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Old 01-18-2008   #1
Ali4Real
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Question Consider This Houston Texans Fans



With the 2007-2008 season over, I had some thoughts on our future. With the hiring of Alex Gibbs we well implement a zone blocking scheme. I thought that the Texans had the most sacks given up but I was grossly misinformed so I decided to look up the stats...

Ben Roethlisberger ~ Sacked 47 times

Matt Hasselbeck ~ Sacked 33 times

Tony Romo ~ Sacked 24 times (And his O-Line went to the ProBowl)

Tom Brady and Peyton Manning ~ Sacked 21 times

Matt Schaub ~ Sacked 16 times for 126 yards lost


My question is, should we consider drafting an OT in the 1st round of the 2008 NFL Draft or should we bolster our Secondary (CB is what I think needs the most help) I think according to our stats listed we should draft CB or Safety to bolster our D or maybe get a LB (Dan Conner???)

Also, can we switch Eric Winston to left OT and maybe had Brandon Frye into the mix?

Also, are we retaining Chester Pitts or Fred Weary?


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Old 01-18-2008   #2
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

The reduction in the number of sacks is good, but it doesn't tell the whole story. Our QB's were still under pressure more than they should have been, and IMO, it was their ability to get the ball off that was a big factor on the sack reduction.
The numbers a better, but the QBs were still under pressure a lot, and taking a lot of hits.
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Old 01-18-2008   #3
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

Well its not that simple. First you have to count sage's numbers in the mix... which actually makes Houston look better than on Schaub alone. Sage was sacked once every 41 times he dropped back to throw a pass. Matt was sacked once every 18 times he dropped back to pass. (Have I ever said they played differen quality teams?) Sage was second only to Drew Brees. Schaub was 13th. The stat is still surprising to most but its not quite as good as it looked. If you look at the teams that Schaub played against it makes sense that there was such a discrepancy.

Mike

p.s. does anyone know where I could get knockdowns/hurries? that would give a much more complete picture. Its not on nfl or yahoo unless I'm just blind.
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Old 01-18-2008   #4
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali4Real View Post

With the 2007-2008 season over, I had some thoughts on our future. With the hiring of Alex Gibbs we well implement a zone blocking scheme. I thought that the Texans had the most sacks given up but I was grossly misinformed so I decided to look up the stats...

Ben Roethlisberger ~ Sacked 47 times

Matt Hasselbeck ~ Sacked 33 times

Tony Romo ~ Sacked 24 times (And his O-Line went to the ProBowl)

Tom Brady and Peyton Manning ~ Sacked 21 times

Matt Schaub and Sage Rosenfels~ Sacked 22 times for 174 yards lost


My question is, should we consider drafting an OT in the 1st round of the 2008 NFL Draft or should we bolster our Secondary (CB is what I think needs the most help) I think according to our stats listed we should draft CB or Safety to bolster our D or maybe get a LB (Dan Conner???)

Also, can we switch Eric Winston to left OT and maybe had Brandon Frye into the mix?

Also, are we retaining Chester Pitts or Fred Weary?


As Mike said, to be fair, you need to add Rosenfels being sacked 6 times...
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Old 01-18-2008   #5
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

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Originally Posted by Ali4Real View Post
[With the hiring of Alex Gibbs we well implement a zone blocking scheme.
The Texans have been using zone blocking in varying amounts for four seasons now.
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Old 01-18-2008   #6
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

A good left tackle would help out but overall our line was only okay at best. We need to make a decision on Weary and Pitts. Flannigan looked better later in the season but the line looked better earlier in the season with McKinney at Center.Breisel didn't look horrible when called pressed into duty. White is a question mark IMO.

I think Winston is the only lock on this line and he's steadily gotten better at RT. So I don't think we should switch him over to LT. Not sure how I feel about Butler and if he's closer to a RT or LT candidate. We need a center whom can set the tone for the line Is Eslinger the guy? I don't know but I though going into his draft year the guy was rated the second best on board even though he was a bit light. I like Studdard's tenacity and would welcome that on our line. We got room for improvement for sure but we aren't downright horrid on the line. It will definately help that Alex Gibbs is on board and we have 3 coaches that will be on the SAME page offensively.
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Old 01-18-2008   #7
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texan_Bill View Post
As Mike said, to be fair, you need to add Rosenfels being sacked 6 times...
To be even more fair AJ was injured for a fair amount of time....
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Old 01-18-2008   #8
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldensilence View Post
A good left tackle would help out but overall our line was only okay at best. We need to make a decision on Weary and Pitts. Flannigan looked better later in the season but the line looked better earlier in the season with McKinney at Center.Breisel didn't look horrible when called pressed into duty. White is a question mark IMO.

I think Winston is the only lock on this line and he's steadily gotten better at RT. So I don't think we should switch him over to LT. Not sure how I feel about Butler and if he's closer to a RT or LT candidate. We need a center whom can set the tone for the line Is Eslinger the guy? I don't know but I though going into his draft year the guy was rated the second best on board even though he was a bit light. I like Studdard's tenacity and would welcome that on our line. We got room for improvement for sure but we aren't downright horrid on the line. It will definately help that Alex Gibbs is on board and we have 3 coaches that will be on the SAME page offensively.
I don't think its any accident that Kubiak & GM Smith acquired the rights to
Butler & Enslinger in the past year. I think its an expression of their commitment to the ZB approach to blocking schemes as these 2 guys are
built for that system just as they are misfits for a more power-oriented
scheme. And with Shermans exit and now Gibbs arrival in the near-term
its full speed ahead.
Of the present OLine starters, I'm unsure of which ones are suited for ZB,
except for Winston who clearly is.
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Old 01-18-2008   #9
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

but look at our running game, getting 100 yards total from 2 backs was impresive everytime it happened, i dont want to be impressed by that anymore.... but it is a good point and i think that it reflects on our qb's more than our o line....

i say get the best available guy, i know thats a boring choice but hey if its a saftey or cb grab him but if its an OT grab him....
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Old 01-18-2008   #10
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

This is what gives the MB posts. We all have our idea of what is best and what coach and GM will/should do. Our personal feelings also fit in. What happens if a trade down occurs? There are several other threads here that may give you things to think about. Also, do not forget about the free agency signing period that may change what is done and/or when in the draft in April.
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Old 01-18-2008   #11
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

I think people need to stop saying that our sack numbers were down, because our QBs got rid of the ball quickly, like that was a bad thing. That is what good QBs do.

I'll agree, our QBs never had the kind of protection you see Tom Brady with, & we need to get better on the OL, but the Offensive Line has improved.
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Old 01-18-2008   #12
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
I think people need to stop saying that our sack numbers were down, because our QBs got rid of the ball quickly, like that was a bad thing. That is what good QBs do.

I'll agree, our QBs never had the kind of protection you see Tom Brady with, & we need to get better on the OL, but the Offensive Line has improved.
I just think that the crappy running game, and the fact that one of our QB's got hurt twice (One hit was not the o-line's fault, but they had no reaction to our QB taking a cheapshot), and pressured quite a bit means that while they aren't the worst in the league, they certainly are a little bit below average.

David Carr was a problem, but our O-line is not made of world beaters, which it needs to be.

Besides, Andre Johnson says we should get better talent on the O-line, and he's practically Jesus.
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Old 01-19-2008   #13
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

As far as sack totals go, having a QB/s that doesn't lay down and take it like a b*tch whenever it looks as though he may be pressured helps a good deal. Looking back on it, all of those 70+ sack seasons could be primarily blamed on Carr.

With all of that said, our lack of o-line took out our starting quarterback for several games and then finally for the season. Schaub, and even Rosenfels, was constantly under pressure. When given enough time, both looked great. I would say the left side of our line needs much improvement. I also believe we need more youth on the line. Salaam, Flanagan, and McKinney are not going to cut it for next season. I also don't believe that we should bank our future on Charles Spencer. Tony Boselli II, if you ask me. Let's let him compete with someone else. I don't know much about Eslinger, but he is an interesting prospect who, with a little help from Gibbs, seems like a good fit for the zone blocking system. With another year worth of experience, I think Winston would be a great fit at LT in this new system.

A lot of things to think about. However, the point is: Despite a decrease in sacks, our offensive line was still subpar this season.
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Old 01-20-2008   #14
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
I think people need to stop saying that our sack numbers were down, because our QBs got rid of the ball quickly, like that was a bad thing. That is what good QBs do.

I'll agree, our QBs never had the kind of protection you see Tom Brady with, & we need to get better on the OL, but the Offensive Line has improved.
Shouldn't that be what we're working to?
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Old 01-20-2008   #15
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
I'll agree, our QBs never had the kind of protection you see Tom Brady with, & we need to get better on the OL, but the Offensive Line has improved.
I hate to say Gibbs OL tend to be small, the offenses use a lot of play action and roleouts to keep the QB alive. If they get into a drop back and pass type game the QB is in trouble. Or he needs to be Mike Vick and be able to run.

Gibbs will have this teams run game fixed. That is what he does. Guys like Winston, Butler, Eslinger fit his system. How the rest are going to work out I am not as sure about. But I look forward to training camp in July. I will be there watching and looking to see who is working at what spot and with what group.
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Old 01-20-2008   #16
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My question is, should we consider drafting an OT in the 1st round of the 2008 NFL Draft or should we bolster our Secondary (CB is what I think needs the most help) I think according to our stats listed we should draft CB or Safety to bolster our D or maybe get a LB (Dan Conner???)
In a perfect world Oher would of come out. That would of put three high end OLT canidates within thier reach with one of the first two picks or a move down.

Salaam has twenty eight straight starts and ninty percenty of the time he is flawless. He played the last five games down the strech less than one hundred percent physically. That only endeared him to the coaches.

So what you have in this draft is a perfect storm for the Texans. They are sloted in the correct spot where you can take a high end, expect the guy to beat Salaam out by the second game of the season offensive left tackle. Not a RT or guard, but a bona fide OLT.

The second thing you've got to conider is that Erick Winston showed enough flash on the Right side to be given a fair shot at his pay day with an OLT move. I don't think he can make that kind of transition. And I'm quite happy at the prospect of him manning the RT slot for the next eight years. However, he has earned the right to show what he can do there in the preseason. I doubt they monkey with their best lineman. When I'm banging on here for o-lineman he is what I'm talking about. But if you would of told me six weeks go that Kubes could woo Gibbs out of retirement I would of posted some snide remarks with the "when pigs fly" smiley flying at the end of it....so who knows ?

If,
the remaining two high end RBs are on the board, which would mean the three QBS went in the top fifteen, that brings the move down scenario into play. And both Seattle and Dallas needs one of those two guys, Stewart and Mendenhall. That would be pefect storm number two: if the draft falls in such a way that the tallent on the board creates a feeding frenzy for the 18 pick.
Now they have to decide if they want to move down or make a pick.

You've said it yourself...no one wants the choice of Von Hutchenson or Pety Faggins at the other corner. Another thing to conider is that Bennit will be a sophmore and if he goes into some kind of a slump the first third of the season, you're now staring down at another 8-8, sister kisser. Not saying it WILL happen. I'm posting it has happened befor. So the CB slot is a real and present danger for this club in '08.

No one will argue if they pick the High end second teired RB. And by that I mean Stweart and Mendenhall, all the others are just the darlings of the day;
platoon guys who you take if and when they fall to you. If you spend the eighteen on them when you could of gotten a shot at them with the third round pick or under some sort of a move down scenario, that is foolish beyond measure. That's the type of move that keeps you last in the AFC south. And if they are drooling over one of those grey hounds, beyond question they should move out of the first completely. They better have a DB in thier pocket that no one knows about if they do that though.

If they took the big Cb that has a shot at the FS sore spot in '09 no one would agrue with that one either. That's a critical need that you bang with the best player your scouts can find. I believe that this HC follows what he knows.....and it won't be the first time that a Denver defense features two monters at the Safty slots. So the FS may in fact already be on the roster.

But you can never have too many DBs. Believe anything believe that the paradigm has shifted over at Tennesse. And this draft board is looooooaded up for them to select a herd of WRs-plmakers for Vincent. I also believe the Jackonville QB is no fluke. We can't have too many tallented DBs for '08 with Robinson on the shelf.

And I disgree up there....as long as they have that mule at DT...Jeff Fischer will figure out all the other stuff. Tennesee's defense will not digress.

My hope is that there will be a perfect storm. They get the Db and the flashy RB too after and only after a move down deal. If Sam Baker or someone Gibbs loves is on the board at the end of the first you take the guy. If he's not you take the best move down deal you can get. Hammer the high end CB with the first pick. At that point you let the draft drift to you. Hold your water and spend the extra ammo you got in the move down on players who fit your scheme.
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Old 01-20-2008   #17
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Default Re: Consider This Houston Texans Fans

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali4Real View Post

With the 2007-2008 season over, I had some thoughts on our future. With the hiring of Alex Gibbs we well implement a zone blocking scheme. I thought that the Texans had the most sacks given up but I was grossly misinformed so I decided to look up the stats...

Ben Roethlisberger ~ Sacked 47 times

Matt Hasselbeck ~ Sacked 33 times

Tony Romo ~ Sacked 24 times (And his O-Line went to the ProBowl)

Tom Brady and Peyton Manning ~ Sacked 21 times

Matt Schaub ~ Sacked 16 times for 126 yards lost


My question is, should we consider drafting an OT in the 1st round of the 2008 NFL Draft or should we bolster our Secondary (CB is what I think needs the most help) I think according to our stats listed we should draft CB or Safety to bolster our D or maybe get a LB (Dan Conner???)

Also, can we switch Eric Winston to left OT and maybe had Brandon Frye into the mix?

Also, are we retaining Chester Pitts or Fred Weary?


I agree I think that they need to be taught better technique and give Charles Spencer, Eric Winston & Rashad Bulter a shot along with E. Salaam who has played in the Denver system.I think if any position we need to look for upgrades is at the OG spot in rd. 3 or rd. 4.
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