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Old 10-01-2007   #41
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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QB's step up into the pocket because that is what they are supposed to do.
When the pressure comes from the inside why would a sane QB step up? Wouldn't it make sense for that QB to move left or right to evade the DT coming through?

If you want to give Amobi all the credit fine, do so. But don't say Mario isn't doing anything, the guy is doing the same thing he did the first game, its just that the first game he got 2 sacks. The DLine are doing well as a unit, once again where is this dline where one guy gets all the sacks?

I keep thinking and all the elite DEs and DTs almost always have another good DT or DE playing on the same line. Its very hard for one DE or DT to rack up 10+ sacks a year by himself.
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Old 10-01-2007   #42
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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When the pressure comes from the inside why would a sane QB step up? Wouldn't it make sense for that QB to move left or right to evade the DT coming through?
No, if the QB does that he has created a situation for the DE to get to the QB easier. The very basic idea for the OL is to stay in between the QB and the pass rusher. If the QB steps left or right to evade the DT he is moving out of the pocket creating a situation where a DE can shed a block much easier and get to him. Of course, there are times when this works quite well and there are QBs who specialize in doing this (ala Brett Favre and what looks like Tony Romo now).

Stepping up in the pocket is something all QBs must be able to do because pass rushers take wide angles of pursuit toward the QB, usually attacking him from the side or from behind. Good thing about Okoye is he punishes QBs when they do this. That's what we need. Maybe some of these QBs will feel forced to roll out because of pressure up the middle and our DEs can chase them down. We seem to allow QBs to sit in the pocket for far too long. This year we have been much better than the last in pressuring QBs out of the pocket. Alot of this is due to Amobi.
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Old 10-01-2007   #43
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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When the pressure comes from the inside why would a sane QB step up?
Because he understand how to play his position.


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Wouldn't it make sense for that QB to move left or right to evade the DT coming through?
Depends on your definition of "move".
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Old 10-01-2007   #44
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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No, if the QB does that he has created a situation for the DE to get to the QB easier. The very basic idea for the OL is to stay in between the QB and the pass rusher. If the QB steps left or right to evade the DT he is moving out of the pocket creating a situation where a DE can shed a block much easier and get to him. Of course, there are times when this works quite well and there are QBs who specialize in doing this (ala Brett Favre and what looks like Tony Romo now).
That is why I say, he wouldn't need to step up if the DEs are getting handled.

There are a lot of varibles and it all contributes to pocket presence overall.

If the DT breaks through and the DEs are getting handled, then he has no choice but to roll out.

My point is if the DEs are not doing there job and Amobi is doing everything like real suggest then he would roll out, Amobi's not coming from the outside he coming from the front so if he was the only one doing anything why would the QB go in his direction?
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Old 10-01-2007   #45
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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That is why I say, he wouldn't need to step up if the DEs are getting handled.

There are a lot of varibles and it all contributes to pocket presence overall.

If the DT breaks through and the DEs are getting handled, then he has no choice but to roll out.

My point is if the DEs are not doing there job and Amobi is doing everything like real suggest then he would roll out, Amobi's not coming from the outside he coming from the front so if he was the only one doing anything why would the QB go in his direction?
Bottom line: When the QB breaks out of the pocket it becomes much easier to get to him. Therefore no matter what players are on the defensive line it is in the QBs best interest to not roll out, unless of course he is good at it.
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Old 10-01-2007   #46
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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Bottom line: When the QB breaks out of the pocket it becomes much easier to get to him. Therefore no matter what players are on the defensive line it is in the QBs best interest to not roll out, unless of course he is good at it.
I agree with that, but there was a reason why I saw Peyton rolling out against us and throwing a ball out of bounds when we played the Colts. When they need to, they will do it.

I just don't get this "Amobi's doing everything" and "Hes the only guy playing hard." mentality, I am sorry I just don't see that.
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Old 10-01-2007   #47
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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I agree with that, but there was a reason why I saw Peyton rolling out against us and throwing a ball out of bounds when we played the Colts. When they need to, they will do it.

I just don't get this "Amobi's doing everything" and "Hes the only guy playing hard." mentality, I am sorry I just don't see that.
I dont see it either.

I think the Peyton deal is just him making a play. I doubt it was in the gameplan. He probably just saw open space.
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Old 10-01-2007   #48
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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I just don't get this "Amobi's doing everything" and "Hes the only guy playing hard." mentality, I am sorry I just don't see that.
Wow...Talk about flipping the script....

All I said was that Mario doesn't deserve major credit for what Amobi is doing.

I never said everyone else sucks.

Football is a very gray area kinda sport. Everything doesn't fit neatly into a box.

Because I say Mario doesn't deserve a great deal of credit for Amobi's success doesn't mean I think Mario hasn't helped at all, or that I think Mario sucks.

I just think Amobi deserves credit for what he has done and when you say he has succeded because of "so and so" it diminishes how good HE actually is.
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Old 10-01-2007   #49
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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Wow...Talk about flipping the script....

All I said was that Mario doesn't deserve major credit for what Amobi is doing.

I never said everyone else sucks.

Football is a very gray area kinda sport. Everything doesn't fit neatly into a box.

Because I say Mario doesn't deserve a great deal of credit for Amobi's success doesn't mean I think Mario hasn't helped at all, or that I think Mario sucks.

I just think Amobi deserves credit for what he has done and when you say he has succeded because of "so and so" it diminishes how good HE actually is.
And I've never said Amobi success is because of Mario. The very first thing I said when I entered this thread was "Of course Amobi's succeeding because of what he's doing." So maybe you misunderstood where I am coming from and vice versa.

Amobi's works hard and wants to be the best at what he does obviously, and the same can be said for Mario. I just am saying Mario is doing good to, he's doing what he's supposed to and I think everyone of those guys (Dline) would have more sacks if the secondary could actually prevent guys from getting open within 1 second.

Harrington was pressured, but guys were open WAY too soon.
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Old 10-01-2007   #50
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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Harrington was pressured, but guys were open WAY too soon.
On the actual play that Amobi go the sack, Harrington had no where to throw the ball. Or atleast he didn't see anyone open.

If anyone gets credit for that sack it our terrible DB's.
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Old 10-01-2007   #51
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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Because he understand how to play his position.



Depends on your definition of "move".

Yeah, but doing what makes sense in game situations & knowing what kind of Qb you are trump what you might've been taught in practice situations. There is no textbook on how much & what way you should move. Favre Mcnabb & now Romo & VY are making plays moving which ever way they can to avoid pressure, while Brady & manning & palmer might move just enough to get the ball off safely.

It just boils down to what's going on in the game, how you're being pressured & what type of Qb you are.
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Old 10-01-2007   #52
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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It just boils down to what's going on in the game & what type of Qb you are.

Not gonna argue with you guys anymore...

It was fun while it lasted though.


We can just chalk it up to real not having a clue.


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Old 10-01-2007   #53
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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On the actual play that Amobi go the sack, Harrington had no where to throw the ball. Or atleast he didn't see anyone open.

If anyone gets credit for that sack it our terrible DB's.
I hope you're not going to defend the DBs and Safeties. Obviously our defensive gameplan was to pressure Harrington...we did, thing is he picked up on it and destroyed us with 5 yard dinks for the whole game. The Secondary has to hold up longer. I agree with Amobi being a stud though he may be better than Mario when its all said and done, but Mario's doing his job is what I am saying.
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Old 10-01-2007   #54
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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Not gonna argue with you guys anymore...

It was fun while it lasted though.


We can just chalk it up to real not having a clue.


I see what your saying. Don't worry.

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I hope you're not going to defend the DBs and Safeties. Obviously our defensive gameplan was to pressure Harrington...we did, thing is he picked up on it and destroyed us with 5 yard dinks for the whole game. The Secondary has to hold up longer. I agree with Amobi being a stud though he may be better than Mario when its all said and done, but Mario's doing his job is what I am saying.
I don't understand why people compare players so often...especially players on the same team. What is the point in doing this?

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Old 10-01-2007   #55
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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I see what your saying. Don't worry.



I don't understand why people compare playsers so often...especially players on the same team. What is the point in doing this?
I only like to compare guys that play similar position no matter what team they are on. But you hardly if ever will see a statement like this from me "Mario is a better player than Demeco or Dunta." I am not really into the business of comparing two completely different positions. I know there were many people comparing a RB and a QB to a DE though a while back. Even to the point where a sack equals a touchdown and such nonsense.

But I didn't mean to compare Amobi and Mario, I think they are equally important to the success of our defense and I think Travis plays a part in it too.
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Old 10-01-2007   #56
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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I see what your saying. Don't worry.



I don't understand why people compare players so often...especially players on the same team. What is the point in doing this?
I see what he's saying too, but i doubt coaches would frown upon a guy not moving around in the pocket the way they taught him in practice as long as he's making plays. It's one of those "if it ain't broke don't fix it" things.
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Old 10-01-2007   #57
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I see what he's saying too, but i doubt coaches would frown upon a guy not moving around in the pocket the way they taught him in practice as long as he's making plays. It's one of those "if it ain't broke don't fix it" things.
I think you should first understand the discussion.

We are talking about our DE's (mainly Mario) being the reason for Amobi's success.

Someone asked a question about why the QB's are stepping up and not escaping the pocket by rolling out. They said the QB should be rolling out if the pressure is coming from up the middle.


My answer was that, that isn't true. Most starting QB's in the leauge step up into the pocket regardless.
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Old 10-01-2007   #58
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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Wow...Talk about flipping the script....

All I said was that Mario doesn't deserve major credit for what Amobi is doing.

I never said everyone else sucks.

Football is a very gray area kinda sport. Everything doesn't fit neatly into a box.

Because I say Mario doesn't deserve a great deal of credit for Amobi's success doesn't mean I think Mario hasn't helped at all, or that I think Mario sucks.

I just think Amobi deserves credit for what he has done and when you say he has succeded because of "so and so" it diminishes how good HE actually is.


And you got ten guys on the board telling you : you are dead wrong. A lesser man would of got it by now. If they the DE's are being taught, coached not to give up the edge of the pocket and let the rookie split the double teams and soak his bread in the gray, that's not a point that the DE's suck. All that means is the kid is getting the stats. The pass rush is night and day from the frist four years. they are getting consitant pressure every passing play.
and I haven't counted them up but there have been many plays this season so far where the DEs have flushed the QB and the DT finishs him off. He will get credit with a pro bowl ballot. But neither do we need to throw the DE's under the buss for doing what they are being told to do.
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Old 10-01-2007   #59
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Default Re: Thoughts on why Okoye is our Sack leader ?

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I think you should first understand the discussion.

We are talking about our DE's (mainly Mario) being the reason for Amobi's success.

Someone asked a question about why the QB's are stepping up and not escaping the pocket by rolling out. They said the QB should be rolling out if the pressure is coming from up the middle.


My answer was that, that isn't true. Most starting QB's in the leauge step up into the pocket regardless.

but i don't wanna talk about that, b/c this is much more interesting.....LOL, j/jk

Nah, i know what the thread is about, i commented on it earlier, & i agree with what you're saying for the most part but i also agree with Leahmic somewhat as well, That's all.

Amobi's doing his thing
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Old 10-01-2007   #60
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And you got ten guys on the board telling you : you are dead wrong. A lesser man would of got it by now. If they the DE's are being taught, coached not to give up the edge of the pocket and let the rookie split the double teams and soak his bread in the gray, that's not a point that the DE's suck. All that means is the kid is getting the stats. The pass rush is night and day from the frist four years. they are getting consitant pressure every passing play.
and I haven't counted them up but there have been many play this season so far where the DEs have flushed the QB and the DT finishs him off. He will get credit with a pro bowl ballot. But neither do we need to throw the DE's under the buss for doing what they are being told to do.

You are SO right.

What was I thinking ?!!
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