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Old 12-29-2006   #1
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Default Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

I was wondering because I know we will keep David, and I know he didn't play well.

How would yall feel if he could and did restructure it?
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Old 12-29-2006   #2
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

Bumpy!!!
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Old 12-29-2006   #3
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

I think it'd be better for both sides to start fresh next year, the cap hit be damned. Having said that, if Carr is going to come back, I'd much rather he get paid a lot less than he is, or at least earn the money through incentives that he reached.

I doubt this would happen. I suspect Carr's pride would prevent him from accepting a pay cut. Even if he did accept it, you just know all the Carr apologists would blame the team for his poor performance in 2007--i.e., the team's lack of confidence in Carr caused David to lose confidence in himself and therefore play badly.
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Old 12-29-2006   #4
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

I was thinking paying him less and earning it through incentives.
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Old 12-29-2006   #5
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

Why can't they do what the Jets did with Pennington? Tell him to restructure or he is cut. Make the contract incentive based and have him earn his money.
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Old 12-29-2006   #6
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

I don't know the specifics with Pennington, but I recall he was coming off a career-threatening injury and therefore had little to no trade value.

One thing Carr has proved is that he is very tough and durable. Partly because of that, he will have some trade value. I'd prefer the team get a 4th round pick for him rather than release him outright. Of course, the team could still give David that ultimatum and then trade him anyway if he refused it, but I suspect that would diminish his trade value if there was a public spat over this (i.e., the team would be trading him under distressed circumstances, so other teams would offer less).
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Old 12-29-2006   #7
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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Originally Posted by caddy View Post
Oh, yeah.. look David. I realized you still have not gotten the help we keep telling that is comming; and drafted for the defence. But could you give up some of the hazzarded duty pay we give you. Look at it this way, we keep changing, and were sure that Vinney will come up with the big bucks for you. Along with a new offence planed for next year.
Help? The team added two former Pro Bowlers at receiver and center, signed a legit #3 receiver (Walter) and a pass catching tight end (Putzier). We also drafted two tackles in the third round and a tight end who turned out to be better than Putzier.

DC will never have 10 Pro Bowlers to help him on offense. Why can't he be successful with the talent he has, like Romo and Leinert, who have both been able to do more with less than DC has, and with less NFL experience to boot?
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Old 12-29-2006   #8
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

David may come up with the answer himself when he pays his own money for a FA O-lineman at some point.
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Old 12-29-2006   #9
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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Cowboy, and that says it all. Read your own posts about our line.. Now you say it's all that, all I can gleem from your posts is Houston isn't as good as Dallas. And by the way... VY. lasted over 6 games in the NFL. The only good thing about Dallas is I-45 headed South.
I'm not saying our line is great, I'm only saying that Dallas's isn't any better than ours, yet Tony Romo has already proven himself to be much better than Carr, without David's experience or pedigree. Time is up for David's excuse-making. It's past time for him to play like the #1 overall pick with 5 years of NFL experience earning $8 million/year.

Here is a post I submitted on TexansChick's blog that sums up my view in more detail. If you want, feel free to respond with logical reasons as to why I'm wrong, if that's what you think.



"If Vince Young or the fat QB class of 2006 wasn't enough to oust him, I am not sure that the free agent/draft class of 2007 gets him out either. I look at what might be available at the quarterback position in 2007 and just say meh. I also look at what other needs the Texans have and they are immense."

Stephanie:

What I think you are overlooking is that when the team made the decision to go with Carr last year, there was a lot of confidence that Kubiak would be able to help him improve with better coaching. The team also took steps to improve the line and the rest of the weapons on offense (i.e., Mike Flanagan, Moulds, Walter, Putzier, Spencer, Winston, and Daniels).

While the O-line has been banged up, Carr has done nothing to demonstrate that he should continue to be the team's starting QB. Whose fault was it that Carr was flagged for throwing forward passes beyond the line of scrimmage TWICE in one game? Whose fault is that Carr checks down even when he has plenty of time to throw? Whose fault is that Carr too often throws passes after the receiver has made his break and is squared up to Carr, which gives DB's the opportunity to make plays on the ball? What about his lousy decisionmaking against New England, when he threw 3 stupid interceptions and looked like he didn't even want to be on the field during much of the second half?

I could go on, but won't. When I look at Carr in comparison to Tony Romo, an undrafted free agent in his 3rd year who hadn't even played a regular season game before this year, it is clear that Romo is already a FAR better QB than Carr -- who was the 1st pick in the draft and has 5 years of starting experience in the NFL. Romo already shows better pocket presence and playmaking ability than Carr ever has.

Until very recently I was among those who thought Carr should be given more time to succeed with more help on offense. But his abysmal performances against Oakland and New England changed my mind. It is clear the coaches had absolutely no confidence in him in the Oakland game, and his boneheaded decisionmaking in the NE game led to what appeared to his being called out by Dunta Robinson. Which leads me to question whether he's lost the confidence of some of his teammates.

Let's face it: Carr was the 1st pick in the draft and is averaging about $8 million/year over his 3 year extension. For all that, he needs to be a quality playmaker, not someone who needs to have everything perfect to lead a time to victory. No other QB has 10 Pro Bowlers on offense to help him, and guys like Romo and Leinert are already far outplaying Carr with O-lines that are no better than Houston's or WORSE.

You say you're not excited about other veteran QB's. Have you seen Jeff Garcia play recently? He is 100X better than Carr and doesn't have receivers anywhere near as good as David does. He's also a 3-time Pro Bowler. Admittedly, he would be a short-term fix while we developed a younger QB, but he gives Houston a much better chance of winning now than Carr does.

Carr is a good guy and I hope he achieves some success in the NFL, but I think it's better for everyone if he is sent packing at the end of this year. I'm tired of all the excuses made for him and it is clear most other fans are as well.
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Old 12-29-2006   #10
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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Cowboy, and that says it all. Read your own posts about our line.. Now you say it's all that, all I can gleem from your posts is Houston isn't as good as Dallas. And by the way... VY. lasted over 6 games in the NFL. The only good thing about Dallas is I-45 headed South.
...here's hoping you're still posting when Carr is out of the NFL and his only legacy is that 'the team done him wrong.' That's about it, right? 26 fewer sacks this year (less than 1 more per game than the play off teams so far),,,exactly what does the team have to do for Carr to be able to earn his pay?

'c mon, give us the goods---and, remember, there is a salary cap so it's not like we can write blank checks--but, since you know everything, how does Carr get headed in the right direction?
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Old 12-29-2006   #11
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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Why can't they do what the Jets did with Pennington? Tell him to restructure or he is cut. Make the contract incentive based and have him earn his money.
Totally agree man. Playing softball hasn't worked over a 5 year span...i hope they try some toughlove and play a little hardball with him this offseason. If it could free up 1.5 or 2.5 million in cap space for next year, that could mean the difference in making some big FA signings. You appease the Carr, the NFLPA, and Carr's agent by installing some incentives that could approach or perhaps surpass his current salary.

I feel he owes it to the organization for all the patience they have had with him. If he doesn't agree to restructuring then you keep him around as clipboard holder and make him give handsigns as designated backup or cut him. If he does agree to restructuring then we bring him back and he competes against Sage for the starting job. It's his choice and that way it makes the Texans look a bit more even handed in their dealings with Carr.
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Old 12-29-2006   #12
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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Help? The team added two former Pro Bowlers at receiver and center, signed a legit #3 receiver (Walter) and a pass catching tight end (Putzier). We also drafted two tackles in the third round and a tight end who turned out to be better than Putzier.

DC will never have 10 Pro Bowlers to help him on offense. Why can't he be successful with the talent he has, like Romo and Leinert, who have both been able to do more with less than DC has, and with less NFL experience to boot?
totally agree. the excuses hold no water anymore. it's kinda pathetic and sad but oh well...
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Old 12-29-2006   #13
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

They need to restructure his contract to HIM PAYING THE TEXANS to actually wear a uniform. Make no mistake, he WILL BE the starter next year and WE WILL go 5-11. WRITE IT DOWN.
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Old 12-29-2006   #14
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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Gee Nat.. good you pointed out that there are fewers sacks. Not tell that to the Carr haters that complain about the short dump-offs. It's because the pass protection is so much better. Boy, some how you, and your pals got everything blame on David even if you fall all over yourselfs. Now the improvement is due to Kubs game plan.. that is the direction were headed. Carr is the QB.. not the head coach.
...as always, you didn't answer the post...how do we fix what is wrong with David?...Hell-o, is any one home?...nope, didn't think so
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Old 12-29-2006   #15
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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I think it'd be better for both sides to start fresh next year, the cap hit be damned. Having said that, if Carr is going to come back, I'd much rather he get paid a lot less than he is, or at least earn the money through incentives that he reached.

I doubt this would happen. I suspect Carr's pride would prevent him from accepting a pay cut. Even if he did accept it, you just know all the Carr apologists would blame the team for his poor performance in 2007--i.e., the team's lack of confidence in Carr caused David to lose confidence in himself and therefore play badly.

Just a thought, who has first hand knowledge of the fact that the "team" has lost confidence in him? That is not what I hear them saying at all. They, the team, have the inside scoop and they know what is going on. Ours is just speculation. Most overrated in my opinion.
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Old 12-29-2006   #16
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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Just a thought, who has first hand knowledge of the fact that the "team" has lost confidence in him? That is not what I hear them saying at all. They, the team, have the inside scoop and they know what is going on. Ours is just speculation. Most overrated in my opinion.
I didn't say the team HAS lost confidence in him, I was speculating on what sort of excuse Carr's apologists would make on his behalf IF the team asked him to take a pay cut, he accepted and didn't play well in 2007. Yes, I lot of speculation I realize, but that was consistent with the nature of the thread.
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Old 12-29-2006   #17
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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Nope.. I didn't think you could think also. Your claming something is wrong with Carr.. duh, not me. Life is fine for me and I like the small improvement that is being shown. I just hope this is the foundation of what's to come. OH, and by the way.. to answere you PM. Yes I bet the game, didn't take the pts. Took the money line @ +135. Also looking forward to cashing on the over 5.5 wins for the Texans.
...you keep making all these posts about all these promises the team made to Carr and why Carr has not performed but you can't answer your own posts...and Carr's getting better?...11 tds, Yeah, better if you expected nothing...foundation? I'll laugh that one off to sleep tonight...your spelling is still bad...mind is a terrible thing to waste, course there is a prerequisite
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Old 12-30-2006   #18
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

I just read in Jerome Solomon's blog that Carr has received $35 million of Bob McNair's money.

http://blogs.chron.com/jeromesolomon...muchnee_1.html

Amazing. If the team were to cut Carr, I wonder how much another NFL team would be willing to pay him if he cleared waivers and became a free agent. Certainly nowhere near the $6+ million salary he is scheduled to receive in each of 2007 and 2008.

Right now, he's being paid so much more than his true market value it's not even funny.
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Old 12-30-2006   #19
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

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I just read in Jerome Solomon's blog that Carr has received $35 million of Bob McNair's money.

http://blogs.chron.com/jeromesolomon...muchnee_1.html

Amazing. If the team were to cut Carr, I wonder how much another NFL team would be willing to pay him if he cleared waivers and became a free agent. Certainly nowhere near the $6+ million salary he is scheduled to receive in each of 2007 and 2008.

Right now, he's being paid so much more than his true market value it's not even funny.
That's probably true, but I feel that way about every professional athlete and most every boss I've ever had.

PS--I know what you mean though--cap era and market value. I get it.
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Old 12-30-2006   #20
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Default Re: Could we ask to restructure David's contract?

I think wev'e already ruined David Carr here. It's time to let him go somewhere else and succeed, cause I still think he has what it takes. We have no offensive line, and we haven't had one since he has been here. If he could sit back and not get pressured like Peyton Manning does all day, he could be up good numbers, but unfortunately.. we still have 2 offensive line members that have been with the texans from the first draft, and a LT that sucks still .. and a aging vet. It's time to draft a running qb or build a offensive line around Carr.
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