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Old 10-30-2006   #1
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Default Sage throws a tighter spiral.

I'm a big supporter of DC, probably the only one I know,but i have to admit that Sage' pass just plain look better. I've heard arguements of why throw sage to the wolves (NYG) bc he flat out throws a better ball.
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Old 10-30-2006   #2
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

except for the long ball....he cant hit the long ball to save his life.
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Old 10-30-2006   #3
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

At the risk of being flamed silly, I think Sage just looks like a better QB.

Reasons are a plenty (to disagree with me), and I'm fine with that. But I'm looking at production in game situations, and Sage has tighter passes and better pocket presence, IMHO. Sage seems to check down his receivers, where Carr tends to telegraph who he's looking at.

I still think we'll start Carr, but it's nice to know that we've got an adequate backup waiting in the wings.
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Old 10-30-2006   #4
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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Originally Posted by sprtsfanatic View Post
except for the long ball....he cant hit the long ball to save his life.
That's what I thought. I couldn't really see a difference in the spirals of the players, but Carr was more accurate with the deep pass. Rosenfels overthrew a couple of deep passes that I think Carr can usually make, or least put them where his recievers can catch them. The one's Sage threw were way overthrown. Sage did have better pocket presence however.
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Old 10-30-2006   #5
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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Originally Posted by TexanSam View Post
That's what I thought. I couldn't really see a difference in the spirals of the players, but Carr was more accurate with the deep pass. Rosenfels overthrew a couple of deep passes that I think Carr can usually make, or least put them where his recievers can catch them. The one's Sage threw were way overthrown. Sage did have better pocket presence however.
Totally agree with the pocket presence and I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed in inaccuracy with the long ball from sage. But that is a huge point to bring up...his pocket presence is awesome. slides, glides, moves and manipulates the pocket as well as I have seen anyone.
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Old 10-30-2006   #6
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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Originally Posted by sprtsfanatic View Post
Totally agree with the pocket presence and I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed in inaccuracy with the long ball from sage. But that is a huge point to bring up...his pocket presence is awesome. slides, glides, moves and manipulates the pocket as well as I have seen anyone.


I am starting to think that DC, has ticked off the O-line and they will not block for him, and Sage comes in and handles up like a real pro. What is up, how long do we have to wait for DC, in our 5th season, we should be a team to contend with, not the other way around. Is Jerry Jones helping McNair make these bad decisions, just for giggles? We need some serious help!!!!
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Old 10-30-2006   #7
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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I am starting to think that DC, has ticked off the O-line and they will not block for him...
Then the whole OL needs to be replaced. These guys are paid to produce. They don't have to like each other, or respect each other, but they DO have to get along and do their jobs. If Carr continues to struggle with consistancy, then it's the responsibility of the Coaches, not the players, to take the appropriate measures...much like what got dealt yesterday.
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Old 10-30-2006   #8
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

For the love of God . . .

Who frickin cares how tight his spiral is? Tony Banks had a tighter spiral and probably threw a better long ball. What in the hell does that prove?

All I care about . . is the ability to move the team down the field and put points on the board.

Being a former Carr apologist, I know what grasping at desperate straws looks like . . . and some of you need to give it up.
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Old 10-30-2006   #9
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

Honestly, guys, I think Carr's mental process could be broken by 200+ sacks in four years. I'm not doggin' the guy. I root for him to win as a Texans fan, and I always have.

But you have to be analytical about these things. He does have a tendency to act in certain ways when a hard rush is on. He hardly ever takes that one step to miss a sack, and he seems to have a hard time throwing a consistently good pass when he's a split second from being hit. I'm concerned that four seasons of beatings have taken their toll on his reflexes and mental focus.

Of course I hope I'm wrong. I just talk about what we all see on the field.
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Old 10-30-2006   #10
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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Originally Posted by sprtsfanatic View Post
except for the long ball....he cant hit the long ball to save his life.
How many times have you seen Carr throw a long ball in his 4+ years? For somone with a 'strong' arm, David rarely attempts anything over 10 yds and most of his passes are 'dink and dunk,' even to the wide outs...
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Old 10-30-2006   #11
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
Honestly, guys, I think Carr's mental process could be broken by 200+ sacks in four years. I'm not doggin' the guy. I root for him to win as a Texans fan, and I always have.

But you have to be analytical about these things. He does have a tendency to act in certain ways when a hard rush is on. He hardly ever takes that one step to miss a sack, and he seems to have a hard time throwing a consistently good pass when he's a split second from being hit. I'm concerned that four seasons of beatings have taken their toll on his reflexes and mental focus.

Of course I hope I'm wrong. I just talk about what we all see on the field.
Agreed...you will see the same thing with a dog that gets hit all the time. Just cause the poor pooch has new owners, doesn't change his learned traits and behaviors.

And I'm not equating Carr to a dog...just making a sad observation. I'm a Carr homer, and these thoughts make me sad, but there is this thing called a 'professional football team' that has to be considered as well.
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Old 10-30-2006   #12
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
At the risk of being flamed silly, I think Sage just looks like a better QB.

Reasons are a plenty (to disagree with me), and I'm fine with that. But I'm looking at production in game situations, and Sage has tighter passes and better pocket presence, IMHO. Sage seems to check down his receivers, where Carr tends to telegraph who he's looking at.

I still think we'll start Carr, but it's nice to know that we've got an adequate backup waiting in the wings.
The word from Miami last year is that he was great coming off the bench, but as a starter he was terrible (replaced by Gus Ferrote terrible). Anyway, he does throw a very bad deep ball, I think AJ had a step deep three times, and Sage overthrew him or missed him all three. However, the offense did open up under Sage, all things to consider.
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Old 10-30-2006   #13
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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Originally Posted by Texan Asylum View Post
Agreed...you will see the same thing with a dog that gets hit all the time. Just cause the poor pooch has new owners, doesn't change his learned traits and behaviors.

And I'm not equating Carr to a dog...just making a sad observation. I'm a Carr homer, and these thoughts make me sad, but there is this thing called a 'professional football team' that has to be considered as well.
Exactly. It's conditioned reflexes we're talking about. The first four years of a player's career are extremely important, especially for a QB. As a fan of both Carr and the Texans, I think it's a realistic angle that is a valid discussion.

Kubiak talked about part of this today:

ďI just think itís a conscious effort, to be honest with you. When you sit in that pocket, and Iíve done it as a player, when somebody gets beat at tackle or at guard and you know youíre fixing to take a thumping thatís the hardest thing to do in this league, to sit there and make that play. Something thatís even harder than that is to say, ĎHey thereís not excuse here, Iíve got to hang on to the football. Iím fixing to go down. I might get hit right here, but Iíve got to hang on to the ball.í So itís just a mentality, itís understanding the game; itís understanding the situation youíre in with your team. It just canít happen, you can talk about it and we can go out there and take a bag and beat on him and say, ĎYouíre in the pocket hang on to the ball.í But itís really just a conscious effort on his part, knowing that it canít happen for his team to be successful.Ē - Coach Kubiak / Source

Quote:
Originally Posted by run-david-run View Post
The word from Miami last year is that he was great coming off the bench, but as a starter he was terrible (replaced by Gus Ferrote terrible). Anyway, he does throw a very bad deep ball, I think AJ had a step deep three times, and Sage overthrew him or missed him all three. However, the offense did open up under Sage, all things to consider.
I've read those, too. And it is part of Sage's history in the league. However, he never had Kubiak as a coach. If he could help DC, then why couldn't he help Sage? And let's not forget, Rosenfel is a Kubiak hire.
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Old 10-30-2006   #14
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

The deep ball being off may just be a componet of being the backup and not getting time throwing to the starting WRs, so he is off on how far and how much air to use to hit them. Then again,may just throw the long ball badly.
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Old 10-30-2006   #15
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Default Re: Sage throws a tighter spiral.

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Originally Posted by hellbentforfootball View Post
I'm a big supporter of DC, probably the only one I know,but i have to admit that Sage' pass just plain look better. I've heard arguements of why throw sage to the wolves (NYG) bc he flat out throws a better ball.
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Sage throws a tighter spiral.
So does Tony Banks.
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