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Old 08-27-2006   #1
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Default Titans Summary (From their own board)

http://forums.titansonline.com/forum...ad.php?t=18316

Title of the thread
The good, the bad and the ugly

Quote:
I'm assuming this means good, bad, and ugly so far this preseason as a whole.

The Good - Thornton came to life tonight. Tulloch looks like he's ready to step up and contribute on defense. The only bad news there is that having him in the lineup will be a nightmare to those posters who already butcher Keith Bulluck's name. Ahmard Hall looks like a legitimate player. He's shown he can run, block, and catch. He also seems to get pass protection. Calvin Lowry is showing value as a fourth rounder. At least he'll hit somebody. Big Al has quietly had a decent preseason. When he's been in there, he's made some stops. See comment below on the D-line under "The Bad." The Tight Ends once again look strong. Bironas has been very impressive. Unfortunately, I'd rather have gone into the season having converted drives into touchdowns that relying on long field goal attempts, but that's not his fault. He's doing his job on placements and on kickoffs. Craig didn't have as strong of a game tonight as his other showings but to be fair one of his touchbacks could have been downed inside the five if the coverage guys would have paid attention to the ball. Their eyes were upfield and the ball hit behind them and rolled into the endzone. Again, not Craig's fault. LenDale looked in the Denver game like he could be a real running back. Unfortunately, he had little opportunity tonight. It's hard to get a good look at a back when you're being dominated and are already trailing by so much (much more than the score suggested).

Pacman's development on the field. He's played very well in limited action. He seems to be in on almost every play. Off the field, he's handled himself much better, this week's incident notwithstanding. We still don't know the whole story there, so I'll not judge him too harshly.

Wade looks like a keeper at WR. He's not a #1 guy, but a bright spot in the corps and is working hard.

The Bad - The team just doesn't seem ready or fired up to play. There's no evidence of leadership, despite having Bullock and bringing in the four veteran free agents. The lack of imagination in our play calling. Lack of fundamentals. I learned when I was a little guy that if my team needed six yards for a first down, to run my pattern at least seven yards deep. We don't have a receiver on the team who has the talent to turn in big yards after the catch. Speaking of receivers, someone has to hold onto the ball. Tonight wasn't as bad as the first game, but there were a few drops still and done nothing to show me this has really been fixed. Special teams coverage hasn't been great. We've had a few returned for good gains on us. I haven't actually counted but Bironas has either made the tackle or forced the returner out of bounds way too much in the first three games. This may (should) correct itself once the regular season starts and a regular group is put into place though.

The defense is as atrocious as the offensive line. For whatever reason, KVB isn't getting to the QB. Hopefully last year wasn't a fluke. Sure, he's being double-teamed more but Pro Bowlers still cause trouble back there. Haynesworth is doing a decent job, but our problems seem to be at DE. We either have the dumbest group of DE's ever, or they're being manhandled. How many of the runs tonight went right over the right DE? And those rollouts are killing us. This is what I mean by either dumb or manhandled. Schwartz is a zone guy and no one seems to be playing their zone. That's not saying I like Schwartz's D, but if that's the system we're running we need to be consistent and play our zones. Again, fundamentals are killing us - not playing our zones and not tackling. Mahelona's missed tackle of Norwood when they were inside our five was a perfect example. You have to wrap up on that play. Sirmon is our starting MLB and I've heard his name too little in these three games. He may be smart, etc, but I believe he's just too slow. I'll be surprised if he holds off Tulloch for the balance of the season. The only way he does is because of investment, which is dumb. Let the better player play.

The Ugly- The offensive line. Remember the old John McKay line? As head coach of the expansion Bucs who lost 26 straight games to begin their franchise, he was asked during a post-game press conference about his team's execution. His reply? "I'm all for it." That's our offense in a nutshell. Actually, this is our offense in a nutshell, "Help! I'm in a nutshell..." Ok, I'm rambling, but our O-line is terrible. They may be the worst line I've seen since the group that blocked for Barry Sanders his first few years in the league. I'm beginning to doubt whether there's a player outside of Mawae who could start on another team. As bad as everything else is, nothing stinks so badly as our O-line. It gives all new meaning to the term "offensive".

I'll throw another wrinkle in here -

Neutral - Some things are neither really good or bad. For whatever reason, the jury is still out. Some of these are -

Vince's development - It's easy to look at his poor showings and say we made a mistake, but it's hard to fault a rookie QB running for his life in a preseason game. I've seen flashes of things I like as well. Bullock as been solid, but he hasn't had that game where he shined like usual.

While we're talking about QB's, I'll throw Mauck into this category. Honestly, I should throw his situation in the "Bad" category, but it seems unfair to him to lump him in with problem areas. We're the only team in the league that I know of whose third team QB hasn't seen the field. Given Billy's injury history and Vince's style of play, it would make sense to get him so PT. We may see Matt in the regular season more than we believe right now.

Andre Woolfolk - He hasn't turned in a poor game yet, but he didn't have the great game tonight I expected out of him. It was his opportunity to shine. On the bright side, he wasn't burned either. I say he makes the team.

Maybe more than you wanted, but there's my good, bad, and ugly. Unfortunately, football is a little like a beauty pageant. Ten attractive girls can walk out and then one who... well, isn't and people will ask all night, "Can you believe that ONE girl even had the nerve to be in the pageant with all those beautiful girls?" We tend to remember the bad and the ugly better than we do the good. Maybe in this case, it's because there's so much more of it to see?
Thoughts?
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Old 08-27-2006   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon420tx
http://forums.titansonline.com/forum...ad.php?t=18316

Title of the thread
The good, the bad and the ugly



Thoughts?
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Old 08-27-2006   #3
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It all has a very familiar ring to it.
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Old 08-27-2006   #4
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Old Oilers fans who didn't jump on the darkside tackwagon when it left need to go over there - not to stir the pot - just to read. There's some really funny stuff on their board right now. Second guessing everything from Bud to Vince - Bud promoting his lawyer to head of football ops. It's very satisfying reading for some reason.
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Old 08-27-2006   #5
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Bud had his playoff runs in Tennessee. That team always has it's cycles. It has it LOW periods that typically last a long time followed by a few years of playoff runs that always end in disappointment. Those fans just happened to inherit the team when they were getting ready to go into the short playoff run part of the cycle. I think most of them thought it would always be that way despite our telling them differently.

It's also funny how some of them are already turning on VY followed by the UT fans defending him over there.
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Old 08-27-2006   #6
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I think hiring a lawyer as your COO is a better move than hiring an accountant to be your GM ( name this clown real Oiler fans ) .
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Old 08-27-2006   #7
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My favorite thread over there is this one

Con"Vince"me

One of the funniest things that I'm reading over there are from the "newbies" that flooded this board after the rosebowl. The same ones that told us that Vince would make the Texans so much more successful ,because "Vince doesn't need a great offensive line or great players to be successful" and that Carr was to blame for the line woes and we shouldn't use the line or talent around him as a excuse, because if Carr was a real "leader and great player" he would be able to "lead" his team without a great line and talent, are now telling Titan fans that Vince can't make plays like Cutler, because he plays behind a sorry oline.

They say

Quote:
Cutler wouldn't look so poised behind Tennessee's OL.

It's easy to be poised when you have a good OL and your team can run the ball well.

Cutler is going to be a good QB. But you can't just make a straight comparison of the two while disregarding the differences in players around them.
Everything he said was true to some extent, but he also fails to realize that in college Cutler made great plays and did more with less than any other QB in college. I said before the draft he was the best prospect and I still think he is. Cutler will become the next great QB that slipped through the draft, like Rothlisberger and Marino. Shanahan is going to turn him into a great player............and the best part is......the Titans didn't get him Thank god that idiot owner of theirs didn't listen to his coach

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Old 08-27-2006   #8
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We blow. I've been to over 65 Titans games and last night's was the most boring pathetic game I've seen in person. Worst playcalling I've seen in a long time. Our coordinators are lame and our veterans are playing like rookies. Our stadium did in fact sound like a library.
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Old 08-27-2006   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb
Cutler will become the next great QB that slipped through the draft, like Rothlisberger and Manning. Shanahan is going to turn him into a great player............and the best part is......the Titans didn't get him Thank god that idiot owner of theirs didn't listen to his coach
Which Mannng slipped through the Draft?? Archie?? or did you mean Brady??

I'll agree that Cutler should have been picked ahead of Lienart, but never Vince. And his stock actually improved as we got closer to the draft... He was a late first round at best in January, and he almost made the top ten...... that's pretty good if you ask me.... coming from a decent program in a down year..

Lienart slipped....... Jay climbed......
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Old 08-27-2006   #10
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I also find it interesting that All the "Vince didn't win the NC by himself....... it was a team...... a team....." guys are discounting the team in Tennessee's showing.

I'm personally not upset, or distraught from what I see from Vince so far.... he's doing the things we thought he would, & learning the hard way, that they hit harder in the NFL, and that dudes are faster, quicker, and smarter. He'll be fine though. Soon as they stop wasting their time with Voleck, and start working on the Vince Young show........ they'll be fine.
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Old 08-27-2006   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderkyss
Which Mannng slipped through the Draft?? Archie?? or did you mean Brady??

I'll agree that Cutler should have been picked ahead of Lienart, but never Vince. And his stock actually improved as we got closer to the draft... He was a late first round at best in January, and he almost made the top ten...... that's pretty good if you ask me.... coming from a decent program in a down year..

Lienart slipped....... Jay climbed......
Crap...I meant marino. I'll fix it....for some reason everytime I think about Marino, Peyton pops into my head....go figure

Cutler should of been picked ahead of Vince, especially if you think he should of been picked ahead of Lienart, who was also a safer more proven QB.

Nobody climbed in the draft like Vince Young. Before the rosebowl game he wasn't even a prospect that was going into the draft and without that game he most likely would of been a 3rd round pick.

Young was a great college QB, but Cutler's and Lienart's skills translate better to the pro game.

Last edited by Carr Bombed; 08-27-2006 at 12:37 PM.
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Old 08-27-2006   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon420tx
http://forums.titansonline.com/forum...ad.php?t=18316

Title of the thread
The good, the bad and the ugly



Thoughts?
My thoughts on this is better get a trap out, there's a new rat in the basement.
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Old 08-27-2006   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb
Crap...I meant marino. I'll fix it....for some reason everytime I think about Marino, Peyton pops into my head....go figure

Cutler should of been picked ahead of Vince, especially if you think he should of been picked ahead of Lienart, who was also a safer more proven QB.

Nobody climbed in the draft like Vince Young. Before the rosebowl game he wasn't even a prospect that was going into the draft and without that game he most likely would of been a 3rd round pick.

Young was a great college QB, but Cutler's and Lienart's skills translate better to the pro game.

Do we need to start this again?? Vince wasn't a prospect, because it was all but gauranteed that he would play his senior year, like every UT junior who's ever played for MacBrown...... including PriestHolmes, and RickyWilliams.... it was unheard of.

How else can a Heisman Candidate...... one who finished better than Lienart not be considered a top 10 pick??

& if you go out to draft the most NFL ready guy, you get TimCouch, RyanLeaf, and AlexSmith...... You draft based on upside & talent.... you're looking for the special player in the top 10....... that's how you get Donavan McNabbs, and Michael Vicks as top 10 picks.
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Old 08-27-2006   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderkyss
Do we need to start this again?? Vince wasn't a prospect, because it was all but gauranteed that he would play his senior year, like every UT junior who's ever played for MacBrown...... including PriestHolmes, and RickyWilliams.... it was unheard of.

How else can a Heisman Candidate...... one who finished better than Lienart not be considered a top 10 pick??
eric crouch ..and jason white.. heisman
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Old 08-27-2006   #15
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Just because Lienart and Cutler are "NFL ready" doesn't mean they don't have just as much upside as Young.

They both played in more complex offenses than Young. Cutler spent his years getting his brains beat in surrounded by scrubs, which is a testiment to his toughness, competitiveness, and potential (upside & talent)

Everyone forgets that Lienart went 29 or 40 for over 365 yards against the #1 defense in the country and won 1 1\2 titles before that game, again showing his potential (upside & talent)

For every Couch or Leaf you bring up, I can bring up players like Kordell Stewart and Akili Smith who were drafted on their high potential ceiling, but extremely low floor. Also I wouln't bring Alex Smith into the equation seeing how he ran a offense similar to the one Vince ran in college.

One of the best posts I've seen in a long time was in the Titans thread which it seems the Mods pulled off their board........hmm....

went something like this, its like playing the lottery

you have a 1 in 2 chance of winning the lienart lottery and the max prise is $800,000 dollars

you have a 1 in 2.5 chance of winning the Cutler lottery and the max prise is $900,000 dollars

you have a 1 in 4 chance of winning the Young lottery and the max prise is $1,000,000 dollars

Yes potential wise most people believe he has a higher ceiling, which isn't much higher

But the floor on Vince is a trap door that can open up and cause your franchise to fall through many years of turmoil in the basement.

I don't think the risk/reward was there with Vince, so yeah I would of went with the safer pick, which has about just as much potential as Vince, but has a higher chance of reaching their full potential

Last edited by Carr Bombed; 08-27-2006 at 01:13 PM.
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Old 08-27-2006   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hookem Horns
It's also funny how some of them are already turning on VY followed by the UT fans defending him over there.
Sometimes I wish we could put them all in the same room and watch them smack the crap out of each other.

Its going to be a LONG season and I'm already started making the shooters stronger. When I come to Texas in December I intend to drink heavily.
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Old 08-27-2006   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aj.
Old Oilers fans who didn't jump on the darkside tackwagon when it left need to go over there - not to stir the pot - just to read. There's some really funny stuff on their board right now. Second guessing everything from Bud to Vince - Bud promoting his lawyer to head of football ops. It's very satisfying reading for some reason.
I can't even register over there. It says the administator has banned my email, but I have never tried to regiester over there before.
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Old 08-27-2006   #18
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eric crouch ..and jason white.. heisman
Woops..........
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Old 08-27-2006   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb
Just because Lienart and Cutler are "NFL ready" doesn't mean they don't have just as much upside as Young.
But they don't......
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb
They both played in more complex offenses than Young. Cutler spent his years getting his brains beat in surrounded by scrubs, which is a testiment to his toughness, competitiveness, and potential (upside & talent)
but because they played in as complex a system as they might ever see... we already know where their top is...... it's easier to judge where their ceiling might be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb
Everyone forgets that Lienart went 29 or 40 for over 365 yards against the #1 defense in the country and won 1 1\2 titles before that game, again showing his potential (upside & talent)
no.. that doesn't show his potential........ that shows what he is capable of. Again.. we've got a really good idea of his ceiling.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb
For every Couch or Leaf you bring up, I can bring up players like Kordell Stewart and Akili Smith who were drafted on their high potential ceiling, but extremely low floor. Also I wouln't bring Alex Smith into the equation seeing how he ran a offense similar to the one Vince ran in college.
Was Cordell drafted as a QB?? Was he drafted particullarly high?? I don't remember..... still, you're proving my point.... you draft on potential.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bomb
One of the best posts I've seen in a long time was in the Titans thread which it seems the Mods pulled off their board........hmm....

went something like this, its like playing the lottery

you have a 1 in 2 chance of winning the lienart lottery and the max prise is $800,000 dollars

you have a 1 in 2.5 chance of winning the Cutler lottery and the max prise is $900,000 dollars

you have a 1 in 4 chance of winning the Young lottery and the max prise is $1,000,000 dollars

Yes potential wise most people believe he has a higher ceiling, which isn't much higher

But the floor on Vince is a trap door that can open up and cause your franchise to fall through many years of turmoil in the basement.

I don't think the risk/reward was there with Vince, so yeah I would of went with the safer pick, which has about just as much potential as Vince, but has a higher chance of reaching their full potential
If you see it that way..... fine....... no biggie..... but the floor on Cutler & Lienart is just as low as Vince, meaning bust........ it could happen.. But if Vince doesn't make it as a QB....... you could always make him a Reciever.
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Old 08-27-2006   #20
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eric crouch ..and jason white.. heisman
Don't forget Chris Weinke
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