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Old 05-01-2007   #1
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Default "Doing A Line" article at houstonprofootball.com

http://www.houstonprofootball.com/review/review67.html

Interesting read, even though I strongly disagree with it.

http://www.houstonprofootball.com/fo...55&postcount=2
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Old 05-01-2007   #2
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Nice reply!
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Old 05-01-2007   #3
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Well, he certainly presents what is the minority view at this time. Maybe that'll change if the Texans still can't run a 7 or even 5 step drop pass play with any consistency next year.

Then again, maybe the Texans will prove a successful team needs four blue chip lineman on the dline and can cobble together an o-line out of a couple of high end players and spare parts because it's the Denver way.

Next season will be very interesting. I predict an offense weighted toward the run lke the end of last year, with a somewhat more successful passing game due to the QB change. I don't think they'll have a complete deep passing game due to lingering line problems.

I think the defense will be much improved and be the backbone of the team.
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Old 05-01-2007   #4
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He forgot to mention the New England Patriots whose defensive line consists of nothing but first round picks.
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Old 05-01-2007   #5
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Man, that's brutal. Potentially, what he said could be true. Obviously I hope not, but with our d-line last year, we didn't put much consistent pressure on the QB. Will Okoye make all the difference?

I think a healthy Mario will be a difference, too. Man do I hope he's got an inner fire that's burning with desire to prove himself in the face of negativity and doubt. We've got some solid defenders, especially with DeMeco as the centerpiece. So you could just as easily argue the opposite of what this article is saying, because it's all based on unknowns.
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Old 05-01-2007   #6
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And the Doomsday D with Harvey Marin, Ed Jones and Randy White drafted in subsequent years.
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Old 05-01-2007   #7
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Many of the most successful teams seem to be weighted to being strong on one side of the ball and great on other. I don't think there is one answer, and I don't know how easily that can be controlled given the unpredicatbility of players translating from college to the NFL. At some point the strong side becomes stronger from its own momentum - good players become better when surrounded by success.

At this point it appears the Texans may be giving their defense more of a chance to be the stronger side. It seems odd from an offensive minded head coach. Maybe they evaluated everything and decided they could build a strong defense more quickly as they tore down and rebuilt the offense. That way they get quicker improvement while building for the long term.

Just a theory.
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Old 05-01-2007   #8
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I guess he can't see the contradiction he is presenting.
He says you don't want to blitz Peyton because of his quick release, and you just don't want to blitz VY, period...
I don't know what that has to do with drafting a DT, or having a dominant line, but I can tell you the only way to get to a quarterback without blitzing is to have a good pass rushing DL...
Unless he is saying we shouldn't want to get to the QB at all????
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Old 05-01-2007   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Runner View Post
Many of the most successful teams seem to be weighted to being strong on one side of the ball and great on other. I don't think there is one answer, and I don't know how easily that can be controlled given the unpredicatbility of players translating from college to the NFL. At some point the strong side becomes stronger from its own momentum - good players become better when surrounded by success.

At this point it appears the Texans may be giving their defense more of a chance to be the stronger side. It seems odd from an offensive minded head coach. Maybe they evaluated everything and decided they could build a strong defense more quickly as they tore down and rebuilt the offense. That way they get quicker improvement while building for the long term.

Just a theory.
Maybe Kubiak thinks he can do more with less on offense... he might feel that since he is an offensive minded coach, he will need better personnel on the D to achieve the same level of success he can get out of the O through his own skill...
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Old 05-02-2007   #10
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I just think Bob was irritated that his player wasn't taken with the 10th pick, which so happened to be an offensive player, whether it was Adrian Peterson, who was gone already, or Ted Ginn, who was gone already, or Levi Brown, who was gone already.

Who did that leave, offensive player wise, that would NOT have been a huge reach at 10?

It's not a stretch to think that maybe, just maybe, Kubiak and Smith had Akoye rated as the BPA, after the other players had been taken.

But noooooo . . . Bob thinks they are "obsessed" with the defensive line.
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Old 05-02-2007   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
I just think Bob was irritated that his player wasn't taken with the 10th pick, which so happened to be an offensive player, whether it was Adrian Peterson, who was gone already, or Ted Ginn, who was gone already, or Levi Brown, who was gone already.

Who did that leave, offensive player wise, that would NOT have been a huge reach at 10?

It's not a stretch to think that maybe, just maybe, Kubiak and Smith had Akoye rated as the BPA, after the other players had been taken.

But noooooo . . . Bob thinks they are "obsessed" with the defensive line.
I believe in that assessment. I think Okoye was there top rated defensive player that was left. I would guess that Landry was at the very top though. It's funny that Atlanta is praised for taking Anderson at 8...
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Old 05-02-2007   #12
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Texans OL draft .

Pitts 2nd rd
Weary 3rd rd
Wand 3rd rd
Hodgon 5th rd
Spencer 3rd rd
Winston 3rd rd
Brown sup

Free Agents

Mckinney
Wade
Salaam
Black
Weigert
Flannigan

I don't know who else off the top of my head but you figure 5 of these guys could play .
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Old 05-02-2007   #13
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Dude, your response "rocked the house. Big time." I could not agree more.

Also, it is good to find this forum again. I much prefer this format to the new boards at the revamped texans website.
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Old 05-02-2007   #14
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Originally Posted by Runner View Post
It seems odd from an offensive minded head coach.
See, I think just the opposite. I like a HC who says I know one side best so I will put more talent on the other side and do my coaching magic where I am an expert. Look at what Jimmy Johnson did or at how Dungy consistently makes do with less money and stars on the D. Capers violated the pooch by doing the opposite and over controlling the O and ignoring Fangio not running the D the way he would have.
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Old 05-02-2007   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelm View Post
I guess he can't see the contradiction he is presenting.
He says you don't want to blitz Peyton because of his quick release, and you just don't want to blitz VY, period...
I don't know what that has to do with drafting a DT, or having a dominant line, but I can tell you the only way to get to a quarterback without blitzing is to have a good pass rushing DL...
Unless he is saying we shouldn't want to get to the QB at all????
Exactly.

This is what I wrote on the thread:

Quote:
Yeah, the Texans have taken Dline in the first round the last four years. And yeah, they have a lot of salary cap money allocated that way.

However, Babin/TJ should almost not count because a. they were chosen for a 3-4, b. Casserly admitted at the time that he had difficulties drafting for the 3-4.

The Texans started street free agents as DT for most of the season. I remember the game where I saw two TJ's on the field for the first time and going who the @#$% is Thomas Johnson??? (a practice squader from Dallas, IIRC).

People commended Rick Smith for being able to find all these street free agents to play defensive tackle, but there's not much of a surprise that the Texans didn't have much of a pass rush if you play street free agents for your tackles for most of the season.

Okoye is a good pick for BPA.

Okoye is a good pick for need.

BTW, IIRC, during the 2004 season, the Houston Texans had the most expensive offensive line in the league. Didn't help.

You can't draft or sign what isn't there. 2007 was not a deep offensive linemen draft, but was a deep defensive linemen draft. As it relates to the offensive line this offseason, I can't think of a move that they should have made on the offensive line that they didn't.
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Old 05-02-2007   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
See, I think just the opposite. I like a HC who says I know one side best so I will put more talent on the other side and do my coaching magic where I am an expert. Look at what Jimmy Johnson did or at how Dungy consistently makes do with less money and stars on the D. Capers violated the pooch by doing the opposite and over controlling the O and ignoring Fangio not running the D the way he would have.
Amen brother.

And this is typical Denver thinking. Take defense high in the draft unless their is an offense player that you really think you can work with, and then take system offense players lower.

Kubiak obviously has a lot of confidence that he can do what he wants to do on the offensive side of the ball, but figures he needs to get the defense all the help they can get.
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Old 05-02-2007   #17
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He had me until he said Scarface was laughably bad
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Old 05-02-2007   #18
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In my point of view your defense linemen are better athletes than the OL ... why because they have to read and react . So aside from OLTs they get picked higher than most OL .

The OL knows the play so they have to execute . The LTs get picked high because they have to be athletic enough to handle an edge rusher on most QBs blind side .

The best OL in my opinion in recent history was the 90's Cowboys ( ouch ... that hurts ) . Anyone know how they were built .

Mark Tuinie (sp ) drafted as a DT moved to OT .
Nate Newton ... drafted by the Redskins , cut by the Redskins , USFL , Cowboys as a FA .
Mark Stepnoski ... drafted 3rd round .
Larry Allen ... drafted 2nd round .
Erik Williams ... drafted third round

Anyone see a 1st round pick here . I'll bet if you looked up the DL you'll find Jimmy Johnson had some 1st round picks on it .

I looked it up ... in the 90's the Cowboys drafted 6 defensive linemen in the 1st round while drafting 0 offensive linemen
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Old 05-02-2007   #19
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Originally Posted by Honoring Earl 34 View Post
In my point of view your defense linemen are better athletes than the OL ... why because they have to read and react . So aside from OLTs they get picked higher than most OL .

The OL knows the play so they have to execute . The LTs get picked high because they have to be athletic enough to handle an edge rusher on most QBs blind side .

The best OL in my opinion in recent history was the 90's Cowboys ( ouch ... that hurts ) . Anyone know how they were built .

Mark Tuinie (sp ) drafted as a DT moved to OT .
Nate Newton ... drafted by the Redskins , cut by the Redskins , USFL , Cowboys as a FA .
Mark Stepnoski ... drafted 3rd round .
Larry Allen ... drafted 2nd round .
Erik Williams ... drafted third round

Anyone see a 1st round pick here . I'll bet if you looked up the DL you'll find Jimmy Johnson had some 1st round picks on it .

I looked it up ... in the 90's the Cowboys drafted 6 defensive linemen in the 1st round while drafting 0 offensive linemen
You mean Dr. Z didn't bash the Cowboys for ignoring the line?

Great post btw!
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Old 05-02-2007   #20
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You mean Dr. Z didn't bash the Cowboys for ignoring the line?

Great post btw!
No but Buddy Ryan sure gave him hell . Remember the bounty bowl .

Of course in a couple of years thanks to the Vikings the Cowboys were the most talented team ( ouch again ) in the NFL .
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