If Capers was gone with 2-14 does Kubiak go with 1-15?

[Rightnow]

I’m not calling for Kubiak’s head, but there is a possibility the only team we will beat is the Raiders. It isn’t out of the question that the Titans could beat us twice. We just gave up 495 yards against the Redskins and have progressively gotten worse every week.

Nearly everyone thought that we were getting better year-by-year when we went 7-9, but demanded (including myself) Capers to be let go after a terrible season. Last year’s losses were much closer too. There is no way around it; we are a terrible football team who is worse than last year’s team.

What does this mean if we are 1-15? Does Kubiak keep his job? Are most of the assistant coaches fired? I wonder…

[Hookem Horns]

Nice to finally see some optimism on this board. Hopefully we will get that win this season.

[powerfuldragon]

Dumb thread.

[Tulip]

No.

There's a huge difference between 2-14 in a coach's 4th season and 1-15 in a coach's 1st season.

Some records for 1st year head coaches:

Bill Walsh, 2-14 (followed by 6-10).

Jimmy Johnson, 1-15.

Bill Parcells, 3-12-1.

Tom Landry was 18-46 in his first five seasons at Dallas.

Chuck Noll, 1-13.

Bill Belichick, 6-10.

Joe Gibbs, 8-8.

Bud Grant, 3-8-3.

Marv Levy, 4-12.

Dick Vermeil, 4-10.

Don Coryell, 4-9-1.

Mike Ditka, 3-6.

Weeb Ewbank, 3-9.

Tony Dungy, 6-10.

Andy Reid, 5-11

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/spo...B?OpenDocument

[sleepwalker]

No, absolutely not.

[Hervoyel]

I think it depends on how that 1-15 looks. I think that firing a first year coach is always a strange thing to do.

You have essentially given the man one year to fix a 2-14 team so obviously you are asking something of him that's nearly impossible.

Having said that I think it's entirely possible that the Texans offense could start clicking and we could still end up losing games because the defense couldn't stop anyone. I'll even assert that the defense could get it together and start stopping people but we keep losing because the offense never gets on track.

If I saw one side of the ball start playing like they should be then I'd have to say we give him another year. If I saw both sides get somewhat better but it didn't translate to the win column then I'd again give him another year.

If we're giving up 500 yards a game and 30 points while our offense keeps up this 10-14 points a week with a vanishing act in the 2nd and 3rd quarters I think that he could be a candidate for the door.

That could just be leftover from my Oiler days (Bud would fire you because he didn't like the look on your face that morning) but I think if this team craters and Gary Kubiak has clearly lost them by the end of the year (which would mean he never really "had" them) then I could see it happening.

Edit
-------------------

I'd like to add that I think this very unlikely and I sure don't want to see it happen. I just think it's possible in a "worst case scenario"

[Blake]

Dont forget John Fox in Carolina. If im not mistaken, he went 1-15, then playoffs his second year. Just an FYI

[RTP2110]

Absolutely NO chance Kubiak will be fired after this season.

[Double Barrel]

What if we go 0-16 and Jeff Fisher is available in the off-season?

[AustinJB]

Give me a break...Kubiak is in his 1st yr and has the HUGE task ahead of him to rebuild the Texans.

The only coach to get fired if we go 1-15 will be Def. Coordinator Richard Smith. It will be his head that rolls....long before Kubiak would ever be fired.

[Hervoyel]

Originally Posted by Double Barrel

What if we go 0-16 and Jeff Fisher is available in the off-season?

Now that's just wrong man.

IF that happens this is going to be an ugly place to try and talk football so I don't want to start borrowing trouble before it gets here.

Double Barrel stop agitating the dots!

[profan]

no, we keep kubes, because i see think you will see the offense getting better. Probably will have to fire the DC as words cannot describe how bad they are playing.

[Double Barrel]

Originally Posted by Hervoyel

Now that's just wrong man.

IF that happens this is going to be an ugly place to try and talk football so I don't want to start borrowing trouble before it gets here.

Double Barrel stop agitating the dots!

heh-heh-heh

For the record, I like Kubiak and think we should give him as long as we gave Dom to make something happen.

[rmartin65]

I think the D coordinator could go. Not Kubiak.

[hollywood_texan]

Originally Posted by Hervoyel

If we're giving up 500 yards a game and 30 points while our offense keeps up this 10-14 points a week with a vanishing act in the 2nd and 3rd quarters I think that he could be a candidate for the door.

Agreed, I think it could be an issue if this team continues to play this way week in and week out. Kubiak is going to have a problem if doesn't show improvement.

No reasonable people were asking for a winning season, and reasonbale expectations were 4 games as victories.

But, getting worse from last year's squad just seems to be unacceptable. How do you extend Carr's contract with the reason to make a Super Bowl championship team and your team has gets worse?

Bottom line, as bad as the team was last year, it shouldn't be that hard to expect from the new coaching staff to show improvement from the previous year. If they can't, I don't know how they will build a championship team, which was the point of David Carr's exentension and hiring Gary Kubiak.

[mexican_texan]

Last time I say this: we are rebuilding, as in, we're setting ourselves up for the future. Tell me, what do the coaches in Tulip's list have in common? They went on runs, they weren't a one-and-done team, they were built for continuing success. It may be hard to go through tough times, just remember the season Dallas had before their dynasty started.

[mexican_texan]

Originally Posted by Double Barrel

heh-heh-heh

For the record, I like Kubiak and think we should give him as long as we gave Dom to make something happen.

Therein lies the question: does Kubiak get the same length leash Capers had? Capers took over an expansion team, but Kubiak has had more success and is installing a complicated system.

[Hervoyel]

Originally Posted by mexican_texan

Therein lies the question: does Kubiak get the same length leash Capers had? Capers took over an expansion team, but Kubiak has had more success and is installing a complicated system.

I don't think he does but I'm not saying that I think that's a good thing. I'm saying that I think he gets a little shorter leash because he's not starting from the ground up in Bob McNair's eyes and because if he tacks 3 years of failure on to Dom's 4 years of failure it will mean that the teams owner is sitting on a 7 year old franchise that's sucked from day one.

I believe that Bob McNair is a patient man but I think losing for 7 years and from day one is going to be a tough thing to get past. I think if Kubiak performs as badly as any of us can imagine he probably gets two years and is fired in or after the third.

[mexican_texan]

Originally Posted by BattleRedToro

Another thing they have in common is they all started as head coaches before the advent of the salary cap and the proliferation of free agency.

...as well as the time before the extensive scouting. Teams aren't built through FA, they're built through the draft.

[hollywood_texan]

Originally Posted by mexican_texan

Last time I say this: we are rebuilding, as in, we're setting ourselves up for the future. Tell me, what do the coaches in Tulip's list have in common? They went on runs, they weren't a one-and-done team, they were built for continuing success. It may be hard to go through tough times, just remember the season Dallas had before their dynasty started.

Nothing was ever built when it comes the Texans!

This team has no base and Kubiak can't even field a team more competitive than last year's squad so far this season.

I'm sorry, I don't think getting worse in the situation is a good sign. Generally, I think a 1st year coach should be given a chance even if things get worse. But not in the situation because of how bad the team was last year, particularly because Kubiak's background and that he is supposed to an offensive mastermind and David Carr is supposed to be Super Bowl caliber QB to build a team around. At least that is what remember McNair saying to me as a season ticket holder.