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Old 12-02-2007   #41
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by Thorn View Post
Schaub appears to be an injury prone QB, and when you put someone like that behind our line, it's a reciepe for disaster. I don't know. I started out this season hating the Schaub trade, and then changed my mind and became a Schaub supporter. I reserve the right to change my mind again, but I'm waiting to see how the season plays out.

8-8 is not going to happen this year. We are losers once again.

But I still say we are in better shape now than we were a year ago at this time. There has been improvement in this team. The fact that we were dangling the playoffs before our eyes at one point in time this season proves that.

Another off season of trades and draft picks, and we'll be a better team. Again. But this year it's really true.
Kubes, is that you?
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Old 12-02-2007   #42
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by The1ApplePie View Post
Brady Quinn + 2 second rounders is better than Fragile Matty
And you base that on what, EXACTLY? Given that Quinn can't beat out Derek Anderson.

question #2: How do you know that Quinn wouldn't be just as or more "fragile" than some of you say Schaub is?

Now, having said that, I fall back to my std Schaub statement: Yes, he is two 2nd round picks better than Carr. I'm not yet convinced he's two 2nd round picks better than Sage.
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Old 12-02-2007   #43
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

Does anyone else see the flaw in this whole thread? Everyone is talking about an upgrade over Carr? Are you kidding me. Anyone is better than Carr, even a 44 year old who was sitting at home enjoying retirement.

This team should be better. Schaub has lost us games as well as won a few. He is fragile. Very, very fragile. The line has done a pretty good job this year considering the injuries.

I am just tired of the Denver mentality. We need to get our own and quit thinking about how they would have handled it in Denver. It is time for Kubes to get his own identity.
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Old 12-03-2007   #44
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by junior View Post
thats a great point ,favre hasnt missed a game in 13 years or something and ours has, great comparison.

and yes i would rather have carr as a back up this year plus 2 2nd rounders and all those millions. i thought then and still think that money was better spent somewhere else.

i hope i am proven wrong and i will say when i am but as of now its my opinion that i havent.
I'm just saying people take hits.

All those millions?The investment of guaranteed money isn't even that bad...7 million. We were going to draft a QB so there is one 2nd rounder. You'd rather have Carr and all the questions and infighting we dealt with for years?That is ridiculous. You forget that we are going to get a break on his salary too. That guy isn't even close to Schaub. I' don't like the injuries but if you don't think he has looked good despite losing his #1 receiver and center you aren't watching football or you are with a jaded eye.
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Old 12-03-2007   #45
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by ArlingtonTexan View Post
Staying on the field is a major part of being in the NFL. Whether unlucky or not right now there is a question as to whether or Schaub is going to be able to that.
Fair point.

I also think the coaching staff didn't do him any favors. The Texans throw the ball a lot in circumstances where they don't need to. That is a dangerous approach to take with a Haynesworth-included Titan defensive line that has played very well against the league and the Texans in particular.

An example, proving my point:

It's 2nd and 3, sloppy weather, and Schaub tries to get a ball off and gets hit in the hand as he is throwing the ball. Even if that isn't killing him, you might want to run the next play just to give him and the line more of a breather put the Titans more on their heels.

So then it is 3rd and 3, the Titans bring it, and Schaub gets crushed on the blindside.

They give lip service to the running game and then they don't run in circumstances where they can.

I like the sets where they run when the wide receivers/tight ends are spread, and not so much running that power I crap, because the Texans line is not going to overpower many opposing lines when those guys know you are more likely than not going to run.

Anybody playing the quarterback position for the Texans is going to be vulnerable until the Texans get a legitimate take-it-to-the-house, consistent positive yardage threat at the running back position. Dayne is doing an admirable job with his skill sets, but defenses know what he can't do.

Brett Favre and Tom Brady can sorta make do without much of a running game, but they are pretty unique guys combined with a defense that can hold down the fort without a time chewing running game. And even Favre is going to be hard pressed to come back from the pasting he took from the Cowboys.

For the rest of the season the Texans are in survival mode. Kubiak last spring in SI spoke the truth that the Texans were going to need a few more offseasons to get their rosters more playoff caliber. But they also need some huge luck--hoping that the decent players they already have don't get killed before that happens.

/still bummed about Dunta, now bummed about Weary
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Old 12-03-2007   #46
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
Fair point.

I also think the coaching staff didn't do him any favors. The Texans throw the ball a lot in circumstances where they don't need to. That is a dangerous approach to take with a Haynesworth-included Titan defensive line that has played very well against the league and the Texans in particular.

An example, proving my point:

It's 2nd and 3, sloppy weather, and Schaub tries to get a ball off and gets hit in the hand as he is throwing the ball. Even if that isn't killing him, you might want to run the next play just to give him and the line more of a breather put the Titans more on their heels.

So then it is 3rd and 3, the Titans bring it, and Schaub gets crushed on the blindside.

They give lip service to the running game and then they don't run in circumstances where they can.

I like the sets where they run when the wide receivers/tight ends are spread, and not so much running that power I crap, because the Texans line is not going to overpower many opposing lines when those guys know you are more likely than not going to run.

Anybody playing the quarterback position for the Texans is going to be vulnerable until the Texans get a legitimate take-it-to-the-house, consistent positive yardage threat at the running back position. Dayne is doing an admirable job with his skill sets, but defenses know what he can't do.

Brett Favre and Tom Brady can sorta make do without much of a running game, but they are pretty unique guys combined with a defense that can hold down the fort without a time chewing running game. And even Favre is going to be hard pressed to come back from the pasting he took from the Cowboys.

For the rest of the season the Texans are in survival mode. Kubiak last spring in SI spoke the truth that the Texans were going to need a few more offseasons to get their rosters more playoff caliber. But they also need some huge luck--hoping that the decent players they already have don't get killed before that happens.

/still bummed about Dunta, now bummed about Weary
Could not agree more TC. Some will say O-line, etc but I think teams know we have to throw at a certain point and they just pin their ears back and tee off. There is no one to keep them honest.
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Old 12-03-2007   #47
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
It's 2nd and 3, sloppy weather, and Schaub tries to get a ball off and gets hit in the hand as he is throwing the ball. Even if that isn't killing him, you might want to run the next play just to give him and the line more of a breather put the Titans more on their heels.

So then it is 3rd and 3, the Titans bring it, and Schaub gets crushed on the blindside.

They give lip service to the running game and then they don't run in circumstances where they can.
excatly. I was so mad @ the play calling in that situation, looked to me that Schaub wasn't all there after being jammed, the pocket was collapsing bad then try & move out of the pocket with backside pursuit = disaster
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Old 12-03-2007   #48
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
And you base that on what, EXACTLY? Given that Quinn can't beat out Derek Anderson.

question #2: How do you know that Quinn wouldn't be just as or more "fragile" than some of you say Schaub is?

Now, having said that, I fall back to my std Schaub statement: Yes, he is two 2nd round picks better than Carr. I'm not yet convinced he's two 2nd round picks better than Sage.
There aren't too many QBs that could beat out Anderson right now.

2. Could he really take a hit worse than Schaub? He got decked plenty of times at ND and kept getting up.

I agree with your statment about being 2 second rounders better than Carr, but he and Sage may be in a dead heat.
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Old 12-03-2007   #49
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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I don't know if Schaub is a wuss, but I can tell you that this team isn't going to move forward until it fixes the line problems on both sides of the ball.
I agree. No protection and no consistent pressure will never allow us to run any game plan. The battle is won/lost in the trenches, and after 6 dismal seasons, the Texans FO still can't figure out such fundamental concepts of controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball.

Back the drawing board for another couple of years. Wake me when they [eventually] string three wins in a row together. Monumental task as that appears to be.
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Old 12-03-2007   #50
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
I agree. No protection and no consistent pressure will never allow us to run any game plan. The battle is won/lost in the trenches, and after 6 dismal seasons, the Texans FO still can't figure out such fundamental concepts of controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball.

Back the drawing board for another couple of years. Wake me when they [eventually] string three wins in a row together. Monumental task as that appears to be.
They need to survive the rest of the season. Just survive.

Hard to build for the future in the offseason when your solid players are going down to injury.
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Old 12-03-2007   #51
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

As much as I am a Carr fan,I believe he diffently is now damaged goods. He has had a compression fracture of the back and two concussions this season alone. In 2004, he had his first concussion and that probably set the whole scenerio of his skiddishness. So I'm going to reserve judgement on Schaub right now to see how he performs when healthy. Then the question will be will he then go to a fetal position when attacked? I said from the beginning they need to improve the o-line. Your runningback situation also sucks.
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Old 12-03-2007   #52
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by raytex View Post
This OL has played very good this year. They were #7 overall in giving up sacks. Yes, they are injured, but schaub hasn't been hit that much this year.
No, it's b/c Shaub is mobile. That doesn't mean the OL is good, it just means he's good at running. If we had a good OL, then we wouldn't need our QB to be mobile. So it is WAY PAST TIME to put some money into the Offensive Line. Can you imagine if we finally got a great OL, AND our QB was mobile?!?!?!?
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Old 12-03-2007   #53
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by Dallas_Texan View Post
Can you imagine if we finally got a great OL, AND our QB was mobile?!?!?!?
Or a running back with the power to run between the tackles and the speed to get around the edge?
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Old 12-03-2007   #54
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by The1ApplePie View Post
Brady Quinn + 2 second rounders is better than Fragile Matty
One of the better quotes I've read on this messageboard in awhile.

ApplePie I remember us going back and forth before the draft where you were calling for Marshawn Lynch.

I hate to say it, but you were right sir I apologize for my past misgivings.
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Old 12-03-2007   #55
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

That sounds like a great quote to you because the hyped player who hasn't played at all (i.e. Quinn) is always given a sky-high ceiling without any consideration of his floor, whereas a guy who's played about half a season at the hardest position on the field is a known quantity incapable of improvement.

Flip the script. Given this organization's sketchy record with regards to personnel decisions, the whiners would just as easily bash the front office for not trading for a quarterback in lieu of two #2s because Texans draft pick are usually busts...am I close? I think so.
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Old 12-03-2007   #56
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by Mailman View Post
That sounds like a great quote to you because the hyped player who hasn't played at all (i.e. Quinn) is always given a sky-high ceiling without any consideration of his floor, whereas a guy who's played about half a season at the hardest position on the field is a known quantity incapable of improvement.

Flip the script. Given this organization's sketchy record with regards to personnel decisions, the whiners would just as easily bash the front office for not trading for a quarterback in lieu of two #2s because Texans draft pick are usually busts...am I close? I think so.
Schaub wasn't any more proven than Quinn when he was brought in. He was the most hyped back up in the NFL, that was it.

The trade was made before Quinn's draft stock took a tumble. If Kubes knew he could get Quinn in the draft, do you think he makes the trade?

2 2nd rounders equals two starters gone.
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Old 12-03-2007   #57
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by fikster View Post
Kubes, is that you?
LOL. If it was, there'd be some big changes coming in the off season.
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Old 12-03-2007   #58
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by The1ApplePie View Post
Schaub wasn't any more proven than Quinn when he was brought in. He was the most hyped back up in the NFL, that was it.

The trade was made before Quinn's draft stock took a tumble. If Kubes knew he could get Quinn in the draft, do you think he makes the trade?

2 2nd rounders equals two starters gone.
Those are some big ass sumptions you're making there. Quinn played well in the preseason, but so did Jacoby Jones....and how are Chris Houston and Jamaal Anderson doing in Atlanta? Not that great from what I've read.

This organization was not interested in grooming another rookie QB to become a franchise starter. Kubiak and Smith went after Schaub because he had three years of professional experience (i.e. training camps and countless hours of film study and practice time) that would allow the team to compete sooner rather than later. I agreed with their thinking then and I agree with it now. I see no reason to believe Schaub is not the franchise QB. He's been solid, not spectacular but not terrible. I think he could aptly be compared to a guy like Matt Hasselbeck. Check his numbers from his first full season in Seattle.
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Old 12-03-2007   #59
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

This thread reads like the who's who of the haters, bashers and people who have disappeared until today, got to love that mind set.

As far as Schaub being gingerbread man, lets see he was knocked out of two games by late hits and blind sided helmet to helmet hits, causing him to miss a game. One of which was a concusion in which rules dictate that if it is severe enough the player must sit out a week and not play.

Some of you make me sick to my stomach how you turn on a player because of things that are beyond his control and to vilify a player because of your personal agendas based upon a draft that is in the past or because of the love fest of some dudes hair.
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Old 12-03-2007   #60
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Default Re: CAN Schaub take a hit?!

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
Fair point.

I also think the coaching staff didn't do him any favors. The Texans throw the ball a lot in circumstances where they don't need to. That is a dangerous approach to take with a Haynesworth-included Titan defensive line that has played very well against the league and the Texans in particular.

An example, proving my point:

It's 2nd and 3, sloppy weather, and Schaub tries to get a ball off and gets hit in the hand as he is throwing the ball. Even if that isn't killing him, you might want to run the next play just to give him and the line more of a breather put the Titans more on their heels.

So then it is 3rd and 3, the Titans bring it, and Schaub gets crushed on the blindside.

They give lip service to the running game and then they don't run in circumstances where they can.

I like the sets where they run when the wide receivers/tight ends are spread, and not so much running that power I crap, because the Texans line is not going to overpower many opposing lines when those guys know you are more likely than not going to run.

Anybody playing the quarterback position for the Texans is going to be vulnerable until the Texans get a legitimate take-it-to-the-house, consistent positive yardage threat at the running back position. Dayne is doing an admirable job with his skill sets, but defenses know what he can't do.

Brett Favre and Tom Brady can sorta make do without much of a running game, but they are pretty unique guys combined with a defense that can hold down the fort without a time chewing running game. And even Favre is going to be hard pressed to come back from the pasting he took from the Cowboys.

For the rest of the season the Texans are in survival mode. Kubiak last spring in SI spoke the truth that the Texans were going to need a few more offseasons to get their rosters more playoff caliber. But they also need some huge luck--hoping that the decent players they already have don't get killed before that happens.

/still bummed about Dunta, now bummed about Weary
I was thinking the same thing, they should have spread them out and handed the ball off to Joe or Ron. Schaub was hurt on the play before, the coaches should have seen than and called for a spread run.
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