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Old 03-05-2008   #1
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Default Gibbs Talk

Well i need to say this please don't be offended , Gibbs will be a consultant right , he is not the offensive coordinator . There does seem to be alot of people giving him the ball so to speak but not giving the kidd shanahan his just due . The question here has to be is gibbs going to be calling the shots or is Shanahan ? Personally i hope that the kid is given enough rope to mold an offense that he can be proud of and call his own . Now with that in mind does anyone have a sense of what that offense might be like ?
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Old 03-05-2008   #2
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

Neither has final say - Kubiak does. I really think Kyle is the OC in title and salary only, so they wouldn't lose him to another team. I'm sure he'll have tons of input as he should - but Kubiak is going to always have veto power on play-calling.

Gibbs is apparently a genius when it comes to talent and personnel evaluation - at least in the framework of what works in his system.

As far as what our offense will be like, well, there's going to be a heck of a lot of running and play action, just like last year. I'm pretty excited about it when you consider the incredible rushing numbers that past Gibbs offenses have put up.
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Old 03-05-2008   #3
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by DiehardChris View Post
Neither has final say - Kubiak does. I really think Kyle is the OC in title and salary only, so they wouldn't lose him to another team. I'm sure he'll have tons of input as he should - but Kubiak is going to always have veto power on play-calling.

Gibbs is apparently a genius when it comes to talent and personnel evaluation - at least in the framework of what works in his system.

As far as what our offense will be like, well, there's going to be a heck of a lot of running and play action, just like last year. I'm pretty excited about it when you consider the incredible rushing numbers that past Gibbs offenses have put up.
I believe that this kid will run this offense and Gibbs is there more for Kubiaks benefit than Kyles . If Kubiak does not have someone to enforce discipline so he dont get his hands dirty he could lose the trust of the team . Thats my view right or wrong .
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Old 03-05-2008   #4
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

At the website, he's listed as "Assistant head coach/offense" and #2 man on the coaching list if the list order means anything..

Perhaps if Kubes became ill or something, he would be the interim head coach.... I would think he would be a mentor to Shanahan and another vote in the offensive decisions...
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Old 03-05-2008   #5
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

I think Kubiak already has a reputation for being kind of a disciplinarian... not on the level of some of the more famous ones, but he's not soft by any means. Gibbs is there purely to install his famous system, help out with the offense, and to help select players for that system. I'm sure you're right about Kyle - I'm not saying he's a puppet or anything - I just think Kubiak is giong to do most of the play-calling, while letting out the reins for Kyle once in a while as well.
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Old 03-05-2008   #6
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by DiehardChris View Post
As far as what our offense will be like, well, there's going to be a heck of a lot of running and play action, just like last year. I'm pretty excited about it when you consider the incredible rushing numbers that past Gibbs offenses have put up.
No doubt. I'm looking forward to it, as well.
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Old 03-05-2008   #7
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

Myself, I'm just wondering how much Gibbs is going to "shakeup" the O-line and if we will "stumble out of the blocks" for the 1st few games until the O-line and RB's get adjusted? Or, will it be a smooth transition with everybody on the same page?
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Old 03-05-2008   #8
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by DiehardChris View Post
Gibbs is there purely to install his famous system, help out with the offense, and to help select players for that system.

I just think Kubiak is giong to do most of the play-calling, while letting out the reins for Kyle once in a while as well.
This is exactly how I see it. I don't see Gibbs as an OC because I don't see him doing any playcalling but more or less evaluating the talent and coaching the Offense (particulaly OL, RB)

I see Kubiak as predominantly calling the plays but that he is going to let Shannihan really give his fare share of duties. I don't think are are babying him at all. Shanny should be calling a lot of plays and has to an extent in the past if im not mistaken, but Kubiak will have final say.

I think Kubes and Shanny will be on the same page a lot, so Shanny will call a play and Kubes will say.. yea i like it (cuz he was thinking the same thing) but occasionally will say, meh lets try this...
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Old 03-05-2008   #9
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

Kubiak calls all the plays--he's hooked into Schaub/Rosenfel's ear all game calling all the shots. My feeling is Kyle will be in charge of spotting tendencies in the D such as zone/man and run/pass looks from the defense and letting Kubiak know what looks opened and closed. Kyle will be in the booth. I've heard two different stories on where Gibbs will be, whether in the booth or on the sideline chewing out the line when were on defense. My guess is he'll be on the sideline.
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Old 03-05-2008   #10
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

I'd be a little bit surprised if the Texans expect Gibbs to be here more than a couple of years - three at the outside.

If you read what Kubiak said at the time Gibbs was hired, he referred back to when he was made OC of the Bronco's at a relatively young age (not nearly as young as Shanny Jr., but pretty soon after his playing days), and Gibbs basically became his mentor, and taught him how to do his job. I think that Gibbs' role with the Texans will be very similar, and he'll be helping Kyle learn how to be an offensive coordinator in the NFL.

Hopefully, he'll do his job well, and the Texans will be able to take advantage of Kyle's knowledge for several years after he leaves. I know there's some folks (led by John McClain) who believe that Shanny Sr.'s keeping the HC seat in Denver warm until he can hand it over to his son. I've got to think that both the Bronco's and Shanny Sr. realize that at 28 years old, Kyle's still a few years away from being ready for that.

I honestly think Gibbs was brought in to transition both the Offense and the Offensive Coordinator to a higher level, and while Kubiak could probably do that, another viewpoint, another mentor, and another highly intelligent football mind isn't a bad thing. It also frees Kubes up to do the types of things only a Head Coach can do (whatever those are).
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Old 03-05-2008   #11
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by Arky View Post
At the website, he's listed as "Assistant head coach/offense" and #2 man on the coaching list if the list order means anything..

Perhaps if Kubes became ill or something, he would be the interim head coach.... I would think he would be a mentor to Shanahan and another vote in the offensive decisions...
Emphasis mine, opinion follows.

Gibbs has been brought in to mold the offensive line into a unit that can run the ball the way Gary Kubiak is accustomed to running the ball, i.e. a Denver-esq zone blocking based running game. Gibbs is also here to be a mentor to Shanahan just as he was a mentor to Gary Kubiak previously.

When Gibbs chooses to kick back and retire he'll do so with Kubiak knowing that little Shanahan has been taught how to be an offense coordinator the same way Gary was. They will absolutely be on the same page.

I don't doubt for an instant that Mike Sherman and Gary Kubiak are friends and respect each other. I am certain that they both know that their Denver-Packers-Power-Zone-Running-Attack was a failure. They probably didn't expect much out of it to begin with (much conjecture on my part here). It kind of fit what we had in the way of offensive linemen when they got here. I don't think it was ever meant to be permanent.
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Old 03-05-2008   #12
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

Gibbs will not be calling plays--he will coach the players on execution and possibly consult on the running playbook. On game day, Gibbs will have zero to do with the play calls and Shanny will make an initial call and radio it down to Kubiak who is looking at exactly the same play sheet and then Kubiak will call the play he wants into the QB. Most times that will be the one Shanny called, but Kubiak is the architect and final arbiter of this offense.
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Old 03-05-2008   #13
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

Due to NFL rule changes, the Gibbs System isn't what it was, but will certainly be more effective than the run blocking style we had last year.
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Old 03-05-2008   #14
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by The1ApplePie View Post
Due to NFL rule changes, the Gibbs System isn't what it was, but will certainly be more effective than the run blocking style we had last year.
What rule change would that be because cut blocking is still legal? They have debated changing it for years, but have not done so.
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Old 03-05-2008   #15
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
What rule change would that be because cut blocking is still legal? They have debated changing it for years, but have not done so.
I thought they put a new rule in last year to prevent the cheapshots Denver was using (ie holding a guy up, while another takes out his knee). Maybe it was just proposed.
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Old 03-05-2008   #16
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by The1ApplePie View Post
I thought they put a new rule in last year to prevent the cheapshots Denver was using (ie holding a guy up, while another takes out his knee). Maybe it was just proposed.
You can characterize Denver's blocks as you like, but that is not and never has been a regular part of their system. A chop block (from the side with helmet behind the player or from behind the player or while engaged with another linemen) has been illegal for a long time. A cut block (helmet to the front of the player) is legal and is the controversial hallmark of Gibbs' system.
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Old 03-05-2008   #17
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

I just watched a DVD of Alex Gibbs from a coaching clinic in May 2007 for offensive line coaches where his topic of discussion was the outside zone play. After watching the video, here are some things I came away with:

* Gibbs has his way of doing things and that is pretty much that. He believes the system that he coaches should stand alone and not be meshed with other systems because his system is based on timing and repetition and it requires plenty of practice.

* I don't believe Gibbs would have agreed to come out of retirement if he wasn't going to be allowed to implement what he believes will work for the Texans. He's coming in with a purpose and my guess is that purpose is to teach and implement his zone concepts and that extends to not just o-linemen but also RBs (how to approach the read and the initial decision) and WRs (in blocking).

* I now see why RBs are devalued in this system. He wants his RBs to make their decision by their 3rd total step (it takes 1.5 steps to get the ball on the handoff) and the decision in the wide zone is to bounce it outside or cut it back. To be a successful RB it takes burst, decisiveness and guts to hit back inside with authority. Making a good read is essential as well. It doesn't necessarily take an elite back to do these things. RBs who dance around (Morency) after taking the handoff won't fit into this scheme.

* If you are a WR and you aren't interested in getting after the safety on zone plays when it comes to blocking, then he won't be a fan of yours. And you don't want to be on his (bleep) list.

* If the RBs and the offensive linemen are not working in tandem, then this scheme will look very bad from time to time. In other words, RBs can make the linemen look bad if they don't make the proper reads.


Gibbs isn't going to be the offensive coordinator and he's not picking the players. I do, however, think he has the complete and total trust of Rick Smith and Gary Kubiak and I think that they will be more than happy to consult with him on which guys are good fits. More importantly, I think Kubiak basically went to "the master" to get him to install the system that he wants and get it going properly before he (Gibbs) bows out.
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Old 03-05-2008   #18
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
You can characterize Denver's blocks as you like, but that is not and never has been a regular part of their system. A chop block (from the side with helmet behind the player or from behind the player or while engaged with another linemen) has been illegal for a long time. A cut block (helmet to the front of the player) is legal and is the controversial hallmark of Gibbs' system.
The chop block is also a hallmark of Gibbs' system, especially in his time in Denver. They would hold a guy until the last possible second, then let him go and the other guy would crush his knee. So, basically, he found a way around the chop block rules, but the timing has to be right.

Maybe its Gibbs (but I never noticed in in Atlanta) or just individual players, but Denver guys to this day try to intentionally injure defenders.
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Old 03-05-2008   #19
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

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Originally Posted by LZ View Post
* If you are a WR and you aren't interested in getting after the safety on zone plays when it comes to blocking, then he won't be a fan of yours. And you don't want to be on his (bleep) list.
Thanks for sharing in total, but I was drawn to the WR bullet.

I trust Jacoby has the desire, but if there is one hang up I have on small school guys it is the small things which they were not called on to perform such as a WR finding and hitting a Safety.
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Old 03-05-2008   #20
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Default Re: Gibbs Talk

"Cut Blocks" are legal but there is still most certainly a stigma associated with them and I've even heard OLineman including a couple with the Texans talk about using the technique on opposing defensive players with obvious disdain.
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