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Old 11-17-2004   #21
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If David can stand upright he gives you the best chance to win. Bad ankle or no. I saw a KC QB play once with a pin sticking out of his hand and because it was an important game he played.
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Old 11-17-2004   #22
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Originally Posted by WWJD
If David can stand upright he gives you the best chance to win. Bad ankle or no. I saw a KC QB play once with a pin sticking out of his hand and because it was an important game he played.
Was that Steve DeBerg?
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Old 11-17-2004   #23
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I don't remember; it was a number of years ago but I remember thinking how gross that was that this guy was playing with this big pin sticking out of his finger.

I do remember he had a horrible break and I think he got it hitting his hand on somebody's helmet.

It's been years though.
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Old 11-17-2004   #24
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The person I was thinking about was Milford Brown and here is the information from the Texans Web Site. He was a starter in the Miami game and seemed to help us with the run game. I guess he's a back up to Pitts, but why can't he make the move to RG. They were very high on this young man at some point. What has changed? Is this another young talent we wasted a draft choice on and are not developing.

PRO: Quick, athletic guard who gained valuable experience last season…played in four games, starting two at left guard…selected by the Texans in the sixth round of the supplemental draft on 9/27/02…signed four days later…started one season at Florida State after transferring from East Mississippi Junior College.

2004: On the inactive list against San Diego (9/12) ... Inactive in loss at Detroit (9/19) ... Inactive during win at Kansas City (9/26) ... Inactive for win over Oakland (10/3) ... Inactive during overtime loss to Minnesota (10/10) ... Did not play in victory at Tennessee (10/17) ... Inactive for victory over Jacksonville (10/31) ... Inactive for 31-13 loss at Denver (11/7) ... Did not play in loss at Indianapolis (11/14).

2003: Played in four games, starting two at left guard…made NFL debut as starter in season-opening win at Miami (9/7)…helped Texans rush for 127 yards…started at New Orleans (9/14) but sprained his right knee in the fourth quarter…inactive for the next six games…returned to action on special teams at Cincinnati (11/9)…also saw action on special teams at Tampa Bay (12/14).
2002: Joined team after selection in the supplemental draft…inactive for nine games and did not play in three games.

COLLEGE: Started all 12 games for the Seminoles at split guard as a junior…ranked second on the team with 45 pancake blocks and 15 key blocks…graded out at 84 percent…helped QB Chris Rix set Atlantic Coast Conference record for single-season total yards…twice earned consensus first-team JC All-America honors for East Mississippi…named nation’s top JC lineman as a sophomore…majored in social science at FSU.

PERSONAL: Single, lives in Houston…second-team all-state selection at Carver Senior High School in Montgomery, Ala….born Milford Brown, Aug. 15, 1980, in Montgomery, Ala.
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Old 11-17-2004   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibar_Harry
I hope that is the case and you are right about Wade. I asked Vinny and no anwer. What has happened to the lineman Brown people were so high on at one time.
Asked me what?


Brown is still on the team. He is a reserve Guard. Not every player drafted on every team starts Ibar. He is only a "wasted pick" if he was no longer here.
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Old 11-17-2004   #26
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Vinny, I'm not saying that every player drafted becomes a starter, but he did. Apparently he played well in the Miami game we won. He was playing well until injured. He seems to be a victum of the Wand Pitts move. I guess I'm scratching my head and wondering when we are having problems with the O-line that we don't see a little more variation. We know that Washington has played very well at times, but he doesn't get a look see. Brown has played well at time but he doesn't get a look see. I guess when things are not going right you tend to look and say how can I shake things up and get peoples attention. Perhaps we have overlooked something.
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Old 11-17-2004   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WWJD
I don't remember; it was a number of years ago but I remember thinking how gross that was that this guy was playing with this big pin sticking out of his finger.
I think Drew Bledsoe played a few games like that when in New England.
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Old 11-17-2004   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibar_Harry
I hope that is the case and you are right about Wade. I asked Vinny and no anwer. What has happened to the lineman Brown people were so high on at one time.
I don't know but I'm pretty sure black and white people were pretty high on him too. I think it was the Asians keeping him down. I'll check with some brown people and let you know if we find him.
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Old 11-17-2004   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibar_Harry
Vinny, I'm not saying that every player drafted becomes a starter, but he did. Apparently he played well in the Miami game we won. He was playing well until injured. He seems to be a victum of the Wand Pitts move. I guess I'm scratching my head and wondering when we are having problems with the O-line that we don't see a little more variation. We know that Washington has played very well at times, but he doesn't get a look see. Brown has played well at time but he doesn't get a look see. I guess when things are not going right you tend to look and say how can I shake things up and get peoples attention. Perhaps we have overlooked something.
Brown isn't a better player than Zach Weigert or Chester Pitts. Why put in a lesser player just to "shake things up"? Makes no sense. Also, Washington has lead feet. He is very limited. He is a decent run blocker but he tends to get Carr clobbered when he is in there.
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Old 11-17-2004   #30
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Are you really suggesting we play Banks over Carr? Banks is a sold backup. But thats it, backup. And he will not start unless car is injured.
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Old 11-17-2004   #31
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For example, if Brown can't play LG and Pitts can, could you possibly put Pitts in the RG position temporarily. I know that would leave a very young left side, but do you tell Wand he has to step up and do even more. I don't know, but its just some thoughts. Is it that Brown and Washington don't get the new line scheme? I can't say the current O-line does. I think all of us would say the O-line performance this year could be as big a disappointment as the defensive side of the ball. I think we have had one solid game at best from the O-line. It really makes you wonder about the people who are making the decisions. Is this the best we can get after 3 years? Seems like we have marginal starters according to everyone with no backups. Who's missing what??????
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Old 11-17-2004   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky
I think Drew Bledsoe played a few games like that when in New England.

Gosh you know I don't remember it being Drew Bledsoe. For some reason I remember it being a Chiefs guy.

It very well may have been DeBerg.

Those guys sure are tough.
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Old 11-17-2004   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibar_Harry
For example, if Brown can't play LG and Pitts can, could you possibly put Pitts in the RG position temporarily. I know that would leave a very young left side, but do you tell Wand he has to step up and do even more. I don't know, but its just some thoughts. Is it that Brown and Washington don't get the new line scheme? I can't say the current O-line does. I think all of us would say the O-line performance this year could be as big a disappointment as the defensive side of the ball. I think we have had one solid game at best from the O-line. It really makes you wonder about the people who are making the decisions. Is this the best we can get after 3 years? Seems like we have marginal starters according to everyone with no backups. Who's missing what??????
It is as simple as this....

Pitts and Weigert are better football players than Washington and Brown. It doesn't get much more complex than that.
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Old 11-17-2004   #34
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Vinny I was thinking of Spears, not Wiegert. Sorry. I believe Wiegert has played RT, so could he replace Spears and again move someone to the RG position that way. I'm sorry but sometimes you just don't get what the other guy is thinking.
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Old 11-17-2004   #35
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Originally Posted by Ibar_Harry
Vinny I was thinking of Spears, not Wiegert. Sorry. I believe Wiegert has played RT, so could he replace Spears and again move someone to the RG position that way. I'm sorry but sometimes you just don't get what the other guy is thinking.
How can I "get it" when you can't even figure out the players you are discussing?
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Old 11-17-2004   #36
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I'm sorry Vinny I had one of those brain, you know whats, because you know from my posts I think Zack is the leader and the best we have. We are in very bad shape without him. I still think we need to juggle the O-line and see if we can come up with a more effective combination. We have gone half a season with this combination and it hasn't really worked that well. I don't think Wade has done all that they expected either.
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Old 11-17-2004   #37
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Ibar, I understand your concern about Carr's health, and I completely agree with you on the fact that if he can't go without risk of furthering the injury then they MAYBE should think about Banks. However, I think his ankle is fine. It's probably a little tight and stiff with some soreness, but I don't think he is trully injured. If I'm not mistaken, he took off for a run or two to pick up some yards which shows he is moving fine or at least good enough. Maybe Palmer meant they weren't calling as many sprint-out passes because of his ankle, but I too feel that the bad...no horrible running game is the reason for less play action.
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Unless he is hurt you don't bench David Carr. Period.
Even if he was playing on crutches...I'd rather have him back there than Banks.
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Old 11-17-2004   #38
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Vinny, nowhere in my post did I say replace Pitts. I said use Pitts in a different position if Brown couldn't. I think you misunderstood me in that case. I think eveyone recognizies that Pitts and Wiegert are our two best O-linemen and you go from there. Our problem is the 3 others.
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Old 11-17-2004   #39
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Maybe we could trade a draft pick and get Demingo Graham back. I saw Jimmy Herndon washing cars down at Bubbles last weekend, maybe we can get him back too. It's time for a shakeup. Ryan Young's knee is feeling better I think. Maybe he could help us down the stretch run.
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Old 11-17-2004   #40
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I didnt care for Banks when he was with the Rams and now I really dont care for him since he is on my team...I prefer Ragone as my back up QB thank you very much !!!
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