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Old 01-30-2007   #1
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Post Operation: QB Situation

Look guys, Plummer is David Carr in a hippie disguise. You'd hate him immediately too. Why did Shanahan bench Plummer for a rookie? Gee...cuz Plummer SUCKS!!!

Bledsoe would be killed within two games starting behind our shotty O-Line. He couldn't cut it in Dallas. He surely isn't the answer here.
McNabb. I like him, but he's injury prone. If we had McNabb on our team and I was the GM, I'd make him sign a no-NFL2K any year and a no-Chunky Soup Commercial clause into the contract. The guy's missed significant time in two consecutive seasons. I don't think for the money, he's a safe bet.

As I've said before, we should keep Carr, draft O-Line and add O-line help via FA. We should find a RB this draft who can be our main guy and take some heat off David. We should patch up our swiss cheese secondary and add depth on the Defensive line and we should let Carr be the QB until we groom another QB via draft or get one via FA and Cut Carr when it's not too expensive to do so.

My theory: Bring in Kolb from the Cougs
Train him for the first half of the season
Bench Carr around W6-7
Have Kolb lead the team to the playoffs
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Old 01-30-2007   #2
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

When your grooming a new QB, you don't keep the old gang green toe around. You bring in a Vet to hold down the spot in the mean-time.

See

Titans
Detroit
Arizona

People aren't asking Plummer to be the franchise QB here, they recognize that Carr isn't the option as do you, since you want to groom a rookie. However one thing Plummer is, is a savy Vet, who isn't as bad as people are trying to potray him. He had the Broncos in the playoff hunt this year and took the Broncos to the playoffs multiple seasons........he's easily an upgrade over Carr and has played many seasons in Kubiak's system...........theres no learning curve.

Pick up Plummer, trade Carr for a additional draft pick, and draft a talented rookie and let the transition begin.

Its only fair to Carr, he's still young and if he's not the answer on this team, the best thing McNair could do for him is let him catch on somewhere else, not parade him out in front of the fans every sunday that hate his guts and will be screaming for the rook. Every incomplete/bad pass/sack will be met with a house of boos, a PR nightmare.
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Old 01-30-2007   #3
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

I agree with everything except the start Carr for 6 or 7 games thing. That's just retarded. Start Sage.....

then in Week 8, if Sage doesn't look like he is competent, we'll throw in Van Pelt.... maybe Carr.. we don't play Kobb, until he's sat for a whole year with Kubiak.
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Old 01-30-2007   #4
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
I agree with everything except the start Carr for 6 or 7 games thing. That's just retarded. Start Sage.....

then in Week 8, if Sage doesn't look like he is competent, we'll throw in Van Pelt.... maybe Carr.. we don't play Kobb, until he's sat for a whole year with Kubiak.
Whats the point of keeping Carr around if you don't even want to play him, just waisted money on the bench, might as well try to squeeze a third or fourth rounder out of him.
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Old 01-30-2007   #5
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb View Post
When your grooming a new QB, you don't keep the old gang green toe around. You bring in a Vet to hold down the spot in the mean-time.

See

Titans
Detroit
Arizona

People aren't asking Plummer to be the franchise QB here, they recognize that Carr isn't the option as do you, since you want to groom a rookie. However one thing Plummer is, is a savy Vet, who isn't as bad as people are trying to potray him. He had the Broncos in the playoff hunt this year and took the Broncos to the playoffs multiple seasons........he's easily an upgrade over Carr and has played many seasons in Kubiak's system...........theres no learning curve.

Pick up Plummer, trade Carr for a additional draft pick, and draft a talented rookie and let the transition begin.

Its only fair to Carr, he's still young and if he's not the answer on this team, the best thing McNair could do for him is let him catch on somewhere else, not parade him out in front of the fans every sunday that hate his guts and will be screaming for the rook. Every incomplete/bad pass/sack will be met with a house of boos, a PR nightmare.
Exactly! Your getting rep for that one.
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Old 01-30-2007   #6
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb View Post
Whats the point of keeping Carr around if you don't even want to play him, just waisted money on the bench, might as well try to squeeze a third or fourth rounder out of him.
If I had my way, he wouldn't have been here in '06. He'll be here in '07, and it won't be because of anything I want, or don't want.

I wouldn't start him, because I want the Texans to put the best players at each position....... I want to win.

we've pissed away $7 million/year for the last 5 seasons........ what's one more.... or two for that matter.

Then we can hire David as a position coach.......

the DE position coach.....
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Old 01-30-2007   #7
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb View Post
When your grooming a new QB, you don't keep the old gang green toe around. You bring in a Vet to hold down the spot in the mean-time.

See

Titans
Detroit
Arizona


People aren't asking Plummer to be the franchise QB here, they recognize that Carr isn't the option as do you, since you want to groom a rookie. However one thing Plummer is, is a savy Vet, who isn't as bad as people are trying to potray him. He had the Broncos in the playoff hunt this year and took the Broncos to the playoffs multiple seasons........he's easily an upgrade over Carr and has played many seasons in Kubiak's system...........theres no learning curve.

Pick up Plummer, trade Carr for a additional draft pick, and draft a talented rookie and let the transition begin.

Its only fair to Carr, he's still young and if he's not the answer on this team, the best thing McNair could do for him is let him catch on somewhere else, not parade him out in front of the fans every sunday that hate his guts and will be screaming for the rook. Every incomplete/bad pass/sack will be met with a house of boos, a PR nightmare.
I'm not completely sure that these are the franchises that I would suggest as examples to follow.
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Old 01-30-2007   #8
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

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Originally Posted by QB75 View Post
I'm not completely sure that these are the franchises that I would suggest as examples to follow.
Uh why not, they fit what I'm saying.......

Nobody believes J. Kitna is the future in Detroit, he's holding down the job.
So was K. Collins
So was K. Warner

So is Plummer if he comes here.

Personally if I were you I wouldn't turn my nose up to other franchises seeing how we aren't any better.

Atleast these teams have recognized the problems they have and made steps towards a change, unlike what your willing to do.
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Old 01-30-2007   #9
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

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Originally Posted by Imatexanfan View Post
Look guys, Plummer is David Carr in a hippie disguise. You'd hate him immediately too. Why did Shanahan bench Plummer for a rookie? Gee...cuz Plummer SUCKS!!!

Plummer was 7-3 when he was benched. How many wins did Carr get this year in 16 games? How about the past 32 games?
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Old 01-30-2007   #10
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

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Uh why not, they fit what I'm saying.......

Nobody believes J. Kitna is the future in Detroit, he's holding down the job.
So was K. Collins
So was K. Warner

So is Plummer if he comes here.

Personally if I were you I wouldn't turn my nose up to other franchises seeing how we aren't any better.

Atleast these teams have recognized the problems they have and made steps towards a change, unlike what your willing to do.
With the exception of the Titans / Oilers once-in-forty-years Super Bowl appearance (and loss), these franchsises are perennial losers. Their greatest service to the NFL has been as schedule fillers for the rest of a competitive league. I would rather aspire to replicate the success of other teams.
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Old 01-30-2007   #11
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

Actually the Oilers went to the playoffs 6 or 7 straight years in the 80's .
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Old 01-30-2007   #12
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

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Actually the Oilers went to the playoffs 6 or 7 straight years in the 80's .
Don't remind me. I had almost forgotten! (Steelers, Bills,..)
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Old 01-30-2007   #13
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

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Don't remind me. I had almost forgotten! (Steelers, Bills,..)
Yes, but the Texans are the only team to take this long to reach the playoffs.

Heck, even the Browns and Buccaneers made the playoffs by year 5. But as long as we keep winning a couple more games per year, then we'll be ok eventually.
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Old 01-30-2007   #14
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb View Post
When your grooming a new QB, you don't keep the old gang green toe around. You bring in a Vet to hold down the spot in the mean-time.

See

Titans
Detroit
Arizona

People aren't asking Plummer to be the franchise QB here, they recognize that Carr isn't the option as do you, since you want to groom a rookie. However one thing Plummer is, is a savy Vet, who isn't as bad as people are trying to potray him. He had the Broncos in the playoff hunt this year and took the Broncos to the playoffs multiple seasons........he's easily an upgrade over Carr and has played many seasons in Kubiak's system...........theres no learning curve.

Pick up Plummer, trade Carr for a additional draft pick, and draft a talented rookie and let the transition begin.

Its only fair to Carr, he's still young and if he's not the answer on this team, the best thing McNair could do for him is let him catch on somewhere else, not parade him out in front of the fans every sunday that hate his guts and will be screaming for the rook. Every incomplete/bad pass/sack will be met with a house of boos, a PR nightmare.

Seriously, Plummer is not an upgrade from Carr.

With the better running game, better offensive line, TOP NFL DEFENSE (at the begin. of the season) he threw twice as many interceptions as carr did... but carr had 16 games while plummer had 8. Carr is faster and has a stronger arm than plummer. If they are both not very good mentally, I would rather the better athlete.
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Old 01-30-2007   #15
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

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Yes, but the Texans are the only team to take this long to reach the playoffs.

Heck, even the Browns and Buccaneers made the playoffs by year 5. But as long as we keep winning a couple more games per year, then we'll be ok eventually.
Actually, the Cowgirls took 7 years to have their first winning season. And I'm pretty sure (but didn't check) that New Orleans was pretty bad out of the gate...
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Old 01-30-2007   #16
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

I've said this once and I'll say it again.

It's probably not a coincidence that after Kubiak left Denver to become our head coach, that Denver's offensive production went down. It's probably not a coincidence that when Kubiak was the OC at Denver and coaching Jake Plummer, Plummer had his best years of his career. Plummer is definately a better QB than Carr is at this point.
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Old 01-30-2007   #17
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb View Post
When your grooming a new QB, you don't keep the old gang green toe around. You bring in a Vet to hold down the spot in the mean-time.

See

Titans
Detroit
Arizona

People aren't asking Plummer to be the franchise QB here, they recognize that Carr isn't the option as do you, since you want to groom a rookie. However one thing Plummer is, is a savy Vet, who isn't as bad as people are trying to potray him. He had the Broncos in the playoff hunt this year and took the Broncos to the playoffs multiple seasons........he's easily an upgrade over Carr and has played many seasons in Kubiak's system...........theres no learning curve.

Pick up Plummer, trade Carr for a additional draft pick, and draft a talented rookie and let the transition begin.

Its only fair to Carr, he's still young and if he's not the answer on this team, the best thing McNair could do for him is let him catch on somewhere else, not parade him out in front of the fans every sunday that hate his guts and will be screaming for the rook. Every incomplete/bad pass/sack will be met with a house of boos, a PR nightmare.
The Broncos defense had the Broncos in the playoff hunt in spite of Plummer, not because of him. Through the first 6 weeks of the season, the Broncos were close to a record defenive pace in terms of points allowed and were winning in spite of Jake (see 9-6 OT win over Chiefs). The only reason they didnt start 6-0 during that strech is that, even with a great D, Plummer was terrible (see 4 picks vs Rams in loss where D does not allow TD). Jake Plummer was terrible last year, bottomline.

What I dont understand is that people are calling for brinigng in someone to "manage the game" and "not screw up". Umm, thats David Carr in a nutshell. 70% completions with very few picks, almost half of which came in one game. If Carr can play at the level he demonstrated in the beggining of the season (you know, when he lead the league in pass rating and was carrying our offense) and we avoid those crushing injuries, we are going to be a very competative team. Either we draft AP and have a balanced offense from the start of the season (which he almost have never had, its always been the passing game OR the running game, never both), or we get someone like Andersson to realy solidify the D. Bottomline, it is not practical to sit or trade Carr and start someone like Plummer, becuse the performances would not vary much, if at all, while we would have to pay for two overpriced QB's.

My suggestion for the QB situation is to draft a rookie no sooner then the 3rd round (everyone seems sold on Kolb, so if he is there he might be worth a shot) who will sit for a while and have the QB's currently on the roster (Carr, Sage, Van Pelt) earn the starting job in tranning camp. May the best man win.
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Old 01-30-2007   #18
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

Plummer + Kubiak is a upgrade over Carr and you can't argue that their defense kept them in a playoff hunt, becuase that same defense playing with a rookie, who technically had better stats, struggled.

Plummer might throw more picks, but he also throws alot more TDs. to me theres no difference between a long Int. and a 3 and out and short punt, which is what we get here..............atleast with Plummer you get points.

Plummer's last season under Kubiak he had a

18 to 7 TD/INT ratio, the year before that
27 to 20 TD/INT ratio, the year before that, which was his first year under Kubiak, he had a
15 to 7 TD/INT ratio, which is alot better than the 11 tds and 12 ints we got from Carr.

Yes Plummer is a upgrade.

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Old 01-31-2007   #19
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

I'm sure some of Plummer's success came from him being on a pretty good team with a very talented playoff team surrounding him! Look at what Plummer did in Arizona when they were terrible and had no o-line, the same thing that has been happening to Carr. You fix the O-line and the defense to get some good field positioning you fix the qb problem! Plummer is under no circumstances a better qb than Carr is! Carr's problems will be fixed when he can consistently take a 3-5 step drop and not be worried about a defensive player being in his face before he can set his feet! Look at the pocket our o-line gives him compared to any of the other "good" qb's, my guess is they look alot different!
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Old 01-31-2007   #20
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Default Re: Operation: QB Situation

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I'm sure some of Plummer's success came from him being on a pretty good team with a very talented playoff team surrounding him! Look at what Plummer did in Arizona when they were terrible and had no o-line, the same thing that has been happening to Carr. You fix the O-line and the defense to get some good field positioning you fix the qb problem! Plummer is under no circumstances a better qb than Carr is! Carr's problems will be fixed when he can consistently take a 3-5 step drop and not be worried about a defensive player being in his face before he can set his feet! Look at the pocket our o-line gives him compared to any of the other "good" qb's, my guess is they look alot different!
Oline, wasn't as bad as some of you make out to seem, was it top notch, no. Was it absolutely horrible nooooooo. They gave up 25 less sacks. The excusses don't cut it anymore, they would if Carr was a 3rd round pick, but as a #1 ovrl. pick, your expected to have better success despite lesser talent.

What the hell is the point of holding on to a former #1 ovrl. pick if we have to surround him with expensive players, with round one selections/FAs, all over the field that strap our cap, which is what some of yall expect us to do. What yall need to do is come to grips, that the difference between Carr and a subpar QB, isn't that far off.

Its all about pocket presence, Carr doesn't do his Oline any favors what so ever.

Would Carr be great if he was a mid round selection yeah, but he was the #1 player taken in the draft, at the price he is being paid his isn't cutting it. There are a handful of people in this league we could get, that perform at the same level or better that will cost us less in the long run. Backups in this league play better. Again he was drafted #1 ovrl all, he's paid to overcome adversity, he isn't doing it.









Also for the last time, I'm tired of hearing about the Oline, Carr isn't the first QB that came into a bad situation, when I judge him, I look at the plays where he did have time and it ain't pretty.

Its going on year 6 people........going on 4 offensive coordinators........multiple QB coaches........time to wake up and smell whats brewing and its a crock of ....

Last edited by Carr Bombed; 01-31-2007 at 02:22 AM.
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