John Murphy on Thomas v. Brown

[Errant Hothy]

Good read:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_yl...yhoo&type=lgns

There is a group of evaluators that believe Thomas compares more with an Adam Meadows or Jeff Backus in their prime than a Jonathan Ogden. In fact, there's talk that Central Michigan’s Joe Staley has impressed evaluators so much that some teams have explored the idea of dropping down or trading up for him instead of using a high pick on Thomas.

However, should the light bulb ever go to full wattage, he (Levi Brown) has the natural skill level to become similar to young All-Pro tackle Jamaal Brown. If not, he will play up and down for a team that has likely expended a high pick for his services

I know I'm one of the few here who think Brown should be the pick at 10, but the more I read about Thomas the more I think he's going to be more like Gross and Gallery then Pace. Or is this all "so close to the draft nit-picking"?

Also Murphy's blog about the Texans:
http://nfldraftbible.blogspot.com/se...&max-results=7

Monday, April 16, 2007
MOCK DRAFT TWO-A-DAYS #10: HOUSTON TEXANS
BY DANIEL MOGOLLON

Record: 6-10: Selection: Tenth Overall

Team Needs: OT, WR, DB: Unless they want the Matt Schaub Era to go the way of the of the David Carr Era, the Texans will need to address their pass protection, as well as add some more weapons to go along with Andre Johnson -- both have been continuous issues for the expansion franchise. Last season, Houston was 27th in the NFL in passing offense and 22nd in stopping the pass.

The Debate: The choice will be to bring in Joe Staley to protect Schaub or to add another target such as Dwayne Bowe, whose size and ability to go across the middle would compliment Johnson’s playmaking skills well.

The Choice: Dwayne Bowe. With the Eric Moulds experiment not having worked out, this looks like an easy choice. Bowe fills a gaping need. He is physical, with solid size, athleticism, long arms and big hands, which adds up to a great Red Zone weapon.

What Would DB Do: Bowe. This LSU product has always been high on our draft board and when we couple Bowe’s skills with a glance at the Texans’ roster this is a no-brainer. After Johnson, Houston has Charlie Adams, David Anderson, Andre Davis, Kevin Walter and Jerome Mathis. They want Bowe on that wall...they need Bowe on that wall!

Mock Draft Two-A-Days Recap:
1. Oakland Raiders: JaMarcus Russell
2. Detroit Lions: Joe Thomas
3. Cleveland Browns: Brady Quinn
4. Tampa Bay Bucs: Calvin Johnson
5. Arizona Cardinals: Levi Brown
6. Washington Redskins: Gaines Adams
7. Minnesota Vikings: Adrian Peterson
8. Atlanta Falcons: LaRon Landry
9. Miami Dolphins: Amobi Okoye
10. Houston Texans: Dwayne Bowe

Edit: Can I get a typo corrected in the title, please? Thanks texasguy346!

[Porky]

These are my two favorites as well, although I would like to trade down, and hope one or both are there. I don't really understand the Staley and Levi Brown bashing I see alot. And, yes, Bowe would have me pretty excited as well.

[texasguy346]

Typo fixed.

[gtexan02]

Jeez, the NFL draft is insane.
First someones up, then they're down.
First Thomas was #2 prospect in the draft, then he was way down.
Then he put in the best combine numbers I've ever seen a 300+ guy put up, and he was #2 again
Now he's down again?

Im sorry but all this analysis is stupid if you ask me.
He runs fast. He's quick. He had a successful collegiate career.
Overanalyzing is what causes boneheaded draft moves.

[Errant Hothy]

Originally Posted by gtexan02

Im sorry but all this analysis is stupid if you ask me.
He runs fast. He's quick. He had a successful collegiate career.
Overanalyzing is what causes boneheaded draft moves.

So did Robert Gallery and Jordan Gross, and neither of them is their team's starting LT yet players picked after them are starting LTs...one of them was a Pro-Bowl LT last year.

[nunusguy]

I heard John Murphy say on SR610 Tuesday morning that the Texans could find good WR talent in this Draft in the 3rd round.

[kiwitexansfan]

I hate the idea of Bowe at 10.

Brown I can live with, one of the top CB's of FS's definitely.... but not WR at 10. There is a whole bunch of WR's who are much of a muchness and none of them are worth the 10 in my books.

[Errant Hothy]

I was hpoing somebody else would have noticed this, but I'll go ahead and point it out. People keep saying that Thomas is the better LT prospect then Brown because he, Thomas, is a better athlete; and I don't think that's true.

We all know be know that Thomas ran a faster 40 then Brown, 4.92 to 5.32 (nearly half a second); but then again the 40 time for any O-lineman is a useless stat. The 10 yard splits were 1.81 for Thomas and 1.84 for Brown, essentially the same. So yes Thomas is faster over 40 yards, but over 10 which is about the most a OT will run they are the same. Moving on to the times for the short shuttle, Thomas ran it in 4.85 while Brown ran it is 4.82. Once again essentially the same. The two young men were as egaully quick in the 3 cone, Brown running it in 7.81 and Thomas in 7.88. Now Thomas does hold an advantage in the vertical, 33" versus 28.5"; but Brown is moving an additional 17 pounds. This brings us to the size issue, Brown is a bigger man with a more protypical body for a NFL LT. He has bigger hands then Thomas, 10 1/4 versus 9 3/4, and longer arms 34 3/8 versues 32 1/2 (this is where the biggest seperation betwwen the two is in my view). Balancinig all this, and the fact that both were highly lineman in college (but once again Brown gets the edge being a 4 year starter) in my view Brown will be the better pro.

I don't think either guy has high a ceiling as D'Brickashaw from last year, but I do think that Brown's ceiling is higher then Thomas'; and I also think Brown's floor (which would be a dominate RT) is higher then Thomas' (which would be a Robert Gallery clone).

[nunusguy]

Originally Posted by Hoth-Boy

I was hpoing somebody else would have noticed this, but I'll go ahead and point it out. People keep saying that Thomas is the better LT prospect then Brown because he, Thomas, is a better athlete; and I don't think that's true.

We all know be know that Thomas ran a faster 40 then Brown, 4.92 to 5.32 (nearly half a second); but then again the 40 time for any O-lineman is a useless stat. The 10 yard splits were 1.81 for Thomas and 1.84 for Brown, essentially the same. So yes Thomas is faster over 40 yards, but over 10 which is about the most a OT will run they are the same. Moving on to the times for the short shuttle, Thomas ran it in 4.85 while Brown ran it is 4.82. Once again essentially the same. The two young men were as egaully quick in the 3 cone, Brown running it in 7.81 and Thomas in 7.88. Now Thomas does hold an advantage in the vertical, 33" versus 28.5"; but Brown is moving an additional 17 pounds. This brings us to the size issue, Brown is a bigger man with a more protypical body for a NFL LT. He has bigger hands then Thomas, 10 1/4 versus 9 3/4, and longer arms 34 3/8 versues 32 1/2 (this is where the biggest seperation betwwen the two is in my view). Balancinig all this, and the fact that both were highly lineman in college (but once again Brown gets the edge being a 4 year starter) in my view Brown will be the better pro.

I don't hink either guy has high a ceiling as D'Brickashaw from last year, but I do think that Brown's ceiling is higher then Thomas'; and I also think Brown's floor (which would be a dominate RT) is higher then Thomas' (which would be a Robert Gallery clone).

"Winston’s short arms (32 ¼”) and average upper body strength make him susceptible to bull rushes."
http://www.houstonprofootball.com/dr.../winstone.html
*****
Good stuff H-B ! You make a very persuasive argument for Browns equality and even superiority in important measureble components.
But what jumped out at me in particular was Thomas's arm length, a measureable that many NFL people seem to attach a lot of importance to for OT prospects, atleast some players like our guy Eric Winston who is an immaterial 1/4 " < than Thomas.
I dunno, but how come Thomas gets a pass on this obvious deficiency ?

[Errant Hothy]

Originally Posted by nunusguy

"Winston’s short arms (32 ¼”) and average upper body strength make him susceptible to bull rushes."
http://www.houstonprofootball.com/dr.../winstone.html
*****
Good stuff H-B ! You make a very persuasive argument for Browns equality and even superiority in important measureble components.
But what jumped out at me in particular was Thomas's arm length, a measureable that many NFL people seem to attach a lot of importance to for OT prospects, atleast some players like our guy Eric Winston who is an immaterial 1/4 " < than Thomas.
I dunno, but how come Thomas gets a pass on this obvious deficiency ?

I don't know why nobody is bringing up Thomas' short arms, but then again few brought it up about Gallery and Gross.

From Gosselins break down today:

No. 2: Levi Brown was the second-best offensive lineman in the Big Ten and the second-best offensive linemen on this draft board. He's No. 2 in both cases to Wisconsin tackle Joe Thomas. Maybe it should be 1a and 1b. Brown doesn't see much difference between himself and Thomas. "I'm a great athlete and love to play the game," said Brown, a four-year starter at Penn State. "I have the ability to dominate anybody. Whether or not I'm taken No. 1, I plan on making it to a lot of Pro Bowls in my career."

These are things that get me fired up. I know everybody thinks it's cool that Thomas is going fishing with his dad on draft day as is their tradition (I think it is cool to). But Levi seems to be the one developing a chip on his shoulder and it seems to be motivating him. I really think that as of now Levi Brown will be a better pro then Thomas!