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Blazing Arrow's "Rivalry Talk" Rival fans & lighthearted smack talk. Keep it light and leave the mean spirited stuff at home please.

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Old 05-10-2007   #41
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Originally Posted by ledzeppelin229 View Post
Not everyone that was sick of Carr was a UT homer that cried themselves to sleep when Mario was picked.
How about after the 39 yard run in OT?
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Old 05-10-2007   #42
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Old 05-10-2007   #43
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Originally Posted by xtruroyaltyx View Post
David Carr is going to suffer wherever he goes...

I'm not even going to call the guy mediocre...that ship has sailed...I no longer have to be civil because Hulk is here...

David Carr was terrible...He's a seperate entity from the O-line...

Yes the O-line had their faults, but what does that have to do with David's ? It's
You do not have to be civil when talking about his football execution, or lack there of. At least you do not make it personnal.
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Old 06-13-2007   #44
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

How would the Carr situation have played out had the Texans taken Bush or Da'Brick in last years draft? Williams will be a fine player but DE shouldn't have been top of your need list.

Delhomme has a habit of disappearing mid season So it isn't much of a leap to see Carr starting for Carolina at some point this coming season.

It's definately going to be interesting to see how Schaub performs behind your Line & if Carr will be any different behind the Panthers line.
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Old 06-13-2007   #45
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by ChildressTitanMan View Post
How would the Carr situation have played out had the Texans taken Bush or Da'Brick in last years draft? Williams will be a fine player but DE shouldn't have been top of your need list.

Delhomme has a habit of disappearing mid season So it isn't much of a leap to see Carr starting for Carolina at some point this coming season.

It's definately going to be interesting to see how Schaub performs behind your Line & if Carr will be any different behind the Panthers line.
I don't think having Bush or D'Brick would have had a huge impact on the Carr situation. And if anything, it would have been worse.

D'Brick gave up more sacks last year than our LT did. I think D'Brick is going to be a good LT but he wasn't a great one last year.

And, personally, I think Bush would have had problems. We needed an every down back and Bush needs to be a slash type of player. Bush started off slow last season and really wasn't good in the running game. If we had drafted him and with Domanick not coming back from injury, we would have needed RB to be an every down back and he would have failed miserably. Bush did much, much better as a receiver out of the backfield. But even then, he had to be fed the ball A LOT and he made a lot of negative or 0 yard plays. We wouldn't have had enough balls to give to him and to AJ.

So, I think if we had drafted either D'Brick (which is who I wanted to pick) or RB, we actually would have been worse off.
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Old 06-13-2007   #46
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by ChildressTitanMan View Post
How would the Carr situation have played out had the Texans taken Bush or Da'Brick in last years draft? Williams will be a fine player but DE shouldn't have been top of your need list.
Better players won't fix mediocrity. Carr's problems - many a result of starting on an expansion team in his rookie year - are now far beyond just giving him a better team. Reading defenses and making adjustments, pocket presence, timing patterns, throwing down the middle, clutch play...these are things that are in the head, not in physical skills. And at this point in his career, many of Carr's problems are in his head.

As far as DE is concerned, the philosophy was that being in Manning's division means we'll need a solid pass rush. Obviously it's a 'time will tell' situation at this point.
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Old 06-13-2007   #47
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
And at this point in his career, many of Carr's problems are in his head.
True.

Bad habits are hard to fix once they're ingrained. It undoubtedly hurt his development starting out with a new franchise.

One thing that is for sure is that he was done in Houston. I don't think any amount of new players around him would have restored his confidence. The same was said of Steve Young when he left TB though.

I'm not saying Carr could ever compare to Young but that sometimes guys can turn a career around.
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Old 06-13-2007   #48
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by ChildressTitanMan View Post
True.

Bad habits are hard to fix once they're ingrained. It undoubtedly hurt his development starting out with a new franchise.

One thing that is for sure is that he was done in Houston. I don't think any amount of new players around him would have restored his confidence. The same was said of Steve Young when he left TB though.

I'm not saying Carr could ever compare to Young but that sometimes guys can turn a career around.
I will take an educated guess when you say young that you are referring to vince and not Steve, but you say it like vy has been in the league 5 years and not just one year. But they do compare in one stat .. they both threw one more int than TD.

All I am saying is if you are goig to compare QBs, please use someone who has been in the league longer than only one season.
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Old 06-13-2007   #49
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
D'Brick gave up more sacks last year than our LT did. I think D'Brick is going to be a good LT but he wasn't a great one last year.
D'Brick was also blocking for an NFL style passing attack.


But hey - give the Jets a call. Salaam for D'Brick, straight up, unless we can get a late round draft pick too.
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Old 06-13-2007   #50
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
I don't think having Bush or D'Brick would have had a huge impact on the Carr situation. And if anything, it would have been worse.
I think Bush would have helped Carr in the fact he would have had an outlet he currently does/did not have. Bush had 70+ rec with a heafty YAC. If the LB has to watch the back they are not going to be able to focus on the Qb as much and you will get less pressure. But I also think that would have been a stop gap until you eventually had to get rid of Carr.
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Old 06-13-2007   #51
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by Specnatz View Post
I will take an educated guess when you say young that you are referring to vince and not Steve, but you say it like vy has been in the league 5 years and not just one year. But they do compare in one stat .. they both threw one more int than TD.

All I am saying is if you are goig to compare QBs, please use someone who has been in the league longer than only one season.

Im pretty sure he was talking about steve young, cause vince had nothing to do with tampa bay.

dont just go out of your way to bash vince unless its called for, he's just saying that someone has turned a career around and become one of the better QBs to play the game after a bad start, much like David. Is it going to happen to carr? probably not, not enough fire in him to fuel a turnaround of that proportion, but its possible.

just not very likely
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Old 06-13-2007   #52
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by Il_Bruno View Post
Im pretty sure he was talking about steve young, cause vince had nothing to do with tampa bay.

dont just go out of your way to bash vince unless its called for, he's just saying that someone has turned a career around and become one of the better QBs to play the game after a bad start, much like David. Is it going to happen to carr? probably not, not enough fire in him to fuel a turnaround of that proportion, but its possible.

just not very likely
It was a joke badly done but only a joke.
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Old 06-13-2007   #53
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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I think Bush would have helped Carr in the fact he would have had an outlet he currently does/did not have. Bush had 70+ rec with a heafty YAC. If the LB has to watch the back they are not going to be able to focus on the Qb as much and you will get less pressure. But I also think that would have been a stop gap until you eventually had to get rid of Carr.
Carr didn't have a problem throwing to an outlet receiver. In fact, that was his biggest problem. He wasn't going through his reads in a lot of instances and just throwing it to the dumpoff.

Bush got 3.6 yards per carry behind an offensive line that was probably blocking better than ours was. If he had been with us, we would have needed him to be the #1 option running instead of a decoy. He would have been destroyed.

And in the passing game, he wouldn't have gotten 70+ receptions with us. As it was, we threw 88 passes to our RB's and the Saints threw over 140. The Saints had so many options working (Colston, Henderson, Horne) that they could afford to keep feeding RB the ball until he broke one.
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Old 06-13-2007   #54
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
Carr didn't have a problem throwing to an outlet receiver. In fact, that was his biggest problem. He wasn't going through his reads in a lot of instances and just throwing it to the dumpoff.

Bush got 3.6 yards per carry behind an offensive line that was probably blocking better than ours was. If he had been with us, we would have needed him to be the #1 option running instead of a decoy. He would have been destroyed.

And in the passing game, he wouldn't have gotten 70+ receptions with us. As it was, we threw 88 passes to our RB's and the Saints threw over 140. The Saints had so many options working (Colston, Henderson, Horne) that they could afford to keep feeding RB the ball until he broke one.
But Carr was not outletting to Bush. If he had Bush to outlet to the spead and the spread would have helped you guys out allot. Carr was shell shocked the last could of seasons. You put a speed back like Bush in there with Dayne as the heavy back I think it would have helped your O-line.

You also have to look at who the Saints had at RB. Bush and McCallister (rookie stud and proven back) vs Dayne and Lundy (bust and 6th round rookie).

True he could not have been an every down back and there is some weight to that but in the end he was a good outlet. For a struggling O-line getting the ball out quickly is key. Bush in the open field was amazing last season. Screens and outlets give that opportunity.
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Old 06-14-2007   #55
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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Originally Posted by Il_Bruno View Post
Im pretty sure he was talking about steve young, cause vince had nothing to do with tampa bay.

dont just go out of your way to bash vince unless its called for, he's just saying that someone has turned a career around and become one of the better QBs to play the game after a bad start, much like David. Is it going to happen to carr? probably not, not enough fire in him to fuel a turnaround of that proportion, but its possible.

just not very likely
Your right on the money dude.

Specnatz secret homer side got the better of him.
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Old 06-14-2007   #56
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

I was a trade down guy last season, but I will admit that I started thinking about what we could do with DD/W and Bush in the same backfield when it started looking like we were going to take Bush. At that time I still had faith in Carr and thought DD/W was going to play for us and not spend the season on IR. The Mario pick did throw me off, but I have long since warmed to the idea of building a dominating D starting with the guys up. If we have gotten better production out of TJ and Babin we may not have felt the need to to go with Mario last season, but at this point it doesn't really matter. Babin for all his faults is still a player with upside and while he was like 67th in the league in sacks last season he still lead our lousey pass rush in sacks. TJ may be relegated to quality depth now, but without depth your line will severly suffer when it loses players to injury, like ours did last season. On paper, atleast we have the makings of a D that should climb the charts from last offseason. IF our D can give our O a shorter field to work with and IF Shaub can actually see some one besides AJ 3 yards down field we should get more yards. Just as an example. In the Titans games we lost by 6 points. One of those in OT. IF we would have held the Titans back a few yards once on D and prevented a FG we would have won the game. We would now be sitting here with the same record as the Titans because then both teams would be 7-9. Would it have been anything to brag about? No. Still in a game measured by yards you have to prevent the other team from getting yards. We have made strides this offseason toward preventing the other team from getting yards. If our D gells maybe we can start spending the higher draft picks on O. We could even spend a 1st next season on the best available RB, WR, or OT. Who knows.

LET THE GAMES BEGIN.
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Old 06-14-2007   #57
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But Carr was not outletting to Bush. If he had Bush to outlet to the spead and the spread would have helped you guys out allot. Carr was shell shocked the last could of seasons. You put a speed back like Bush in there with Dayne as the heavy back I think it would have helped your O-line.

You also have to look at who the Saints had at RB. Bush and McCallister (rookie stud and proven back) vs Dayne and Lundy (bust and 6th round rookie).

True he could not have been an every down back and there is some weight to that but in the end he was a good outlet. For a struggling O-line getting the ball out quickly is key. Bush in the open field was amazing last season. Screens and outlets give that opportunity.
Bush benefited from having offensive talent around him. In the Saints offense you can't key on Reggie. He'd have been keyed on here. You can give David Carr 3 pro-bowl recievers, a pro-bowl OL and a stud RB, and he still would be bad. David's problems have nothing to do with the talent around him, though it didn't help. David's problems have to do with mechanics, footwork, and timing...He is a nervouse guy in the pocket and it shows...He's indecisive...VERY POOR at making pre-snap reads....Poor Game manager...He gets too high with the good times, and too low with the bad....he's inconsistent...Can't escape pressure....Can't make throws when being pressured...has no feel for the pressure....does a poor job holding on to the ball when hit...Leadership skills are lacking...Confidence issues...doesn't take it upon himself to will his team to win....does a poor job leading recievers...does a poor job reading defenses which cause hardly any balls thrown over the middle or over 10 yards...Pretty much has to be told exactly what to do or he gets flustered and indecisive...I could go on and on about Mr. Carr...

He's a good guy (really a shame that I have to preface my sentence with that, and btw that is the last time as it is not relevant), but his footall skills, past his natural ability, is invisible. The only thing posotive you can say about David is that he has all the physical tools (which a lot of guys who weren't picked #1 overall have) and go down memory lane regarding his college stats...I really doubt David does well in Panther land because I just think he is a bad football player...no crime with that...he can help society in other ways...

But if he does do well, I will honestly admire him for getting over such adverity.
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Old 06-14-2007   #58
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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We have made strides this offseason toward preventing the other team from getting yards. If our D gells maybe we can start spending the higher draft picks on O. We could even spend a 1st next season on the best available RB, WR, or OT. Who knows.
I think this has been Houston's problem all along. Either build a solid D or O & work forward from that. You now have a shot at finishing the job on the D side of things.
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Old 06-14-2007   #59
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young

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I think this has been Houston's problem all along. Either build a solid D or O & work forward from that. You now have a shot at finishing the job on the D side of things.
Thats the criticism I have had. I think what skews it though, is that the C&C factory were all over the place. But overall I agree, pick a side of the ball to focus on, and you can still sprinkle in some picks on the other side of the ball.

Remember, for the Texans, this is Rick Smith's first draft class.
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Old 06-14-2007   #60
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Default Re: Carr-Schwab-Williams-Young



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