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Old 12-03-2006   #1
coachdent
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Default Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

I charted our offense and defense today and saw some very positive as well as some disturbing trends as well. I am about ready to break out into hives reading some of the crap on this board by whining fans who just predictably go down the same path week after week... They will be ignored, lets move on....

The Positives and there were a number of them.

DEFENSIVE:

Many people do not fully realize the impact of Mario Williams. He was awesome today. Here are some stats that will NOT show up in the boxscore that registered him for 2 tackles:

*He had four hurries, including one that caused an interception.
*He drew two holding penalties on runs, both at the point of attack.
*The Raiders ran the ball 22 times with Mario on the field. Guess how many times they ran to his side?
THREE

That is amazing. Three running plays to him for a grand total of four yards. Lat year we were dead last against the run and this year we are up to around 17th or so, despite dealing with some injuries to our interior linemen.

DeMeco was incredible! 14 tackles, a sack, a forced fumble, a fumble recovery an interception and a partridge in a pear tree! I think he even drove the bus to the airport after the game! Rookie of the year defensively.

+Loved seeing Faggins scoop and score
-Felt ill watching Faggins tackle and cover

+Up out of my seat cheering Mathis almost bust one
-Just about lost my spleen when Mathis tried to come out of the endzone.


OFFENSE

All of the Ron Dayne haters should observe at the very least, a brief moment of silence. The Tastycake sign in the endzone must have had the big guy motivated because he was the Pillsbury doughboy on the loose! All kidding aside, Dayne provided us with some much needed physical punch in the run game. We were able to pound the rock on the Raiders very well in the second half.

I got real excited when on the first play of the game, we opened with a spread set, bunch right and then ran outside zone left to the tight end. Lundy pushed his aiming point beautifully and we had seven yards. I've got to tell you, I was more than a little excited. We ran SIX "true" zone plays today out of the one back:
7
2
3
1
9
19
That's pretty nice production. Kinda wish we would do more of that.

Edited 12/4
Edited...because originally, I was pleasantly suprised by the awesome performance of our fullback Jamel Cook. I have been very critical of Jamel here, but thought it refreshing to see that he had played an excellent game. As it turns out...he didn't! It was Vonta Leach! So I can stand by my initial critiques of Cook. I Vant to Vatch More Vonta!


*I will note this however. You can't run 19 lead plays against most NFL defenses and get away with it. 21 plays Vonta was on the field and 19 of those run plays went to where he was leading. That sucks. We have not run a counter all year long. I'm thinking it might go for 40 yards. Send the fullback left and block the DT, pull the guard and tackle and you are off to the friggin' races because no one is there boys!

Here are some trends for you:
18 times we were in some sort of I-formation = we ran 17 times
*Last week I wrote a piece on here about the hardest block to make for a tackle was when he had a tight end releasing and he had to block the defensive end. FOUR of the sacks today came to the side of the tight end releasing and we also had a holding penalty.
*Our tight ends stayed into block ZERO times.
*Our backs stayed in to help out and max protect ZERO times.

Those last two are a stone cold disgrace. When you are struggling with protection, you MUST keep your backs in to block. You must vary your protections and keep a tight end in to block every once in a while to keep the defense guessing.

-Here's the deal... If you keep a tight end in to block, that helps the tackle with the DE AND it takes a defender out of coverage. He will sit on the tight end before releasing into coverage, thus opening passing lanes for the wide outs. Our clunker tight ends take forever to get downfield and clog things up.

-In additon...we're not missing assignments, the protection scheme is flawed. I can show you on a board, but we do not slide protection to the tight end when he goes out. When you don't, and you don't have the back going to that side, you have a sack. We were in that situation twice today. I have seen it before as well.

Critiques offensively:
**It is beyond my comprehension how we cannot get into a shotgun to give us time to throw the football. When we go spread it is just a three step drop festival of short routes.

**As we had success running the football, we ran a total of 1 playaction pass off of it! How can we run ten play action passes one week when we can't run the ball a lick, and then the following week we have success running the ball and never go back to it? The one play action was so bad that the primary receiver in the flat was triple covered. That is bad playcalling 101.

**To help with protection, in addition to keeping backs and tight ends to block, you need to vary the launching point of the quarterback. Carr is a friggin' sitting duck back there and it is borderline criminal to watch him set up in the same spot every time. A true roll out. A seven step drop. A three step Run & Shoot roll where he is throwing on the run. Many different ways to move the pocket. We create a statue with a bullseye. Move him!!!!

People seem to forget that while Oakland is not that good overall, they are ranked seventh in the NFL in total defense.

Overall:
There was one play that I think typifies our season and a lot of posters here on the message boards. Losing does this to people. My own team had a stretch of this during a losing streak this year with our season. It absolutely cannot happen. Mathis almost went the distance. Then Lundy rolls in from 3 yards out. Not ONE offensive player went to him to congratulate him. Not ONE. The team was not excited. The offense was not celebrating. They just went along in a businesslike fashion.

When you react this way, you are not going to be successful in anything you do. That, to me, was the most disappointing thing about today.

In closing, I am happy with the win. Very happy with the defense and dreaming of adding more players to the fold. We just don't have enough players right now. Looking forward to Mario and the boys breaking Tennessee's QB in half.
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Last edited by coachdent; 12-04-2006 at 06:15 PM. Reason: Jamel did not play
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Old 12-03-2006   #2
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

^good post- mine wont be as detailed but this is what i noticed:

Defence-

a) it looked like we blitzed alot- even sending 6 or 7 a couple times
b)tackling all round looked very good
c)greenwood looked good to me eventhough he gets alot of heat around here


Offence
a) dayne was good obviously
b) it looked like we called alot of very similiar passing plays- no variety
c) we were best when running up the gut- suppose hodgon,weary and pitts deserve credit

ST
Kris brown reacted well after missing the 1st fg- you could see he adjusted to the left-to-right wind well...
I ,literally, was in shock when i saw mathis take it out of the endzone after fumbling..how can a pro-bowl nfl returner do that?? anyway chalk it up to enthiusiasm after his layoff..made up for it with the other return(that i missed!!) def glad to have him back- loved the PR ploy using mathis- hated the player that didnt bother blocking the punter
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Old 12-03-2006   #3
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Wow, that is a great breakdown. I hope you do this every week. I gotta say I'm impressed.

Question. Do you think the players are loosing confidence in the play-calling. Maybe that's a factor in why they're no longer excited or anything. I think we noticed this beginning last week as well. Our guys just seemed unmotivated on offense. Another thing which you might not be able to answer, but it's been bugging me. Do you think all the offensive minds are on the same page? I feel maybe it's a battle of wills with Calhoun, Sherman, and Kubiak having influence on the offensive play-calling. What do you think about this. Our defense seems to be on the same page because they got one person in charge of it. I'm sorry if I'm rambling it's just so few and far between posters that are as knowledgeable as you. Just wanted to see what you thought.
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Old 12-03-2006   #4
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Thanks for the insight. This is a great thread-strater and 100% more intelligent and productive than the dozens of Carr threads.

To add an observation to the above - McCleon had a good day. He made one bad play that cost us a TD (not blocking the kicker on Wynn's punt return), but he also came up with an INT and he forced the fumble that Ryans recovered. For a limited role, I think he did well. For this team to do well, they need to get good production from less-than-premium talent. I still wish he'd blocked the kicker, though.
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Old 12-03-2006   #5
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Coach Dent you had me at Tastycakes, man 'Ill be laughing about that line into next season. Great insight in your breakdown and thanks for keeping it POSITIVE for a change.(in regards to the MB not you personally) Great read cant wait for next week, hope DeMeco has the same kind of game aginst you-know-who.
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Old 12-03-2006   #6
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Quote:
Originally Posted by dat_boy_yec View Post
Wow, that is a great breakdown. I hope you do this every week. I gotta say I'm impressed.

Question. Do you think the players are loosing confidence in the play-calling. Maybe that's a factor in why they're no longer excited or anything. I think we noticed this beginning last week as well. Our guys just seemed unmotivated on offense. Another thing which you might not be able to answer, but it's been bugging me. Do you think all the offensive minds are on the same page? I feel maybe it's a battle of wills with Calhoun, Sherman, and Kubiak having influence on the offensive play-calling. What do you think about this. Our defense seems to be on the same page because they got one person in charge of it. I'm sorry if I'm rambling it's just so few and far between posters that are as knowledgeable as you. Just wanted to see what you thought.

Very good point. There does seem to be a pulling by this offense in a bunch of different directions and ultimately it leads to the conclusion or question....what are we? Who are we?

I believe that you must have an identity offensively. What are we? Multiple. We can get in all of these different sets and do this and that. But ultimately, when you are multiple, you are equally ineffective at a lot of things and master of none. At least that is what I think.

I'm a spread guy. On this board, there are a lot of people who go VY and all that...and I am not going to debate that here. I will say simply, that if Norm Chow or I were running that offense in Houston and Tennessee was running this offense there, the records would probably be reversed.
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Old 12-03-2006   #7
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Great post again, Coach. One area I thought really suffered again was the kicking game. Brown finally came through but Stanley's punting was just terrible. If we can drop Buchanon like a bad habit why can't we dump Stanley? Surely there's a decent kicker around looking for a job.
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Old 12-03-2006   #8
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Quote:
Originally Posted by coachdent View Post
Very good point. There does seem to be a pulling by this offense in a bunch of different directions and ultimately it leads to the conclusion or question....what are we? Who are we?

I believe that you must have an identity offensively. What are we? Multiple. We can get in all of these different sets and do this and that. But ultimately, when you are multiple, you are equally ineffective at a lot of things and master of none. At least that is what I think.

I'm a spread guy. On this board, there are a lot of people who go VY and all that...and I am not going to debate that here. I will say simply, that if Norm Chow or I were running that offense in Houston and Tennessee was running this offense there, the records would probably be reversed.
exactly we always seem to run an I formation or a singleback with 2 TE's- WHY DO WE TRY AND KEEP THE OFFENCE BUNCHED- IT PLAYS INTO THE D'S HANDS???????? ESPECIALLY IF, AS YOU SAY, THEY WERENT EVEN BLOCKING
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Old 12-03-2006   #9
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Quote:
Originally Posted by prostock101 View Post
Great post again, Coach. One area I thought really suffered again was the kicking game. Brown finally came through but Stanley's punting was just terrible. If we can drop Buchanon like a bad habit why can't we dump Stanley? Surely there's a decent kicker around looking for a job.
our punting team was horrible all day- stanley has to go imo and the gunners were very bad aswell- carr was returning the short punts and they (andersen i think) had a penalty for going OB
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Old 12-03-2006   #10
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Amen about the punting... seems like a season long frustration there.

The biggest complaint that I have about our formations is that they rarely do anything to gain the offense an advantage.

Oakland, for example, came out in a tight end set to the right and then flopped him over to the left to get him away from Mario when he was going with the tight end.
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Old 12-03-2006   #11
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maddict5 View Post
loved the PR ploy using mathis- hated the player that didnt bother blocking the punter
If I'm not mistaken (I was listening on the radio) it was Dexter McCleon who missed the block (correct me if I'm wrong). He did his fair share today (an INT and FF) so I guess he made up for that
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Old 12-03-2006   #12
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Quote:
Originally Posted by coachdent View Post
I charted our offense and defense today and saw some very positive as well as some disturbing trends as well. I am about ready to break out into hives reading some of the crap on this board by whining fans who just predictably go down the same path week after week... They will be ignored, lets move on....

The Positives and there were a number of them.

DEFENSIVE:

Many people do not fully realize the impact of Mario Williams. He was awesome today. Here are some stats that will NOT show up in the boxscore that registered him for 2 tackles:

*He had four hurries, including one that caused an interception.
*He drew two holding penalties on runs, both at the point of attack.
*The Raiders ran the ball 22 times with Mario on the field. Guess how many times they ran to his side?
THREE

That is amazing. Three running plays to him for a grand total of four yards. Lat year we were dead last against the run and this year we are up to around 17th or so, despite dealing with some injuries to our interior linemen.

DeMeco was incredible! 14 tackles, a sack, a forced fumble, a fumble recovery an interception and a partridge in a pear tree! I think he even drove the bus to the airport after the game! Rookie of the year defensively.

+Loved seeing Faggins scoop and score
-Felt ill watching Faggins tackle and cover

+Up out of my seat cheering Mathis almost bust one
-Just about lost my spleen when Mathis tried to come out of the endzone.


OFFENSE

All of the Ron Dayne haters should observe at the very least, a brief moment of silence. The Tastycake sign in the endzone must have had the big guy motivated because he was the Pillsbury doughboy on the loose! All kidding aside, Dayne provided us with some much needed physical punch in the run game. We were able to pound the rock on the Raiders very well in the second half.

I got real excited when on the first play of the game, we opened with a spread set, bunch right and then ran outside zone left to the tight end. Lundy pushed his aiming point beautifully and we had seven yards. I've got to tell you, I was more than a little excited. We ran SIX "true" zone plays today out of the one back:
7
2
3
1
9
19
That's pretty nice production. Kinda wish we would do more of that.

Now.....
...this is not easy for me...
But I have to say that I was happy with the performance of Jamel Cook today.

See that people? You can be objective! He did very well leading for Dayne today. We ran lead 19 times today and Cook did a nice job on those plays.

*I will note this however. You can't run 19 lead plays against most NFL defenses and get away with it. 21 plays Cook was on the field and 19 of those run plays went to where he was leading. That sucks. We have not run a counter all year long. I'm thinking it might go for 40 yards. Send Cook left and block the DT, pull the guard and tackle and you are off to the friggin' races because no one is there boys! But I digress....Jamel, Well done my man! Well done.

Here are some trends for you:
18 times we were in some sort of I-formation = we ran 17 times
*Last week I wrote a piece on here about the hardest block to make for a tackle was when he had a tight end releasing and he had to block the defensive end. FOUR of the sacks today came to the side of the tight end releasing and we also had a holding penalty.
*Our tight ends stayed into block ZERO times.
*Our backs stayed in to help out and max protect ZERO times.

Those last two are a stone cold disgrace. When you are struggling with protection, you MUST keep your backs in to block. You must vary your protections and keep a tight end in to block every once in a while to keep the defense guessing.

-Here's the deal... If you keep a tight end in to block, that helps the tackle with the DE AND it takes a defender out of coverage. He will sit on the tight end before releasing into coverage, thus opening passing lanes for the wide outs. Our clunker tight ends take forever to get downfield and clog things up.

-In additon...we're not missing assignments, the protection scheme is flawed. I can show you on a board, but we do not slide protection to the tight end when he goes out. When you don't, and you don't have the back going to that side, you have a sack. We were in that situation twice today. I have seen it before as well.

Critiques offensively:
**It is beyond my comprehension how we cannot get into a shotgun to give us time to throw the football. When we go spread it is just a three step drop festival of short routes.

**As we had success running the football, we ran a total of 1 playaction pass off of it! How can we run ten play action passes one week when we can't run the ball a lick, and then the following week we have success running the ball and never go back to it? The one play action was so bad that the primary receiver in the flat was triple covered. That is bad playcalling 101.

**To help with protection, in addition to keeping backs and tight ends to block, you need to vary the launching point of the quarterback. Carr is a friggin' sitting duck back there and it is borderline criminal to watch him set up in the same spot every time. A true roll out. A seven step drop. A three step Run & Shoot roll where he is throwing on the run. Many different ways to move the pocket. We create a statue with a bullseye. Move him!!!!

People seem to forget that while Oakland is not that good overall, they are ranked seventh in the NFL in total defense.

Overall:
There was one play that I think typifies our season and a lot of posters here on the message boards. Losing does this to people. My own team had a stretch of this during a losing streak this year with our season. It absolutely cannot happen. Mathis almost went the distance. Then Lundy rolls in from 3 yards out. Not ONE offensive player went to him to congratulate him. Not ONE. The team was not excited. The offense was not celebrating. They just went along in a businesslike fashion.

When you react this way, you are not going to be successful in anything you do. That, to me, was the most disappointing thing about today.

In closing, I am happy with the win. Very happy with the defense and dreaming of adding more players to the fold. We just don't have enough players right now. Looking forward to Mario and the boys breaking Tennessee's QB in half.
Actually coach Marciano called another good play on the fake hand off to Mathis on the punt return. Since Mathis had recently returned the kickoff they were just a tab bit nervous about him and it made the fake hand off work. Your analysis is an inditment of the coaching staff and I believe they are not a whole lot better than Capers and staff. I think Kubiak is an extemely lousy play caller, game manager, and game planner.

I too like what I saw from Mario today and of course Ryans is the real thing. However, as I also stated, its hard to evaluate this defensive performance based on Oakland. Let's see what we look like when we play the Titans.

I noticed the TV announcers were also wondering why Carr wasn't being moved around to vary the pocket. I think part of the answer is they were overwhelming our line so bad that you couldn't move to one side or the other. To me, however, the biggest defect of this game plan was that Oakland's strength is pass defense. We had to run the ball to win this game and Kubiak tried to call this game going against the strength of Oakland. We did not match up well against their defense and it certainly showed. I thought we planned very poorly for this game.

Another very apparent weakness is our punting game and we were made very painfully aware of it in this game. Yes, Oakland has one of the best, but it shows you what happens when you have a good punter. Stanly simply isn't cutting in anymore.

The bright side is that youth won this game and we won a game we should not have won. Oakland gave this game away and they knew it. We tried to give it away, but failed miserably in trying to do it. I guess there is some solice in that fact.
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Old 12-03-2006   #13
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Didn't read all the posts, but Cook didn't play today. It was Leach at FB today.
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Old 12-03-2006   #14
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Quote:
Originally Posted by coachdent View Post
Amen about the punting... seems like a season long frustration there.

The biggest complaint that I have about our formations is that they rarely do anything to gain the offense an advantage.

Oakland, for example, came out in a tight end set to the right and then flopped him over to the left to get him away from Mario when he was going with the tight end.
Ok coach, let me ask you this, if you had the call here would you replace Carr, or fix the o-line? With a decent line, would carr be fixable?
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Old 12-03-2006   #15
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

Sorry, but Sherman should probably replace Kubiak. Now we can start a real rousing debate.
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Old 12-03-2006   #16
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

coachdent..... good post.

but I'm starting to get the feeling that you aren't a big fan of Kubiak. I understand you use the ZBS with your team, & there is a bit of a difference in philosophy with they way you run it, and the way kubiak runs it.

I'm watching Denver right now, and everything you don't like, they also do. Fullback, lots of TE sets...... releasing the TE....

& I'm pretty sure Washington plays it the same way.

We actually look more like the 'Skins, with the size of our guys.

But, overall, a good post. Some good points. and best of all, good attitude.
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Old 12-03-2006   #17
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...



I think I'm going to start a campaign.

coachdent to replace Kubiak

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Old 12-03-2006   #18
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

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Originally Posted by Ibar_Harry View Post
Sorry, but Sherman should probably replace Kubiak. Now we can start a real rousing debate.

You're just so funny. You hate Kubiak for his playcalling.

Sooner or later, you'll realize the playcalling is a result of haveing David Carr behind the center. If we get another QB back their, this would be a totally different team.

This is not a knock on Carr. This is the truth. Kubiak is trying to find stuff Carr is comfortable with..... but there are only so many ways you can draw in a quick slant to Andre... There are only so many plays that do not utilize the middle of the field, and every play has to have the safety valve sitting withing 4 yards of the LOS.

We're trying to help Carr experience success, so he can grow to the point where he can lead this team.

That, and our offensive line can't block for our RBs. But, our last two losses came against teams with horrid offensive lines as well.
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Old 12-03-2006   #19
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
You're just so funny. You hate Kubiak for his playcalling.

Sooner or later, you'll realize the playcalling is a result of haveing David Carr behind the center. If we get another QB back their, this would be a totally different team.

This is not a knock on Carr. This is the truth. Kubiak is trying to find stuff Carr is comfortable with..... but there are only so many ways you can draw in a quick slant to Andre... There are only so many plays that do not utilize the middle of the field, and every play has to have the safety valve sitting withing 4 yards of the LOS.

We're trying to help Carr experience success, so he can grow to the point where he can lead this team.

That, and our offensive line can't block for our RBs. But, our last two losses came against teams with horrid offensive lines as well.

Of course it would be a different team. That doesn't mean it would be a better team. If Kubiak is trying to baby the QB than guess what Kubiak is at fault. If he's worried about one player than that means he's not worried about the team. One player does not a team make. Only so many ways to draw up a quick slant to AJ? True. Then why not draw up a quick slant for Moulds, why not one of Daniels? It seems he's trying to baby the offense because he's obviously not challenging them to be better. He's not showing any faith in their skills if he's doing this and they in kind will not show faith in his play calling if he has this attitude.
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Old 12-03-2006   #20
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Default Re: Objective...leave Whining At The Door...

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Didn't read all the posts, but Cook didn't play today. It was Leach at FB today.
Yeah you are right. The question is whether the running game was better, at least in part, because Leach was at FB and not Cook? Of course Dayne's performance and determination had more to do with it than anything.
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