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Old 01-17-2007   #1
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Default Griffin in the 2nd

I've been watching a lot of draft boards and a lot of people don't have him going in the first. If he falls to the second round, whats your thoughts on us getting him? Also is he a FS or SS? Landry and Nelson also, FS or SS?

I think defence is the way to go in this draft. Address the Offence in FA. WR is solid, TE good, RB-we don't have a break away back but if DW comes back and is healthy than the combo of him, CT, and RD are gonna make one hell of a back field. OL is really our main need at Offence.
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Old 01-17-2007   #2
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

Griffin isn't projected to the first because he isn't that good. We have a high second rounder, and should take one of the upper talents who happens to fall to us. Griffin is a SS, we have two that started for us last year. We need a FS, that is what Landry and Nelson play, and that is why they are better for this team besides the obvious differences in tallent.
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Old 01-17-2007   #3
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Originally Posted by pockets44 View Post
I've been watching a lot of draft boards and a lot of people don't have him going in the first. If he falls to the second round, whats your thoughts on us getting him? Also is he a FS or SS? Landry and Nelson also, FS or SS?
YTF and myself have gone back and forth on this one before, and I respect his opinion but I also stand by my own.

If Griffin is there at our pick in the 2nd, I would definately take him...same w/ Meriweather. Griffin played SS at Texas, but he did occasionally play some FS in certain situations. I think he could play either position in the NFL.

He has fluid hips, excellent speed, and is good in coverage. I think that he is projected as a SS by most b/c that is obviously what he is most familiar with, but also b/c he is such a physical and good tackler.

(Unofficial until the combine) He and Meriweather both have better speed than Landry or Nelson. Griffin & Meriweather are listed at a 4.45 and Landry & Nelson at 4.50.....a small difference, but a difference nonetheless.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/rankings/s.html
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Old 01-17-2007   #4
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Originally Posted by AustinJB View Post
YTF and myself have gone back and forth on this one before, and I respect his opinion but I also stand by my own.

If Griffin is there at our pick in the 2nd, I would definately take him...same w/ Meriweather. Griffin played SS at Texas, but he did occasionally play some FS in certain situations. I think he could play either position in the NFL.

He has fluid hips, excellent speed, and is good in coverage. I think that he is projected as a SS by most b/c that is obviously what he is most familiar with, but also b/c he is such a physical and good tackler.

(Unofficial until the combine) He and Meriweather both have better speed than Landry or Nelson. Griffin & Meriweather are listed at a 4.45 and Landry & Nelson at 4.50.....a small difference, but a difference nonetheless.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/rankings/s.html


Nelson is likely to break 4.4, he is one of the fastest players in the draft. Merriwether is faster than Griffin. Griffin is not great in coverage, and bites at almost every move. He doesn't have the recovery speed to make up for it either, but if he is in the right place at the right time...he usually makes a play.

Griffen is considered a SS because he is more of an in the box type S than a coverage/last line of defense S. Griffin likes to come up and support the run, and is good at it, but his hips aren't that fluid IMO.

Merriwether is the second best coverage S in the draft behind Nelson, and that can be argued. Merriwether played cover-1 CB against the best WR since Randy Moss and at least held his own. He can hit, but is better at coverage.
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Old 01-17-2007   #5
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

I like Griffin, but do side with YTF's evaluation. Unfortunately we do not need a SS. But who knows maybe we sign a CB and FS in FA and Griffin is there in the 3rd where I think he may slip to.
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Old 01-17-2007   #6
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Originally Posted by pockets44 View Post
I've been watching a lot of draft boards and a lot of people don't have him going in the first. If he falls to the second round, whats your thoughts on us getting him?
not if the Texans pick Nelson/Landry in the first.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pockets44 View Post
Also is he a FS or SS? Landry and Nelson also, FS or SS?
they are all free safetys.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pockets44 View Post
I think defence is the way to go in this draft. Address the Offence in FA. WR is solid, TE good, RB-we don't have a break away back but if DW comes back and is healthy than the combo of him, CT, and RD are gonna make one hell of a back field. OL is really our main need at Offence.
everything rides on that first pick & will dicate how the rest of the draft plays out.
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Old 01-18-2007   #7
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
not if the Texans pick Nelson/Landry in the first.



they are all free safetys.



everything rides on that first pick & will dicate how the rest of the draft plays out.
I agree everything rides on the first pick. My hopes is we adress defensive needs first. If we don't go DL or DE first, Landry is my pick. I wouldn't mind seeing Leon Hall either but I think we could trade down a couple of spots to pick him up. At times this year you saw some decent pressure on QB's but our secondary was getting burned. I know he's the best QB in the game right now but look at the Colts game. We got burnt deep for a TD cause our safties bite to hard. Both are good at run support but we've had too many plays that have been costly. I like the idea of completly revamping our secondary and picky Landry first, then catching either Merriweather or Griffin in the second. We pick up a vetran CB in FA and we have the makings of a very dominant D! Better secondary coverage WILL create more pressure/sacks/INT's.
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Old 01-18-2007   #8
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

I think Leon Hall is no better then a high second round pick, and if available he would make the better pick in the second round over Griffin. Picking up Landry in the first and Hall in the second would vastly improve our secondary.
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Old 01-18-2007   #9
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

I like Merriwether a great deal and he should be available in 2nd round but I don't think Texans will ever draft him due to his character concerns. Physically he is first round talent but due to character concern he will get selected by Cincinnati in 2nd round. He is perfect for that team.

Cincinnati doesn't care so much about character issue as long the guy has talent.
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Old 01-18-2007   #10
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

Quote:
Originally Posted by pockets44 View Post
I've been watching a lot of draft boards and a lot of people don't have him going in the first. If he falls to the second round, whats your thoughts on us getting him? Also is he a FS or SS? Landry and Nelson also, FS or SS?

I think defence is the way to go in this draft. Address the Offence in FA. WR is solid, TE good, RB-we don't have a break away back but if DW comes back and is healthy than the combo of him, CT, and RD are gonna make one hell of a back field. OL is really our main need at Offence.
Griffin plays more like a SS but he's athletic enough and decent enough in some coverage that he could play FS, he would be a huge upgrade over either Earl or Brown. If he was around in the 2nd round I'd definitely look at him, although if he and Meriweather were both there I'd take Meriweather first. I don't know if he'll last to the 2nd though.

I think we should largely concentrate on defense this draft with the exception that if Adrian Peterson is available at #8 then we need to take him there. Other than that, defense is much stronger than offense in this draft and we could really fill out a lot of our holes on the defensive side of the ball.
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Old 01-18-2007   #11
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

Pats will take him.
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Old 01-18-2007   #12
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Pats will take him.
I think the Patriots (replace Rodney Harrison) or even Jaguars (replace Donovin Darius) could end up taking him in the 1st.
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Old 01-18-2007   #13
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Originally Posted by MorKnolle View Post
I think the Patriots (replace Rodney Harrison) or even Jaguars (replace Donovin Darius) could end up taking him in the 1st.
Those are good bets; I also think that San Diego may take him if given the chance (replace Terrence Kiel). That would pretty much round out their defense.

I'm posting this scouting report b/c it pretty much is spot-on IMO. It supports my view of his ability and potential. I know that these are relative and some people don't like certain scouting sites, so take it FWIW.

Michael Griffin

Strengths:
Very smooth and athletic with great speed...Tough, physical, aggressive and a big hitter...Covers a lot of ground and has a burst to close...Exceptional in coverage and has fluid hips...Supports the run well...A playmaker with good leaping ability and ball skills...Motor is always running...Productive and has a lot of experience against top competition...Intangibles are top-notch...An outstanding kick blocker and special teamer who could carve out a career in the NFL on that ability alone.

Weaknesses:
Has okay but not exceptional size...Will miss some tackles while trying to deliver the knock-out blow...Is not super instinctive and depends on his athleticism too much...Struggles with massive blockers in the box and gets manhandled...Will he be durable and able to hold up physically considering his frame and style of play?

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/sco...elgriffin.html
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Old 01-19-2007   #14
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJB View Post
Those are good bets; I also think that San Diego may take him if given the chance (replace Terrence Kiel). That would pretty much round out their defense.

I'm posting this scouting report b/c it pretty much is spot-on IMO. It supports my view of his ability and potential. I know that these are relative and some people don't like certain scouting sites, so take it FWIW.

Michael Griffin

Strengths:
Very smooth and athletic with great speed...Tough, physical, aggressive and a big hitter...Covers a lot of ground and has a burst to close...Exceptional in coverage and has fluid hips...Supports the run well...A playmaker with good leaping ability and ball skills...Motor is always running...Productive and has a lot of experience against top competition...Intangibles are top-notch...An outstanding kick blocker and special teamer who could carve out a career in the NFL on that ability alone.

Weaknesses:
Has okay but not exceptional size...Will miss some tackles while trying to deliver the knock-out blow...Is not super instinctive and depends on his athleticism too much...Struggles with massive blockers in the box and gets manhandled...Will he be durable and able to hold up physically considering his frame and style of play?

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/sco...elgriffin.html
I agree with this scouting report.

A lot of posters say that he bites too much or that he is too slow.

The Texas defense is coached to stop the run. Chizik coached Griffin to do exactly what he did last year.

As far as him being too slow... that's BS. I wouldnt be surprised if he ran a 4.4 at the combine.

Just because he played SS in college doesnt mean he cant play FS in the NFL.

I am a big UT fan so I am biased but I have noticed him as a playmaker ever since he got to Texas. I have watched every UT game during the last two years and he sticks out in every game.

I would put him #2 out of all the safeties behind Nelson.

He can do everything you ask a safety to do. I think he broke the NCAA record for blocked kicks. He can play centerfield against passing teams and knocks out anyone who comes over the middle. But he can also play the box against running teams and has had at least two games in his career where he had over 18 tackles, including last year against A&M where he had 23.
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Old 01-19-2007   #15
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

Did anyone see the Kansas State game???
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Old 01-19-2007   #16
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Did anyone see the Kansas State game???
UT's secondary was atrocious this past year in my opinion. I cannot recall so many different CB's and S's biting on moves/fakes and missing open field tackles.

If Griffin is there in the 3rd I would like to take him.
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Old 01-19-2007   #17
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

The biggest myth from an average nfl fan is that Strong Safety means that that safety is stronger and should deliver big hits, but can't cover as well and that free safety is fast and can cover better.

WRONG.

Strong safetys are put to strength of the call while free safetys are put opposite. So say the other team is running an empty set with 3 wide left and twins right. The strong safety would go to the 3 receiver side while the free would go to the twins side.

However In cover 4 sometimes you substitute in or have a designated "strong safety" who lines off 7 yards and keys the tight end. While the free safety lines up on a "ghost" te and keys the backfield and watching the one receiver for anything inside. That is the only time there is a significant difference between the two is because the strong safety has more of a chance to get in the running play, becuase teams usually run to their strength.

Usually teams all run the same zone coverage, which is check 2 against twins, and run 4 against a TE set. If it twins left with a te right, then you will play a 6 coverage which means the strong safety will lineup on the tight end while the free safety well play 2 over the twins (is good because the corner can jam the #1 receiver which messes up timing and the 2 plays a high-ho coverage over the top).



So people, my point is... there is really no difference between strong safety and free safety just where they lineup. It is almost the same as playing "left corner" and "right corner". Only in certain situations, which don't happen too often, where hte free safety needs to be the better cover guy while the strong safety needs to be a better tackler. Usually they are both about even.
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Old 01-19-2007   #18
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro View Post
UT's secondary was atrocious this past year in my opinion. I cannot recall so many different CB's and S's biting on moves/fakes and missing open field tackles.

If Griffin is there in the 3rd I would like to take him.
I've heard on local radio that the problems with the secondary had more to do with conflicting coaching styles between Chizik and Akina. If this is true, then I'll expect their stock to go up in the combine.
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Old 01-19-2007   #19
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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Originally Posted by Battle Red Bull View Post
I've heard on local radio that the problems with the secondary had more to do with conflicting coaching styles between Chizik and Akina. If this is true, then I'll expect their stock to go up in the combine.
That's true.

Akina was trying to coach the team to respect the run but still play the pass and Chizik was coaching the defense to go on the run all the time.

Chizik's idea was that if a team cant run on you then they cant move the ball, but that backfired in the games were teams used play action again, and again, and again... like the Nebraska and Kansas St games.

I expect the defense to be better next year with Akina running it himself even tho the secondary will need to rebuild and the DEs are graduating.
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Old 01-19-2007   #20
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Default Re: Griffin in the 2nd

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That's true.

Akina was trying to coach the team to respect the run but still play the pass and Chizik was coaching the defense to go on the run all the time.

Chizik's idea was that if a team cant run on you then they cant move the ball, but that backfired in the games were teams used play action again, and again, and again... like the Nebraska and Kansas St games.

I expect the defense to be better next year with Akina running it himself even tho the secondary will need to rebuild and the DEs are graduating.
That's exactly the way I heard it also.....just couldn't remember the details.

Great explanation.
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