Truth & Rumors: Texans' draft plans include tackle

Originally Posted by PapaL

Here's the Link:



Would this hint that regardless of who is drafted Salaam will be starting at LT next year?

Yeah I know it's Truth & Rumors - hopefully this stimulates so sort of conversation. Doubt it but none the less at least SI knows we need some OL help.

Don't read too much into anything at this point in the year.

If there is a tackle that is better than Salaam in camp he will start. If not then Ephriam will be the man again.

Listening to Kubiak talk about the off-season (FA signing and draft) I got the feeling that they aren't going about things with a definite mind-set regarding player aquisitions and the draft.

[threetoedpete]

Originally Posted by Maddict5

lol.. thats old age for you.. check your calendar man- DC was a still a texan 11 months ago

Well since you're in the correcting mood, exactly how many times did they draft HHSNBN an o-lineman in the first round....and Pitts does not count. He was drafted as and only a left gaurd. that number would be zero. Funny how MS is trakcing down the same path...well maybe not so strange. Wouldn't you agree ?

The one way we can say beyound doubt has cost us one QB. The only questions remaining now is will it cost us two ? And how many drafts go by before they fix it and change the franchise's course ?

[infantrycak]

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

Twenty six gmes and counting.... tick tock.

Last I checked, they don't have drafts in between games. Fact--three picks during the Kubiak era in the 1st two rounds. Two went to the trenches and you sure as heck aren't going to make a good argument the probowl 3rd pick didn't bring talent to the team.

the facts are and they have been posted several times.....play off teams feature high round picks on the left side. Not third rounders...not fifth rounders, but guys drafted in the first two rounds.

Can you miss on them ?..uh huh....can you live without them and make serious SB run....nope.

Please call 1-800-extract-foot,

Signed,

David Diehl
5th round pick
LT for the Super Bowl Champion Giants

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

The one way we can say beyound doubt has cost us one QB.

BS.

Signed,

The entire football watching world

[threetoedpete]

Originally Posted by infantrycak

Last I checked, they don't have drafts in between games. Fact--three picks during the Kubiak era in the 1st two rounds. Two went to the trenches and you sure as heck aren't going to make a good argument the probowl 3rd pick didn't bring talent to the team.



Please call 1-800-extract-foot,

Signed,

David Diehl
5th round pick
LT for the Super Bowl Champion Giants

and the speculation is they are going to let him go.

BS.

Signed,

The entire football watching world
__________________

The same ones who gauranteed a Pats blow out ?

Well, the longer it gets ignored...the more the odds increase we get to relive history.
And for three years you've regurgated the same allibi....Gibbs better be good.
If MS becomes damged goods the next two years....the only parameters that havn't changed is the tallent on the o-line. And how this club selects and aquires them. And that there thingy is a fact. Live with mediocre tallent you get mediocre resluts. Say you can get them in day two...they haven't so far. Top five o-line ? nope. Far from it.

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

Funny how MS is trakcing down the same path...well maybe not so strange. Wouldn't you agree ?

David Carr was a self sacking fool.

Schaub is not.

For some reason I don't see Schaub's Texans career heading in the same direction as Carr's.

Your statement is almost saying "it was the line and not Carr"....

...and that is pretty scary....

[Vinny]

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

Funny how MS is trakcing down the same path...well maybe not so strange. Wouldn't you agree ?

Pete, when we sat together at the practice last year I found your wife to be pretty darn knowledgeable. Sometimes I think your wife has a better idea of what she is looking at than you...if you can't see a difference in Schaub and Carr you may have to ask your wife to explain it to you.

[Ole Miss Texan]

2007 Playoff LT's

New England Patriots: Matt Light, 48th pick (2nd Round)- 7th Season
New York Giants: David Diehl (Guard), 160th pick (5th Round)- 5th Season
San Diego Chargers: Marcus McNeill, 50th pick (2nd Round)- 2nd Season
Green Bay Packers: Chad Clifton, 44th pick (2nd Round)- 8th Season
Indianapolis Colts: Tony Ugoh, 42nd pick (2nd Round)- 2nd Season
Dallas Cowboys: Flozell Adams (Guard), 38th pick (2nd Round)- 10th Season
Jacksonville Jaguars: Khalif Barnes, 52nd pick (2nd Round)- 3rd Season
Tennessee Titans: Michael Roos, 41st pick (2nd Round)- 3rd Season
Washington Redskins: Chris Samuels, 3rd pick (1st Round)- 8th Season
Seattle Seahawks: Walter Jones, 6th pick (1st Round)- 11th Season
Tampa Bay Buccaneers: Donald Penn, Undrafted by the Vikings- 2nd Season
Pittsburgh Steelers: Max Starks, 75th pick (3rd Round)- 4th Season
.........................>Marvel Smith, 38th pick (2nd Round)- 8th Season

Ephraim Salaam, 199th pick (7th Round) by Atlanta- 7th Season
Charles Spencer, 33rd pick (3rd Round)- 2nd Season- IR

A trade down and a selection of Anthony Collins sounds REAL nice to me.

[Maddict5]

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

Well since you're in the correcting mood, ecaxtly how many times did they draft HHNBN an o-lineman in the firt round....and Pitts does not count. He was drafted as and only a left gaurd. that number would be zero. Funny how MS is trakcing down the same path...well maybe not so strange. Wouldn't you agree ?

The one way we can say beyound doubt has cost us one QB. The only question remining now is will it cost us two ?

well since im in a correcting mood apparently, id tell you that pitts was a 3rd rd'er anyway so it doesnt matter if he was brought in to be a G or T..

how about my question for you: how many first day linemen did gary kubiak (you know- our CURRENT HC dr) draft to protect HWWNBN... 2 out of the 4 available picks- thats how many. dont get all wrapped up in first rounders, you can get quality opening-day starters throughout day1 especially and sometimes day 2 if you groom them....


and just FYI- anthony collins is near the top of my list of players id like us to draft this year... i agree we need a new LT- just not hellbent that it has to be a first rounder like you

[Vinny]

Originally Posted by Maddict5

well since im in a correcting mood apparently, id tell you that pitts was a 3rd rd'er anyway so it doesnt matter if he was brought in to be a G or T..

Pitts was one of our two second round picks that year. 50th overall.

[infantrycak]

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

and the speculation is they are going to let him go.

And that makes your silly & incredibly untimely assertion not 1000% wrong how?

[Maddict5]

Originally Posted by Ole Miss Texan

2007 Playoff LT's



A trade down and a selection of Anthony Collins sounds REAL nice to me.

ha! beat me to it by a minute

and just in addition to that list since its somewhat relevant to what we're doing down here and who was a playoff LT (and all-pro i think)

Matt Lepsis UDFA

[Maddict5]

Originally Posted by Vinny

Pitts was one of our two second round picks that year. 50th overall.

my bad.. i knew he was our 3rd pick that year

[HOU-TEX]

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

and the speculation is they are going to let him go.



The same ones who gauranteed a Pats blow out ?

Well, the longer it gets ignored...the more the odds increase we get to relive history.
And for three years you've regurgated the same allibi....Gibbs better be good.
If MS becomes damged goods the next two years....the only parameters that havn't changed is the tallent on the o-line. And how this club selects and aquires them. And that there thingy is a fact. Live with mediocre tallent you get mediocre resluts. Say you can get them in day two...they haven't so far. Top five o-line ? nope. Far from it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAs6TDLuKgQ

[threetoedpete]

Originally Posted by infantrycak

And that makes your silly & incredibly untimely assertion not 1000% wrong how?

Becuse his tallent level is so good they are willing to pay him top dollar for a left gaurd? They are willing to let him walk becuse they can replace him with a free agent and break even. Tallent level ?

and Yes they Could Draft Cottam late. Might even work and he becomes Probowler....The last time I checked Lepsis wasn't forced to start his first two years.

Lepsis went to the University of Colorado, where he earned All-Big Eight Conference honors as a tight end, before going to the NFL were he would be signed as an undrafted free agent in 1997 by the Denver Broncos. He did not miss an offensive snap on a 2004 line that set a franchise record by allowing only 15 sacks, shattering the previous best of 22 sacks set in 1971, to rank third in the NFL.

So correct me if I'm worng since 1997 there have been two TE taken and made the flip. Lepsis and Jason Peters. Two guys in ten years ? So what you're telling me with the Lepsis post is that you are perfectly willing to draft Cottam and wait two years for him to become probowler. Uh huh now tell me another one. What I'm reading form these posts is they will never do it and right not to do it

And what I'm posting is that you are well on the path to start checking out the hot shot QBs that just singed their letters of intent last week. Because from my tree if something doesn't change radically, one of those guys could well be franchise QB #3.

The odds are just like the Junior College guys who jump into the NFL and make it. For a TE to make the transition the odds are long. Especially with a free agent TE. And those odds would be slim and none. You are allso telling me you feel we can wait another two years to let soemone develope. This line has one and only one good player on it.
They can't afford to wait on squat. They live with what they have the result next year will be eriely simular to last year.

Well Vinny I see it coming. Now I may not be the expert you are...but what I will say the longer they stand pat the longer the wait on the play offs are.

The tallent on the o-line is marginal at best, been that way for five years....and aparently everyone on the board is perfectly happy with the results. Draft the free safty first by guad full speed ahead.

[infantrycak]

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

Becuse his tallent level is so good they are willing to pay him top dollar for a left gaurd? They are willing to let him walk becuse they can replace him with a free agent and break even. Tallent level ?

A--it is talent, not tallent.

B--what the heck are you talking about?

You said a team couldn't make a SB run with a 5th round LT.

The Giants didn't just make a run but won the SB with a 5th round guy playing out of position at LT.

Therefore, your assertion was wrong and particularly untimely.

So what you're telling me with the Lepsis post

Must be responding to the wrong person.

Look, the Texans don't have a 2nd round pick. By your repeated rants, no matter who is available at either LT or any other position, the only acceptable pick is the OT. Then you act like it is a matter of talent, and that is the only spot you are correct because that is a sure fire train of thought for acquiring a less talented player.

[GP]

I used to be a "gotta' draft o line in the first round" guy.

And while I am happy with the Amobi pick...you have to stop and wonder what would our team look like if we had been able to step up a few slots in the draft and get Adrian Peterson?

Can you imagine what a TRUE threat at running back would have done for our passing game and our win total this season? We are on life support at running back. The "Draft a guy in the 7th, or get a UDFA" system is wearing me out.

Meanwhile, we're dropping in Sacks Allowed from 60+...to 40-something...and then last year's low 20s. That's a b-i-g reduction, consistently, over the past three seasons since Kubiak arrived and installed a real offense.

You guys DO realize that the vastly lowered "Sacks Allowed" numbers point to the idea that our o line is not as bad as we think/thought it was/is?

Just saying: What if we had a homerun hitter at running back?

[steelbtexan]

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

Twenty six games and counting. Franchise QB #2 and counting. The stuff is already starting to fly. MS is hurt a lot therefore it is MS's fault. He's brittle. Prety damn convient if you ask me. Everytime you switch QBs...you set the franchise back five years. This is year three removed FHHSNBN. And they have drafted exacatly zero offensive lineman in the first two rounds since that time. Tallent matters. And switching QBs every five years is .... very expensive.

I agree with you TTP allof the plaayoff teams had 1st or 2nd rd. LT's. I still think we should go with BPA & if Campbell or Cromartie are there we have to take them. That's why I propose trading an 08 3rd & an 09 3rd to move back into the 2nd rd. & take Collins. Then in the 4th I would take the best CB I could find unless one of the rb's fell.

If a LT is the BPA I say take him.

[Goldensilence]

Originally Posted by GP

I used to be a "gotta' draft o line in the first round" guy.

And while I am happy with the Amobi pick...you have to stop and wonder what would our team look like if we had been able to step up a few slots in the draft and get Adrian Peterson?

Can you imagine what a TRUE threat at running back would have done for our passing game and our win total this season? We are on life support at running back. The "Draft a guy in the 7th, or get a UDFA" system is wearing me out.

Meanwhile, we're dropping in Sacks Allowed from 60+...to 40-something...and then last year's low 20s. That's a b-i-g reduction, consistently, over the past three seasons since Kubiak arrived and installed a real offense.

You guys DO realize that the vastly lowered "Sacks Allowed" numbers point to the idea that our o line is not as bad as we think/thought it was/is?

Just saying: What if we had a homerun hitter at running back?

I think sack numbers don't really indicate the problems we still have on the oline. What I'm more concerned is hurries and knockdowns on a consistant basis. Those are the things that kill game plans and knock offenses out of sync. HWWNBN couldn't read a defense or make a pre-snap adjustment to save his career literally. The sack numbers went down because we got rid of the ball quickly and had QBS who could make pre-snap adjustments.

Good as AP is...keep in mind Chester Taylor did well before him.... I'm just going to point out the appearance of Steve Hutchinson and the ground game in Minnesota takes off....and the ground game in Seattle Tapers off.

Keep in mind GP what we would've had to do to move up to get AP.

[Ole Miss Texan]

Originally Posted by GP

Meanwhile, we're dropping in Sacks Allowed from 60+...to 40-something...and then last year's low 20s. That's a b-i-g reduction, consistently, over the past three seasons since Kubiak arrived and installed a real offense.

You guys DO realize that the vastly lowered "Sacks Allowed" numbers point to the idea that our o line is not as bad as we think/thought it was/is?

I think we're dropping in sacks for a couple of reasons: (1) Better QB play and (2) better OL play.

I'd be careful relating the decrease in sacks strictly to better OL play. The way I see it is that the # of QB hurries is probably remaining roughly the same. Matt Schaub is getting hit even when he throws the ball away. How many times did he do the smart thing in throwing it away instead of taking the sack? A Lot. but he still gets hit, knocked to the ground, and hurried. Sacks are only one part of judging a QB/OL/ DL.

Bottom line is the OL has got to get stronger for us to consistently beat good teams and consistently make playoff runs.

[Vinny]

Originally Posted by Ole Miss Texan

How many times did he do the smart thing in throwing it away instead of taking the sack? A Lot.

He completed 67% of his passes...so he didn't throw the ball away as much as you think.