Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQDonate Automatic Monthly Contribution Members List Mark Forums Read


Texans Talk Football talk only please. Keep it to the game, the players, the coaches and management.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-28-2007   #1
DerekLee1
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,298
Rep Power: 1688 DerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Kubiak doesn't need to go, but his coordinators definitely do. Richard Smith and Mike Sherman are awful. There is WAY too much talent on both sides of the ball to suck like this. It's unacceptable. Ahman Green was a HUGE mistake, as was Mario Williams. And I'm sure it was Smith and Sherman fighting to get those guys. Jacoby Jones, Demeco Ryans, Matt Schaub, Amobi Okoye - those guys were Kubiak's picks (along with Rick Smith). Those guys have been stellar.

Sherman's play calling is way too predictable. If Jones isn't lined up, it's a run. If he's on the field, it's a pass. With the talent the receivers have shown, WHY are we still trying to "establish the running game"? Convert this team to a pass-first offense like the Pats and Colts to move the linebackers off the line and open up holes for the running backs. WE DON'T HAVE THE TALENT THAT DENVER HAS HAD. WE CAN'T RUN THE BALL LIKE THEY DO!!!

Our defense is just pathetic. Five first-round picks on that team, and a sixth (Ryans) that is basically another (first pick in the second round). That's over HALF OF YOUR DEFENSE. This should be a top five defense that puts fear in opposing quarterbacks. Yet these awful blitz packages are ALWAYS picked up by the offense, usually for a huge gain. We blitz two guys and STILL have no pressure on the opposing QB. (Remember Kerry Collins to Roydell Williams for a loss after the greatest 4th quarter comeback in NFL history?)

I still think Kubiak is THE guy, but he and Smith need to ditch the "good ol' boys" and hire some young studs as their coordinators. What are Ray Childress, Mike Munchak, and Warren Moon up to these days?

Last edited by DerekLee1; 10-28-2007 at 07:06 PM.
DerekLee1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #2
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,847
Rep Power: 161784 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Most of this is on Kubiak...he hand picked his staff and he prepares the team. Childress is running a car dealership, Munchack is a well respected O-line coach for the Titans (a future head coach) and Moon is doing play by play.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #3
Thorn 
Dirty Old Man
 
Thorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Houston
Section: Restrained in the mental ward
Age: 63
Posts: 22,675
Rep Power: 311116 Thorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

It wouldn't break my heart any to see Richard Smith go. There is two much talent on the defense to be screwing up like this. Then again, a lack of decent defensive backs does limit what you can do.
__________________


"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid." --- John Wayne
Thorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #4
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
 
TexansSeminole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Orlando, FL
Age: 27
Posts: 8,600
Rep Power: 68248 TexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by DerekLee1 View Post
Our defense is just pathetic. Five first-round picks on that team, and a sixth (Ryans) that is basically another (first pick in the second round). That's over HALF OF YOUR DEFENSE. This should be a top five defense that puts fear in opposing quarterbacks. Yet these awful blitz packages are ALWAYS picked up by the offense, usually for a huge gain. We blitz two guys and STILL have no pressure on the opposing QB. (Remember Kerry Collins to Roydell Williams for a loss after the greatest 4th quarter comeback in NFL history?)
I agree. The positioning and timing of our players when we blitz is elementary. David Carr could recognize some of the things we try to do defensively before the snap.
TexansSeminole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #5
Leahmic223
Hall of Fame
 
Leahmic223's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,076
Rep Power: 23 Leahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of FamerLeahmic223 is a Hall of Famer
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Wait wait...what?

WAY too much talent? Where?
Leahmic223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #6
DerekLee1
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,298
Rep Power: 1688 DerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
Most of this is on Kubiak...he hand picked his staff and he prepares the team. Childress is running a car dealership, Munchack is a well respected O-line coach for the Titans (a future head coach) and Moon is doing play by play.
By the time Kubiak picked a defensive coordinator, all the good candidates were off the table. Mike Sherman was a Casserly pick, and another bad one. Kubiak has too much respect for him because he was a former head coach to override him, which is another reason he needs to go. What exactly did he do for Green Bay again anyway? They were contenders before and after his tenure there, and mediocre during. Hmm...mediocrity on a Sherman-coached team? Sound familiar? FIRE HIM.

And give me a 46 defense with this personnel set. Can we get Buddy Ryan out of retirement?
DerekLee1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #7
Thorn 
Dirty Old Man
 
Thorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Houston
Section: Restrained in the mental ward
Age: 63
Posts: 22,675
Rep Power: 311116 Thorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leahmic223 View Post
Wait wait...what?

WAY too much talent? Where?

umm....potential talent? Yeah, I know, they aren't showing a lot right now.
__________________


"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid." --- John Wayne
Thorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
Old 10-28-2007   #8
awtysst
Draft Guru
 
awtysst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,611
Rep Power: 2603 awtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

You know I was thinking.

Anyone notice how the Bears have fallen off defensively this year? Is it coincidence that Ron RIvera, their LB coach is now in SD? I think Rivera would be a great D coordinator and I would love to bring him in.
__________________
Draft Guru: 91.43% accuracy through first 35 picks from 2006-present

I'm Pro Fig Newton, not Cam Newton!
-awtysst on 4/28/2011
awtysst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #9
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
 
TexansSeminole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Orlando, FL
Age: 27
Posts: 8,600
Rep Power: 68248 TexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by awtysst View Post
You know I was thinking.

Anyone notice how the Bears have fallen off defensively this year? Is it coincidence that Ron RIvera, their LB coach is now in SD? I think Rivera would be a great D coordinator and I would love to bring him in.
How in the world do you propose we get this done???
TexansSeminole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #10
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,847
Rep Power: 161784 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by DerekLee1 View Post
Mike Sherman was a Casserly pick, and another bad one. Kubiak has too much respect for him because he was a former head coach to override him, which is another reason he needs to go. What exactly did he do for Green Bay again anyway? They were contenders before and after his tenure there, and mediocre during. Hmm...mediocrity on a Sherman-coached team? Sound familiar? FIRE HIM.
I don't think that is the case, but if it was, then Kubiak isn't the guy I'd want running this team. You have to have a VERY strong personality to run a team full of very strong personalities. Someone has to tell them how the cow ate the cabbage and it needs to be Kubiak.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #11
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,847
Rep Power: 161784 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by awtysst View Post
You know I was thinking.

Anyone notice how the Bears have fallen off defensively this year? Is it coincidence that Ron RIvera, their LB coach is now in SD? I think Rivera would be a great D coordinator and I would love to bring him in.
Rivera was the Bears defensive coordinator.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #12
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
 
TexansSeminole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Orlando, FL
Age: 27
Posts: 8,600
Rep Power: 68248 TexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respectedTexansSeminole is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
I don't think that is the case, but if it was, then Kubiak isn't the guy I'd want running this team. You have to have a VERY strong personality to run a team full of very strong personalities. Someone has to tell them how the cow ate the cabbage and it needs to be Kubiak.
Kubiak should be mad during this press conference. I realize that coaches need to keep their cool, but he needs to show the team that the performance they have shown in the last 3 weeks is not going to be tolerated.
TexansSeminole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #13
NitroGSXR
Super Sic #58
 
NitroGSXR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Annapolis, MD
Age: 38
Posts: 10,855
Rep Power: 64918 NitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by DerekLee1 View Post
And give me a 46 defense with this personnel set. Can we get Buddy Ryan out of retirement?
At least we know that Buddy would have the balls to punch Sherman for his screwups. Maybe even Kubiak.
__________________
Why are you teaching your hearing son ASL? He's not deaf. --Pflugerville Independent School District
NitroGSXR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #14
DerekLee1
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,298
Rep Power: 1688 DerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by awtysst View Post
You know I was thinking.

Anyone notice how the Bears have fallen off defensively this year? Is it coincidence that Ron RIvera, their LB coach is now in SD? I think Rivera would be a great D coordinator and I would love to bring him in.
Rivera would be a great pickup. Or Singletary and/or Buddy Ryan to run the 46 I mentioned earlier.
DerekLee1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #15
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,847
Rep Power: 161784 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by DerekLee1 View Post
Rivera would be a great pickup. Or Singletary and/or Buddy Ryan to run the 46 I mentioned earlier.
Even guys who know and run that defense don't use 46 fronts much. You have to have elite talent or it's just too unsound. Williams in Washington is using more cover2 shell now and his defense has improved this year.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #16
NitroGSXR
Super Sic #58
 
NitroGSXR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Annapolis, MD
Age: 38
Posts: 10,855
Rep Power: 64918 NitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respectedNitroGSXR is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
Even guys who know and run that defense don't use 46 fronts much. You have to have elite talent or it's just too unsound. Williams in Washington is using more cover2 shell now and his defense has improved this year.
How did that work out for him today?
__________________
Why are you teaching your hearing son ASL? He's not deaf. --Pflugerville Independent School District
NitroGSXR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #17
Runner
Hubcap Diamond
 
Runner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 8,000
Rep Power: 72472 Runner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respectedRunner is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by DerekLee1 View Post
Mike Sherman was a Casserly pick, and another bad one.
a) Absolutely not. Sherman was Kubiak's guy.

b) After Moulds, Flanagan, Salaam, Bedell, Black, Gado, Dayne, Weaver, and yes Mario, it is about time to lose the "it was Casserly's pick" excuse.
__________________
Amy glances out the window; her hair, skin, and clothes take on a pronounced reddish tinge from Doppler effect as she drops out of the conversation at relativistic velocity. - Cryptonomicon
Runner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #18
DerekLee1
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,298
Rep Power: 1688 DerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respectedDerekLee1 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
Even guys who know and run that defense don't use 46 fronts much. You have to have elite talent or it's just too unsound. Williams in Washington is using more cover2 shell now and his defense has improved this year.
You don't need all-around elite talent. Speedy, intelligent middle linebacker? Check. Front four with pass rush ability? Check (although unsuccessful in these schemes). Secondary with speed to be able to blitz? Check. Two solid cover corners? Oh, wait...maybe we do have a problem.
DerekLee1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #19
awtysst
Draft Guru
 
awtysst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,611
Rep Power: 2603 awtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respectedawtysst is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
Rivera was the Bears defensive coordinator.
You are correct. Think he would like to be a Def coordinator in Htown?
__________________
Draft Guru: 91.43% accuracy through first 35 picks from 2006-present

I'm Pro Fig Newton, not Cam Newton!
-awtysst on 4/28/2011
awtysst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2007   #20
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,847
Rep Power: 161784 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kubiak stays, coordinators GO

Quote:
Originally Posted by NitroHonda View Post
How did that work out for him today?
Name one team that has stopped the Pats this year and you win the prize.

Show me one team in the NFL that uses 46 fronts for their base defense....you won't be able to because nobody uses these fronts except in a package or two here and there.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ad Management by RedTyger