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Old 02-19-2008   #41
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

How many games did Z Thomas actually play in last year?

Thought he was out the beginning of the year with a concussion from a car accident and out most of the second half of the season with another concussion from playing.

I sure don't want the Texans throwing $$$ after someone who is sitting on the bench (again).

This is not the old Zach Thomas from a couple of years ago, this is an older, more injured, slower - did I say more injured????
player that we don't ned to be signing, unless it is to coach the younger guys/
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Old 02-19-2008   #42
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by Grams View Post
How many games did Z Thomas actually play in last year?

Thought he was out the beginning of the year with a concussion from a car accident and out most of the second half of the season with another concussion from playing.

I sure don't want the Texans throwing $$$ after someone who is sitting on the bench (again).

This is not the old Zach Thomas from a couple of years ago, this is an older, more injured, slower - did I say more injured????
player that we don't ned to be signing, unless it is to coach the younger guys/

5 games.......
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Old 02-19-2008   #43
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
Jay Foreman was leading the league in tackles for three quarters of 2003, but the stats didn't show he was making the tackles 5 yards down the field. Zach also gets his stats padded by vet respect--he can be the 4th guy to jump on the pile and he gets credited with an assist. Zach had more assists in 2006 than DeMeco has in his two years in the league. Compare with DeMeco's solo numbers and there is no comparison.
no doubt about that, icak. stats can never be taken at face value, just like completion%. that being said, i wouldn't have a problem with us picking him up on the cheap though.
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Old 02-20-2008   #44
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

I never thought there was even a remote possibility that the Texans would sign Zach Thomas. Then I heard that Shawn Barber got released.

Can't help but wonder if there's a connection....
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Old 02-20-2008   #45
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by TEXANRED View Post
I am all for Picking up Zach, sliding Ryans over to WLB
DeMeco just played a game in Honolulu as the starter at MLB for the AFC. Do
you really want to experiment/tamper with that, i.e. don't fix it if it ain't broke ? And since ZT probably can't play on the outside and don't think he's ready to be a reserve either, it's looking like he's just not much of a fit here.
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Old 02-20-2008   #46
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by nunusguy View Post
DeMeco just played a game in Honolulu as the starter at MLB for the AFC. Do
you really want to experiment/tamper with that, i.e. don't fix it if it ain't broke ?
And since ZT probably can't play on the outside and don't think he's ready to be a reserve either, it's looking like he's just not much of a fit here.
And we passed up Patrick freakin Willis because we didnt want to move Demeco. If we wouldnt move him for Willis, I will be pissed if we move him for ZT. I wouldnt mind ZT as a back up MLB.
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Old 02-20-2008   #47
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by BigBull17 View Post
And we passed up Patrick freakin Willis because we didnt want to move Demeco. If we wouldnt move him for Willis, I will be pissed if we move him for ZT. I wouldnt mind ZT as a back up MLB.
I don't think the Texans ever said that was the "reason" they passed Willis. Bottom line is that Ryans has some unique blitzing abilities and has incredible instinct and body control. He would probably be a player much like Buc's Derrick Brooks at the WLB if moved there. Frankly, it's harder to find a great will linebacker than it is to find a great mlb since you don't need to have Ryans vast skillset to be an effective mlb.
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Old 02-20-2008   #48
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

I thought I heard that Amobi was the highest rated defensive player in the whole draft for the Texans. Wonder if he was already selected if Patrick Willis would have been the pick?

Demeco is very talented. I'll let the coaches do what the want with the LB's with hopes it's the right call. Whether that is moving Demeco outside or keeping him inside.

I look at the Linebacking corps as a whole, as a unit. So the saying 'if it aint broke, don't fix it' doesn't really apply. Sure the Mike position is rock solid but both the will and the sam are weak.

I don't want to get into another endless debate about the possibility of moving Demeco outside but I'd rather make a case for that than Dunta to Free Safety.
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Old 02-20-2008   #49
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by Ole Miss Texan View Post
I thought I heard that Amobi was the highest rated defensive player in the whole draft for the Texans. Wonder if he was already selected if Patrick Willis would have been the pick?

Demeco is very talented. I'll let the coaches do what the want with the LB's with hopes it's the right call. Whether that is moving Demeco outside or keeping him inside.

I look at the Linebacking corps as a whole, as a unit. So the saying 'if it aint broke, don't fix it' doesn't really apply. Sure the Mike position is rock solid but both the will and the sam are weak.

I don't want to get into another endless debate about the possibility of moving Demeco outside but I'd rather make a case for that than Dunta to Free Safety.
Generally speaking, elite DLineman (& DBacks for that matter) are more highly valued than elite LBs. Any doubts, just review Draft history &/or FA signings.
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Old 02-20-2008   #50
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by nunusguy View Post
Generally speaking, elite DLineman (& DBacks for that matter) are more highly valued than elite LBs. Any doubts, just review Draft history &/or FA signings.
Franchise numbers give some idea of relative value:

CB $9.4 mil (somewhat artificially inflated by Clements receiving a $10 mil roster bonus rather than signing bonus--he gets another one this year)
DE $8.8 mil
LB $8.0 mil
DT $6.4 mil
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Old 02-20-2008   #51
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Generally speaking, elite DLineman (& DBacks for that matter) are more highly valued than elite LBs. Any doubts, just review Draft history &/or FA signings.
I would agree...
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Old 02-20-2008   #52
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

steer clear of ZT
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Old 02-20-2008   #53
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

I doubt if Thomas was visiting Chicago there would be anyone suggesting Urlacher move outside to make room for him. Ryans is establishing himself as a leader of our defense and one of the next great MLBs of the league. Why would anyone want to move him for a player that at best won't be on the team in two years, and more than likely won't make it two games without sustaining another injury? Ryans should be the Texans MLB for the next decade, not pushed aside by a stop gap player.
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Old 02-20-2008   #54
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

Texans | Z. Thomas to visit team
Tue, 19 Feb 2008 20:15:36 -0800

John McClain, of the Houston Chronicle, reports free agent LB Zach Thomas (Dolphins) is expected to visit the Houston Texans next week.
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Old 02-20-2008   #55
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

I would rather see the Texans lock up DeMeco to a long term multi-million dollar contract. be proactive, not reactive
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Old 02-20-2008   #56
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by TexanAddict View Post
I doubt if Thomas was visiting Chicago there would be anyone suggesting Urlacher move outside to make room for him. Ryans is establishing himself as a leader of our defense and one of the next great MLBs of the league. Why would anyone want to move him for a player that at best won't be on the team in two years, and more than likely won't make it two games without sustaining another injury? Ryans should be the Texans MLB for the next decade, not pushed aside by a stop gap player.
Urlacher has a totally different bodytype than Ryans and isn't as good a blitzer. Ryans should be moved all around in different packages anyway....if not, they are wasting his skillset. I'd keep Urlacher in the middle myself.
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Old 02-20-2008   #57
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

Quote:
Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
Franchise numbers give some idea of relative value:

CB $9.4 mil (somewhat artificially inflated by Clements receiving a $10 mil roster bonus rather than signing bonus--he gets another one this year)
DE $8.8 mil
LB $8.0 mil
DT $6.4 mil
I'm not questioning the veracity of Infantrycaks stats, but they are
probably misleading. The thing is if they include FA money for 3-4 OLBs, which tend to have an upward skew effect on aggregate LB bonus money, they overstate the value of LBs to non 3-4 teams like the Texans, which are
of course a 4-3 team.
I think if those 3-4 OLB numbers were backed-out we'd see a more dramatic
disparity between LB FA money and FA money for non-LBs who play in 4-3s.
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Old 02-20-2008   #58
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Originally Posted by nunusguy View Post
I'm not questioning the veracity of Infantrycaks stats, but they are
probably misleading. The thing is if they include FA money for 3-4 OLBs, which tend to have an upward skew effect on aggregate LB bonus money, they overstate the value of LBs to non 3-4 teams like the Texans, which are
of course a 4-3 team.
I think if those 3-4 OLB numbers were backed-out we'd see a more dramatic
disparity between LB FA money and FA money for non-LBs who play in 4-3s.
basically edge rushers get paid more than the other front 7 players. Edge rushers are either DE's or OLB's, depending on your system. A 4-3 OLB isn't going to be an edge rusher when you have two dedicated ends, but a 3-4 OLB does the same job a 4-3 end does...hence the hike in money.
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Old 02-20-2008   #59
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

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Urlacher has a totally different bodytype than Ryans and isn't as good a blitzer. Ryans should be moved all around in different packages anyway....if not, they are wasting his skillset. I'd keep Urlacher in the middle myself.
I would love to see us move Demeco around a lot more. Not in the straight sense of olb vs. mlb but in different packages, on different downs, etc to confuse the opposing offense. I think this will happen more and more when we are more comfortable with our players as a whole on Defense.

I'd keep Urlacher in the middle as well. Demeco is more versatile, imo. Urlacher is also close to 260lbs where as Demeco is not even 240lbs.
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Old 02-20-2008   #60
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Default Re: Texans interested in Zach Thomas?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nunusguy View Post
I'm not questioning the veracity of Infantrycaks stats, but they are
probably misleading. The thing is if they include FA money for 3-4 OLBs, which tend to have an upward skew effect on aggregate LB bonus money, they overstate the value of LBs to non 3-4 teams like the Texans, which are
of course a 4-3 team.
I think if those 3-4 OLB numbers were backed-out we'd see a more dramatic
disparity between LB FA money and FA money for non-LBs who play in 4-3s.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
basically edge rushers get paid more than the other front 7 players. Edge rushers are either DE's or OLB's, depending on your system. A 4-3 OLB isn't going to be an edge rusher when you have two dedicated ends, but a 3-4 OLB does the same job a 4-3 end does...hence the hike in money.
Well if y'all find a list of who is in the top 5 for LB's then we can examine it further.

Looking over the 3-4 teams, I am not seeing the expensive guys skewing the number this year. Vrabel is cheap as was Bruschi. Lots of them are under rookie contracts and so still cheap--Merriman, Ware, Harrison, Suggs. Who are the expensive 3-4 OLB's?

The two biggest LB contracts I am aware of are Urlacher (2003 contract 6 years $56.5 mil) and Peterson (2006 contract 7 years $54 mil) and they are both 4-3 guys. Adalius Thomas as a decent contract (2007 5 year $35 mil contract) but he is intended to play ILB and isn't pushing the franchise number.
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