available:

Quinn Gray
Marques Tuiasosopo(If the Sage trade goes through this is whom i would target)
Brian St. Pierre
Jamie Martin
Jared Lorenzen
Mark Brunell
I believe Gus Ferrotte is a FA as well.
I thought I Saw that after April Jake Plummer's rights are free again.


Sage reminds me of Jon Kitna. Journeyman QB who can do okay but i wouldn't expect better then an 8-8 season from him.
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Old 03-11-2008   #76
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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Originally Posted by Goldensilence View Post
As of March 6th QBs available:

Quinn Gray
Marques Tuiasosopo(If the Sage trade goes through this is whom i would target)
Brian St. Pierre
Jamie Martin
Jared Lorenzen
Mark Brunell
I believe Gus Ferrotte is a FA as well.
I thought I Saw that after April Jake Plummer's rights are free again.


Sage reminds me of Jon Kitna. Journeyman QB who can do okay but i wouldn't expect better then an 8-8 season from him.
joey harrington too.. the falcons got some decent games out of him as we can attest to
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Old 03-11-2008   #77
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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Originally Posted by Goldensilence View Post
As of March 6th QBs available:

Quinn Gray
Marques Tuiasosopo(If the Sage trade goes through this is whom i would target)
Brian St. Pierre
Jamie Martin
Jared Lorenzen
Mark Brunell
I believe Gus Ferrotte is a FA as well.
I thought I Saw that after April Jake Plummer's rights are free again.


Sage reminds me of Jon Kitna. Journeyman QB who can do okay but i wouldn't expect better then an 8-8 season from him.
Many thanks. I've never heard of most of these. It would be nice to know if Texans make a trade the day of draft that we have options.
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Last edited by badboy; 03-12-2008 at 09:15 AM. Reason: spelling
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Old 03-11-2008   #78
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

I like the hefty lefty Jared Lorenzen & Quinn Gray they both have just as much potential as Sage Rosenfels so I say trade in a heartbeat if we can get 3rd round pick I say do it like yesterday and if we can steal a 2nd rounder that is absolute robbery. We did the same thing with Drew Henson a few years ago with Dallas absolutly stealing candy from a baby.
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Old 03-11-2008   #79
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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Originally Posted by Goldensilence View Post
As of March 6th QBs available:

Quinn Gray
Marques Tuiasosopo(If the Sage trade goes through this is whom i would target)
Brian St. Pierre
Jamie Martin
Jared Lorenzen
Mark Brunell
I believe Gus Ferrotte is a FA as well.
I thought I Saw that after April Jake Plummer's rights are free again.


Sage reminds me of Jon Kitna. Journeyman QB who can do okay but i wouldn't expect better then an 8-8 season from him.
I wouldn't take any of those above Sage myself.
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Old 03-11-2008   #80
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Default Re: Vikings want to trade for Rosenfels..............

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I wouldn't take any of those above Sage myself.
Porky we all like Sage but he can help us fill a need in this draft and there are couple of players on that list with coaching can be just as good as a backup. Quinn Gray and jared Lorenzen have both played in backup situations and they were solid.
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