Carr and the shotgun

[Mr. White]

Kubiak's press conference

(on reinvestigating shotgun with QB David Carr) “I really don’t want to address that. There’s a reason why we haven’t been doing much shotgun and I’ve got to keep that in-house until we fix it. But when your quarterback is getting pressured you’d love to move him back there, you’d love to give him more time from that standpoint the minute you go back there you are throwing the ball. We’ve got some things we’ve got to work out and we have been working on them and if we can get them fixed you may see us do it some more. If we don’t get it fixed then we’re not going to do it. That’s as far as I’ll go with that.”

What do you guys make of this?

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Battle Red Bull

Kubiak's press conference



What do you guys make of this?

I take it to mean our tackles can't keep the defenders away from that spot, 7 yards behind the line..... they just let them run to that spot... so why put your QB there.

[Texans86]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I take it to mean our tackles can't keep the defenders away from that spot, 7 yards behind the line..... they just let them run to that spot... so why put your QB there.

Either that, or there's a reason D.Carr is a quarterback and not a wide reciever; he simply can't catch the ball. It's not outside the realm of possibility.

On a more serious note, did Flannagan ever use the shotgun in GB, or Hogden? I'm not quite sure how it could happen, but maybe for some reason our centers have difficulty snapping the ball back and then getting in position to block.

[moses77550]

I think that the center cannot hike the ball consistantly to carr or carr just cant handle the snap....Who knows

[Mr. White]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I take it to mean our tackles can't keep the defenders away from that spot, 7 yards behind the line..... they just let them run to that spot... so why put your QB there.

I think you're onto something here.

Another quote from the press conference:

(on whether he would like to stretch the field more) “Yeah, you know you definitely want to come out in the game and stretch the field more in what you’re doing. As I told y’all after the game, I know for a fact that it is not a strength of ours right now. If we go out there and take a seven-step drop 20-25 times in the game and think we’re going to (WR) Andre (Johnson) 30 yards down the field and (WR) Eric (Moulds) 30 yards down the field, and that’s the way we’re going to play the game. I don’t think that’s fair to our team right now. It’s not a strength of our team right now. If we can keep our third downs manageable and keep (QB) David (Carr) in three and five-step drops, I think we have a chance to be effective. And we were yesterday whenever we were able to do that, but the minute we got a penalty and we were second-and-20 or third-and-12, we weren’t very good. So that is something that we as coaches address and try to keep them out of that situation. As we get better as a football team hopefully we’re able to handle those situations better, but right now that is not something good for us. If we have penalties in a game, then we’re usually in trouble because now we’re having some long distance yardage. It is something that we have to get better at, and the only way you’re going to get better is to just keep going back. For us right now it’s just best for us to stay out of those situations.”

Carr also can't take a 7-step drop. This tells me that the OL is as much of a problem as it ever has been.

My .... I think that we've gotta take Joe Thomas if he's there to flatten blitzers. If not, Marshawn Lynch might be there and he'd be the perfect guy on the dumpoffs that we seem so fond of running.

[eriadoc]

How many possibilities can there be?

The center is having problems with the snap? - Flanagan snapped shotgun to Favre, so before we had Hodgdon in there, this would seem to be invalidated.

The tackles can't keep the ends from going to that spot - If you look at the tackles right now, they don't get much push outward as it is, so this is a very real possibility.

Carr can't handle the snap - possible as well, I suppose. Have we ever seen him in shotgun? Did he ever do it in college? I find it a little hard to believe a QB could make it to the pros without being able to handle a shotgun snap, but I suppose it's possible.

Am I missing anything else?

I vote we promote Bryan Pittman to starting center

(on whether he would like to stretch the field more) “Yeah, you know you definitely want to come out in the game and stretch the field more in what you’re doing. As I told y’all after the game, I know for a fact that it is not a strength of ours right now. If we go out there and take a seven-step drop 20-25 times in the game and think we’re going to (WR) Andre (Johnson) 30 yards down the field and (WR) Eric (Moulds) 30 yards down the field, and that’s the way we’re going to play the game. I don’t think that’s fair to our team right now. It’s not a strength of our team right now. If we can keep our third downs manageable and keep (QB) David (Carr) in three and five-step drops, I think we have a chance to be effective. And we were yesterday whenever we were able to do that, but the minute we got a penalty and we were second-and-20 or third-and-12, we weren’t very good. So that is something that we as coaches address and try to keep them out of that situation. As we get better as a football team hopefully we’re able to handle those situations better, but right now that is not something good for us. If we have penalties in a game, then we’re usually in trouble because now we’re having some long distance yardage. It is something that we have to get better at, and the only way you’re going to get better is to just keep going back. For us right now it’s just best for us to stay out of those situations.”

Not having even an average offensive line hurts this team in so many ways. I pray we get that fixed.

[Honoring Earl 34]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I take it to mean our tackles can't keep the defenders away from that spot, 7 yards behind the line..... they just let them run to that spot... so why put your QB there.

TK , I think your baiting but I'll play ... thats when the QB steps up into the pocket .

[Reddevil63]

Im thinking its more along the lines of Carr cant read defenses when he is concentrating on catching the snap.

[Honoring Earl 34]

Well ... they've never used the shotgun that I can remember .

[dtran04]

Carr has done it in past years plenty of times. Kubiak also said that going to 7 step drops was not possible right now and that they would stick to 5. To me, that clearly means O-Line. I'm betting that the O-Line is getting killed in practice, making Kubiak have zero faith in them.

[Runner]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I take it to mean our tackles can't keep the defenders away from that spot, 7 yards behind the line..... they just let them run to that spot... so why put your QB there.

I'd say that this is a big part of the reason.

As an aside, I've also been told by somebody who has been around the block a few times that when Carr takes a 7 step drop he ends up a little deeper than the various back-ups we've had. This puts additional pressure on the tackles in those situations.

[HOU-TEX]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I take it to mean our tackles can't keep the defenders away from that spot, 7 yards behind the line..... they just let them run to that spot... so why put your QB there.

Originally Posted by Reddevil63

Im thinking its more along the lines of Carr cant read defenses when he is concentrating on catching the snap.

DCs inability to step up in the pocket doesn't help much either.

These are both pretty good opinions.

[eriadoc]

I was just looking up the game log from the StL game last year for another thread and noticed that Carr passed from the shotgun five times in the first half (the half in which he called the plays). FWIW.

[srstex]

QB Attempts Sacked % to attempts
P. Manning 457 13 2.8%
S. McNair 398 14 3.5
T. Brady 430 23 5.3
Titan 376 20 5.3
V Young 286 16 5.6
K Collins 90 4 4.4
P Rivers 383 23 6.0
Jacksonville 346 22 6.4
Pennington 387 25 6.5
Miami 490 34 6.9
C Palmer 414 30 7.2
Kansa City 353 29 8.2
Big Ben 393 37 9.4
D. Carr 376 36 9.6
J P Lossman 342 38 11.1
Frye 358 43 12
Oakland 382 62 16.2

The Titan O line is GOOD, The Texan O line is not. This is just the AFC and this helps show what is wrong with our team.

[the wonger need food]

Originally Posted by srstex

QB Attempts Sacked % to attempts
P. Manning 457 13 2.8%
S. McNair 398 14 3.5
T. Brady 430 23 5.3
Titan 376 20 5.3
V Young 286 16 5.6
K Collins 90 4 4.4
P Rivers 383 23 6.0
Jacksonville 346 22 6.4
Pennington 387 25 6.5
Miami 490 34 6.9
C Palmer 414 30 7.2
Kansa City 353 29 8.2
Big Ben 393 37 9.4
D. Carr 376 36 9.6
J P Lossman 342 38 11.1
Frye 358 43 12
Oakland 382 62 16.2

The Titan O line is GOOD, The Texan O line is not. This is just the AFC and this helps show what is wrong with our team.

It doesn't come close to telling the whole story. Carr contributes to about 50% of his sacks because he has zero pocket presence, holds onto the ball too long and can't read defenses.

[kenneth24]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I take it to mean our tackles can't keep the defenders away from that spot, 7 yards behind the line..... they just let them run to that spot... so why put your QB there.

That would be my best guess as well...as for not being able to handle the snap in the shotgun, I seriously doubt that would be the problem...as long as the DE don't beat the ball back to him.

[FLYmeatwad]

THat was actually a major problem I've had. I've seen little to no shotgun all year. It's really hurting that deep ball that we desperately need to implement in to the attack plan.

[ib4texans]

Originally Posted by the wonger need food

It doesn't come close to telling the whole story. Carr contributes to about 50% of his sacks because he has zero pocket presence, holds onto the ball too long and can't read defenses.

I'm pretty sure I saw him step up in the pocket right away against the Titans this Sunday and make about a 14 yard rush. It didn't look accidental, it looked like he made that decision quick.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Superstar

That is a very logical answer right there. Flanagan has experience with the shotgun snap. He did play for a Superbowl winning team and he was behind Brett Favre.

David was in the shotgun in one of our games this year. One, maybe two snaps. I don't remember how it went..... but we didn't go back to it much after that.

[the wonger need food]

I think the problem is that Carr has to take his eyes off of the defense to catch the ball in the shotgun. When he's taking the snap from under center he can look at the field the whole time. He's just not smart and/or confident enough to be in the shotgun. Sometimes I wonder if he can chew gum and walk at the same time...