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Old 11-19-2006   #1
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Default Our secondary sucks!

How the hell can you give up 2 83 yard TDs to one receiver? Losman has sucked all year and he has a field day against us. What the hell is up with that? That's just f'n ridiculous.

It's not only just this game. Just before this game, we ranked 20th in the league - giving up 215.1 yds/game, 13 TDs, and only have 6 INTs.

Our offseason better focus on the OL and our crappy secondary!
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Old 11-19-2006   #2
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

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Originally Posted by Texans34Life View Post
How the hell can you give up 2 83 yard TDs to one receiver? That's just f'n ridiculous.

Our offseason better focus on the OL and our crappy secondary!
Faggins is always getting burnt for big plays. He is a solid nickel corner but a below average starter.
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Old 11-19-2006   #3
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

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Originally Posted by Texans34Life View Post
How the hell can you give up 2 83 yard TDs to one receiver? That's just f'n ridiculous.

Our offseason better focus on the OL and our crappy secondary!
I think the safety took bad angles each time, almost like they underestimated Evans' speed. We had no speed in the secondary to matchup with Evans. Petey doesn't have the legs, but held his own late in the game when the coverage required underneath passing.

THis is nothing new though... we all knew the secondary is less than average, and the DL wasn't getting all that much pressure on Losman, to Buffalo's OL credit, they were strong.

It is obvious that it will be a focus in the off season.
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Old 11-19-2006   #4
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

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Originally Posted by kcwilson View Post
I think the safety took bad angles each time, almost like they underestimated Evans' speed. We had no speed in the secondary to matchup with Evans. Petey doesn't have the legs, but held his own late in the game when the coverage required underneath passing.

THis is nothing new though... we all knew the secondary is less than average, and the DL wasn't getting all that much pressure on Losman, to Buffalo's OL credit, they were strong.

It is obvious that it will be a focus in the off season.
Looked like a combination of these to me - our battered D-Line were really ordinary (their O-Line did a good job of forcing mario inside, and he just had no push at all off his right foot) and Losman had way too much time to make his completions. Having said that, he threw the ball well and his do-nothing receivers stepped up some.

We need a good cover FS and we need a CB with speed to line up opposite Dunta (LaRon Landry and Asante Samuel?). Faggins has the potential to be one of the better nickel CBs in the NFL (IMHO), but he's not a starter.

For all that though, there were a lot of positives. I liked the character our boys showed throughout the game. Although Buffalo (Clements in particular) did a great job shutting down the long pass, we still put up over 200 yards through the air; we dismantled their running game, our special teams did a great job pinning them back and BOTH our RBs stepped up to be counted. Apart from those long passes to Evans we dominated that game throughout. And Winston made a few big plays in his first start - he looked good at RT.

I'm crushed that we lost it with 9 seconds to go (NNNGH!) but overall I'm happy with how we played it, given the personnel that we have. Maybe Dexter Wynn can line up as CB next week - he wasn't bad when he played for Philly...
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Old 11-19-2006   #5
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

This is where you can put the blame on the loss.

The secondary, making JP Losman look like Joe Montana.

Ridiculous.
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Old 11-19-2006   #6
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

We still aren't getting pressure on the QB. The Bills guy had all day on way
too many passing plays.
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Old 11-19-2006   #7
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

What concerned me the most was that after getting beat, Faggins looked like he had a chance to dive at Evans feet or something and didnt. In fact on both TDs, Evans is getting chased by Faggins until maybe the 20 and then Faggins seems to just give up. I dont like that effort.
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Old 11-19-2006   #8
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

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Originally Posted by V Man View Post
Faggins is always getting burnt for big plays. He is a solid nickel corner but a below average starter.
OK, with a six guy blitz from us and the fastest guy on the Bills lined up over Faggins, whos responsiblity was it to be on top ? Who's responsiblity was it to get to the QB so he can't make the throw? Petie is what he is. Can't make a race horse out of a mule. Don't pile on. He's doing his best. There has been no support or play production out of our safeties this year. Without Mario 100% this only can be exasperated the rest of the year.
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Old 11-19-2006   #9
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

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Originally Posted by threetoedpete View Post
OK, with a six guy blitz from us and the fastest guy on the Bills lined up over Faggins, whos responsiblity was it to be on top ? Who's responsiblity was it to get to the QB so he can't make the throw? Petie is what he is. Can't make a race horse out of a mule. Don't pile on. He's doing his best. There has been no support or play production out of our safeties this year. Without Mario 100% this only can be exasperated the rest of the year.
Here is what you seem to be missing:

Faggins is not a starter for any other team in the NFL and would be a nickle on only a few teams as well. He doesn't have the wheels to make a play, but asking a FS to read both sides of the field and still be over top to one side is impossible.


I recognize that our FS/SS sucks, and that they aren't cover guys, but Faggins should not have a starting spot. I feel Sanders was better than him, and that Buchanon was better than him.

I'm not a bandwagon fan just dogging on him after today's game...I have been preaching this same "get him off the field" message for at least a year and a half.
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Old 11-19-2006   #10
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by awtysst View Post
What concerned me the most was that after getting beat, Faggins looked like he had a chance to dive at Evans feet or something and didnt. In fact on both TDs, Evans is getting chased by Faggins until maybe the 20 and then Faggins seems to just give up. I dont like that effort.
Faggins never looks like he gives his full effort and I really feel that wears off on our other players.
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Old 11-19-2006   #11
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

For all the hate P-Buc got at least he was fast, I am not sure P-Buc gets taken deep twice without running the guy down.

If your going to play slow corners you got to cover them deep with a safety, but you can't do that if your bringing the house.

So if we want to blitz a lot with players other than the front four we absolutely have to improve the speed and coverage ability of the secondary.

I think that we are a starting CB, FS and LB away from having a competitive defense.
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Old 11-19-2006   #12
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

I can't hate on Faggins too much because Evans is a burner. This is what safeties are for .... and ours aren't very safe.
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Old 11-19-2006   #13
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by YoungTexanFan View Post
Here is what you seem to be missing:

Faggins is not a starter for any other team in the NFL and would be a nickle on only a few teams as well. He doesn't have the wheels to make a play, but asking a FS to read both sides of the field and still be over top to one side is impossible.


I recognize that our FS/SS sucks, and that they aren't cover guys, but Faggins should not have a starting spot. I feel Sanders was better than him, and that Buchanon was better than him.

I'm not a bandwagon fan just dogging on him after today's game...I have been preaching this same "get him off the field" message for at least a year and a half.

Wow at the bolded. That guy was certified trash, at least petey makes a play every now and then, P-Burnt was just garbage & couldn't cover a Quadrapeligic. I am on record as saying i thought Sanders was solid over there but our safeties; CC & Earl are just not instinctive at all back there.

Look at The bills secondary. when DC threw it deep, the safety was right there over the top to assist, Ours just don't have the speed to get over there on time. I don't see how you can blame the D-line on those first 2 scores for the bills, I know for a fact JP held in there and took big hit from Mario & company so the pressure was there; the safeties just weren't.
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Old 11-19-2006   #14
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
Wow at the bolded. That guy was certified trash, at least petey makes a play every now and then, P-Burnt was just garbage & couldn't cover a Quadrapeligic. I am on record as saying i thought Sanders was solid over there but our safeties; CC & Earl are just not instinctive at all back there.

Look at The bills secondary. when DC threw it deep, the safety was right there over the top to assist, Ours just don't have the speed to get over there on time. I don't see how you can blame the D-line on those first 2 scores for the bills, I know for a fact JP held in there and took big hit from Mario & company so the pressure was there; the safeties just weren't.

Couple of things:

As bad as you may feel Buchanon was, he has more ability than Faggins and was improving a lot throughout TC.

The Bills secondary (safties) that played so well is made up of Donte Whittner from OSU taken 8th overall and Ko Simpson whom the Texans passed on.
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Old 11-19-2006   #15
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

Petey Faggins let vote him in to the pro bowl.
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Old 11-20-2006   #16
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

I have more of an issue with the defensive assignment than I do Faggins' shortcomings. Many posters here have opined that Faggins is not starter material for quite some time. Faggins hasn't magically gotten better - he is what he is. So why in the hell does the coaching staff insist on putting Robinson to one side of the field and leaving him there? Hello! The opposing team will just move their best WR away from him!!

Is there no one on the coaching staff that notices that AJ gets the opposing teams' best corner (Clements today) no matter where he lines up? Only when AJ goes into motion is he sometimes able to shake that corner pre-snap. Why the hell can't our team figure out that D-Rob is our best CB - scratch that - only starting-caliber CB - and assign him to the opposition's best WR? Evans is fast, but so is Robinson. He can run with him better than Faggins can, at any rate. This just seems so Capers-like. and I distinctly remember a MNF game where the Broncos played the Chiefs a couple years ago and the Broncos assigned Champ Bailey to cover Tony Gonzales all night, no matter which side he lined up on. So I know the concept isn't foreign to Kubiak.

Anyway, end of rant. I shouldn't even be here getting my blood pressure up.
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Old 11-20-2006   #17
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Default Re: Our secondary sucks!

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Originally Posted by eriadoc View Post
I have more of an issue with the defensive assignment than I do Faggins' shortcomings. Many posters here have opined that Faggins is not starter material for quite some time. Faggins hasn't magically gotten better - he is what he is. So why in the hell does the coaching staff insist on putting Robinson to one side of the field and leaving him there? Hello! The opposing team will just move their best WR away from him!!
Capers and crew did that too. I don't understand it either.
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Old 11-20-2006   #18
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Default When is enough enough? In terms of DB coverage

I know that most NFL teams line up DBs on one specifc side of the field, but I ask you, when is enough enough?

Faggins is slower than Dunta Robinson, and he is also slower than Lee Evans. SO why did Kubiak leave him on an Island multiple times against Evans?

Evans set a franchise record with 11 catches, 280+ yards, and 2 TDs. Why not set up your best DB on their best WR?
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Old 11-20-2006   #19
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Default Re: When is enough enough? In terms of DB coverage

I agree .... http://forums.houstontexans.com/show...981#post504981
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Old 11-20-2006   #20
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Default Re: When is enough enough? In terms of DB coverage

espn page 2 found Dunta's comments about Losman ironic it seems...

Quote:
J.P. Losman: After Losman led the Bills on a last-minute drive to defeat the Texans, Houston cornerback Dunta Robinson had this to say: "If that had been Peyton Manning, you'd expect it. But it was J.P. Losman. That's embarrassing. I hope he doesn't feel too good, because we just shot ourselves in the foot." Yeah, Losman, you shouldn't feel too good. You had to resort to a last-minute drive to beat Dunta Robinson and the Texans. Most teams usually put them away long before the fourth quarter. You should be embarrassed. You're so pathetic I'm surprised you're not a Houston Texan.
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2...e=gallo/061120
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