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Old 08-25-2006   #1
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Default Carr looking for his Tight Ends....

What is it going to take for DC to start looking at his TE's? Go back and look at the last 2 games Play by Play on NFL.com. DC has only thrown 2 passes to his TE's and that was back to back! Sage has thrown at leat 7 times to his TE's in the 2 Games! Haven`t even counted passes to RB's from Sage. I know Sage will not start. But is it a mental issue with DC that he doesn't look at at his TE's on a check down?
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Old 08-25-2006   #2
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Originally Posted by CaptainPatriot
What is it going to take for DC to start looking at his TE's? Go back and look at the last 2 games Play by Play on NFL.com. DC has only thrown 2 passes to his TE's and that was back to back! Sage has thrown at leat 7 times to his TE's in the 2 Games! Haven`t even counted passes to RB's from Sage. I know Sage will not start. But is it a mental issue with DC that he doesn't look at at his TE's on a check down?
Somebody just needs to tell him what a TE is....he probably forgot. He saw it by Bennie Joppru's name on the roster for years and thought it meant Traumatic Experiences
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Old 08-25-2006   #3
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when you are O-fer on 3rd down passes the NFL makes you go to the sidelines and your defense comes in.
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Old 08-25-2006   #4
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it's going to take time and kubiak kicking him in the rear for a few weeks. carr hasnt had a TE since billy miller played well in 02. also, he's more inclined to dump to the RB in TE situations because A) he was told to do so by capers & co, and B) he's been behind the worst line in NFL history - get it quick to DD so that he gets hit instead. i expect to for putz to be the most influential player in our passing attack (not necessarily the most catches, but as carr's safety net much like wycheck), but i dont think we'll see that until atleast a couple games in. there are a lot of bad habits to be hammered out of carr this year, this is one of them.
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Old 08-25-2006   #5
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Originally Posted by Scooter
it's going to take time and kubiak kicking him in the rear for a few weeks. carr hasnt had a TE since billy miller played well in 02. also, he's more inclined to dump to the RB in TE situations because A) he was told to do so by capers & co, and B) he's been behind the worst line in NFL history - get it quick to DD so that he gets hit instead. i expect to for putz to be the most influential player in our passing attack (not necessarily the most catches, but as carr's safety net much like wycheck), but i dont think we'll see that until atleast a couple games in. there are a lot of bad habits to be hammered out of carr this year, this is one of them.
There's always the chance that when the season starts and the real playbook is open some of the things we think we are struggling with will disappear. We have a coaching staff that's made some pretty drastic improvements. We may be ok.
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Old 08-25-2006   #6
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Originally Posted by Scooter
it's going to take time and kubiak kicking him in the rear for a few weeks. carr hasnt had a TE since billy miller played well in 02. also, he's more inclined to dump to the RB in TE situations because A) he was told to do so by capers & co, and B) he's been behind the worst line in NFL history - get it quick to DD so that he gets hit instead. i expect to for putz to be the most influential player in our passing attack (not necessarily the most catches, but as carr's safety net much like wycheck), but i dont think we'll see that until atleast a couple games in. there are a lot of bad habits to be hammered out of carr this year, this is one of them.
Scooter when you are the #1 pick in the draft it is for a reason. I just do not buy that players of that suppossed talent level are stripped down and built up or down by coaches unless they were over hyped to begin with or their game does not transfer to speed of the NFL. You just do not forget how to play the game.

And this is not exclusive to Carr.
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Old 08-25-2006   #7
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There's always the chance that when the season starts and the real playbook is open some of the things we think we are struggling with will disappear. We have a coaching staff that's made some pretty drastic improvements. We may be ok.
extremely possible. we dont know what areas they're more focusing on during preseason or how they're calling the games. it's very likely that kubiak's more comfortable with the putz & carr connection than any other area so they're focusing more on weaknesses. this week should be a bit of an indicator however because kubiak said that the staff will be treating this game much more like a regular season game from the coaching standpoint. much more preperation and studying than in previous weeks.

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Scooter when you are the #1 pick in the draft it is for a reason. I just do not buy that players of that suppossed talent level are stripped down and built up or down by coaches unless they were over hyped to begin with or their game does not transfer to speed of the NFL. You just do not forget how to play the game.

And this is not exclusive to Carr.
honestly i think we'd be better off this year if carr were a rookie again because i feel that he really does have to be broken down & rebuilt ... as would any player who'd been taught to do things the wrong way for 4 consecutive years. not only do some areas have to be broken down (progressions, reads, movement), some have to be found again (confidance mainly - in himself, protection, & scheme). what carr's talent level then and now as the #1 means that it isnt going to take another 2-3 years to do so ... he should adapt and return to form much more quickly than a lesser talent.
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Old 08-25-2006   #8
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Originally Posted by Scooter
honestly i think we'd be better off this year if carr were a rookie again because i feel that he really does have to be broken down & rebuilt ... as would any player who'd been taught to do things the wrong way for 4 consecutive years. not only do some areas have to be broken down (progressions, reads, movement), some have to be found again (confidance mainly - in himself, protection, & scheme). what carr's talent level then and now as the #1 means that it isnt going to take another 2-3 years to do so ... he should adapt and return to form much more quickly than a lesser talent.
Good argument scooter but I think this is wildly overstated from our fans. So far Carr has been nothing less than a workout warrior in his 60 NFL starts. Many of the teams problems come from the weaknesses in his game never progressing. To me he is a physical prototype with no instinct and a poor feel for the game and I pointed many of these problems out right off the bat many moons ago.....fast forward 60 starts and his weaknesses are still unimproved. I'm not sure how much coaching will be needed to get him up to speed.
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Old 08-25-2006   #9
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Good argument scooter but I think this is wildly overstated from our fans. So far Carr has been nothing less than a workout warrior in his 60 NFL starts. Many of the teams problems come from the weaknesses in his game never progressing. To me he is a physical prototype with no instinct and a poor feel for the game and I pointed many of these problems out right off the bat many moons ago.....fast forward 60 starts and his weaknesses are still unimproved. I'm not sure how much coaching will be needed to get him up to speed.
i agree completely. what i liken him to however is jake plummer. talent without team and without coaching gets you nowhere. jake didnt progress, and arguably got worse in arizona ... being on a bad team with bad coaching puts a quarterback in limbo at best. put him in denver with fantastic coaching and good scheme, and he goes to the probowl. jake plummer didnt and doesnt have the physical talent that carr does, but coaching was able to correct the previous flaws, and develope healthy habits that made him a better player. i firmly believe carr is in the exact same situation. he now has better players around him, a better scheme to exploit his strengths, but IMO it's still going to take a little time to remove bad habits and be coached into good habits.
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Old 08-25-2006   #10
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Originally Posted by Vinny
Good argument scooter but I think this is wildly overstated from our fans. So far Carr has been nothing less than a workout warrior in his 60 NFL starts. Many of the teams problems come from the weaknesses in his game never progressing. To me he is a physical prototype with no instinct and a poor feel for the game and I pointed many of these problems out right off the bat many moons ago.....fast forward 60 starts and his weaknesses are still unimproved. I'm not sure how much coaching will be needed to get him up to speed.
I guess we're going to find out, aren't we?

Michael Vick is in the same boat IMO. He's been touted e-v-e-r-y year as the next big thing...and now he's been relegated to ho-hum status by most fantasy football gurus. They're just tired of the hype.

Falcons have a guy in Matt Schaub who could probably guide that team to a better record, but.....they just can't seem to hand it over to him yet. I'm anxious to see what happens in Houston and Atlanta this season. Two teams whose QB is a physical prototype but hasn't produced to the expectations of all involved. Should be interesting to see it unfold. And that's the fun of NFL to me: Watching things develop and seeing how they turn out. And winning...I guess that's kind of a big deal too.
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Old 08-25-2006   #11
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Originally Posted by Scooter
i agree completely. what i liken him to however is jake plummer. talent without team and without coaching gets you nowhere. jake didnt progress, and arguably got worse in arizona ... being on a bad team with bad coaching puts a quarterback in limbo at best. put him in denver with fantastic coaching and good scheme, and he goes to the probowl. jake plummer didnt and doesnt have the physical talent that carr does, but coaching was able to correct the previous flaws, and develope healthy habits that made him a better player. i firmly believe carr is in the exact same situation. he now has better players around him, a better scheme to exploit his strengths, but IMO it's still going to take a little time to remove bad habits and be coached into good habits.
I agree to some extent but when you look at Denver they drafted Cutler in the first round this last year for a reason. Carr isn't anywhere near as good as Plummer right now and apparently he isn't good enough for them.
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Old 08-25-2006   #12
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i agree completely. what i liken him to however is jake plummer. talent without team and without coaching gets you nowhere. jake didnt progress, and arguably got worse in arizona ... being on a bad team with bad coaching puts a quarterback in limbo at best. put him in denver with fantastic coaching and good scheme, and he goes to the probowl. jake plummer didnt and doesnt have the physical talent that carr does, but coaching was able to correct the previous flaws, and develope healthy habits that made him a better player. i firmly believe carr is in the exact same situation. he now has better players around him, a better scheme to exploit his strengths, but IMO it's still going to take a little time to remove bad habits and be coached into good habits.
Something I have been thinking about: One guy plays like hell itself is chasing him and that he's got nothing to lose. And another guy plays like everything is still oke-dokey if we don't win. Both are talented. Both were on bad teams and are now on good teams. But are both guys the same from a mental standpoint? Does one guy play to win, and one guy plays NOT to lose? Does one guy see football as his only real love, and one guy sees family and faith as the real source of contentment? Cuz I gotta' tell you something: IN the NFL, it sure seems like you better have your head on a swivel come game day. You better act like you're treading through the jungle and it's survival of the fittest out there.

Not banging our guy. I have taken a lot of bullets for him on this board. Stayed up many nights trying to fight the haters (and not everyone of them was a true hater, but still nonetheless...).

It's just that you can't get around facts. And at the end of the day, David needs to get his inner "bad arse" on and play like each game is his last. I see him tryihng to do that, in subtle ways, but he might need to really get freaky and go wild on someone...get in a receiver's face and grab his facemask after a dropped ball. That's what I want to see. Inner bad arse.
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Old 08-25-2006   #13
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What is it going to take for DC to start looking at his TE's? Go back and look at the last 2 games Play by Play on NFL.com. DC has only thrown 2 passes to his TE's and that was back to back! Sage has thrown at leat 7 times to his TE's in the 2 Games! Haven`t even counted passes to RB's from Sage. I know Sage will not start. But is it a mental issue with DC that he doesn't look at at his TE's on a check down?
If you recall billy miller was the closest thing to a recieving TE that we had and he was david's favorite target. They hooked up often... It has only been 2 PRESEASON games give him time to adapt during the regular season im sure daniels and putzier will get plenty of balls their way.
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Old 08-25-2006   #14
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Inner bad arse.
Waiter, I will have the Inner Bad Arse and a coke with no ice. Call it whatever you will, but we all want to see it.
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Old 08-25-2006   #15
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oh man another bash the golden boy that does no wrong thread homers get ready.
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Old 08-25-2006   #16
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oh man another bash the golden boy that does no wrong thread homers get ready.
Ducks quack.

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It's what we do. We need to all embrace it, accept it. And just learn to cope with the pain and discomfort.
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Old 08-25-2006   #17
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Or hope he throws for 5000 yards and 49 TD's! Oh, and we go 19-0..that should keep most of us happy...for one season
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Old 08-25-2006   #18
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I agree to some extent but when you look at Denver they drafted Cutler in the first round this last year for a reason. Carr isn't anywhere near as good as Plummer right now and apparently he isn't good enough for them.
sorry, i'm just being arguementative at this point ... carr hasnt had the chance to be as good as plummer yet. and something that everyone seems to forget is that plummer's worst season as a bronco ended up being worth 4000+ yards and 27td's. last year he went 9-1 at home and took his team to the AFC championship game (and we're going to faint over a .500 season). denver drafted cutler looking for "the next elway" (and the kid's pretty dang good whether you need a qb or not) ... a 31 year old plummer wont reach elway status even if they win the SB this year.
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Old 08-25-2006   #19
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I think that if they thought Plummer was good enough to lead them to a Super Bowl they would have drafted someone else. I agree that Plummer in Arizona had better years than Carr has ever had here. Carr hasn't been able to carry this team in tight situations at all.
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Old 08-25-2006   #20
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Or hope he throws for 5000 yards and 49 TD's! Oh, and we go 19-0..that should keep most of us happy...for one season
I'd be happy if he converted more 3rd down passes.
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