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Old 07-25-2006   #1
fastpitchwoof
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Default DE and LB switching postions

There have been many DEs or LBs that come out of college at one position and switch to the other. I think that it is mostly DEs switching to LB (Babin / Peek). How many times does this actually work out well. In our case we were switching them for the 3-4. I just don't see this switching positions that these guys have been playing for their entire college career working out that often. It must work sometime or they wouldn't do it. Help me out here. How often does this work??

I am looking forward to seeing Babin and Peek get back to their "natural" positions this year so that we can see what they can do. I know they are a bit undersized (hence the switch) but maybe they can think less and play more.

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Old 07-25-2006   #2
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I've read some articles talking about how our defense could struggle making the switch from the 3-4 to the 4-3, I don't see it happening though. I am not saying we will come out with a top 10 defense, but the transition I feel will be much easier than some in the media anticipate.
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Old 07-25-2006   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fastpitchwoof
There have been many DEs or LBs that come out of college at one position and switch to the other. I think that it is mostly DEs switching to LB (Babin / Peek). How many times does this actually work out well. In our case we were switching them for the 3-4. I just don't see this switching positions that these guys have been playing for their entire college career working out that often. It must work sometime or they wouldn't do it. Help me out here. How often does this work??

I am looking forward to seeing Babin and Peek get back to their "natural" positions this year so that we can see what they can do. I know they are a bit undersized (hence the switch) but maybe they can think less and play more.

It works all the time. OLB's in 3-4 defenses are ALL undersized college DE's. These players are not ideal DE's in the pros because they do not have the size teams want hence the 'tweener' label. We run a 4-3 now so that means Babin and Peek are project DE's as they had less value to 4-3 teams in their given draft...the only reason they were picked as high as they were is because they were not ends with the size you look for to deal with NFL tackles and fit into a 3-4.
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Old 07-25-2006   #4
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Originally Posted by Vinny
It works all the time. OLB's in 3-4 defenses are ALL undersized college DE's. These players are not ideal DE's in the pros because they do not have the size teams want hence the 'tweener' label.
Has it worked for Babin and Peek? I'm asking how often does it translate into 1 player becoming a solid ballplayer at the new position. I am not bashing Babin and Peek. I think that they will be able to generate some pressure on the QB.
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Old 07-25-2006   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fastpitchwoof
Has it worked for Babin and Peek? I'm asking how often does it translate into 1 player becoming a solid ballplayer at the new position. I am not bashing Babin and Peek. I think that they will be able to generate some pressure on the QB.
It generally takes about 3 years before tweeners are comfortable enough to play in space at a high level. I didn't think much of Peek's game but I thought Babin was coming around.
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Old 07-25-2006   #6
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it does take time for most players to adjust, and it doesnt always work but when it does...

Terrel Suggs played DE at Arizona State and has 30.5 sacks in 3 season as an OLB for the Ravens...

Willie McGinnest was a DE in college and he turned out ok also...

and Merriman was the DRotY for the Chargers... DE for the Terps, OLB in San Diego...

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Old 07-25-2006   #7
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I find it odd that this is even an issue since Babin was always on the tackle when he rushed the QB or defended the rush. This will be a good year for Babin, but Peek was pushed around all year last year and that is why teams always ran at him, and/or away from Babin who is good against the run.
Look at the Ravens, and you will find that even the Great Ray Lewis, needed a big man in the middle to sheild him so he could make plays,( his words ) and now we have Weaver, Smith, Payne, Kalu, T. Johnson (?), Williams & Babin, I think 4-3 will be a great move for the team.
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Old 07-25-2006   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TommyS
it does take time for most players to adjust, and it doesnt always work but when it does...

Terrel Suggs played DE at Arizona State and has 30.5 sacks in 3 season as an OLB for the Ravens...

Willie McGinnest was a DE in college and he turned out ok also...

and Merriman was the DRotY for the Chargers... DE for the Terps, OLB in San Diego...
All the great OLB's for the Steelers have been converted DE's...same for the Patriots. Any team that runs a 3-4 has to find undersized College DE's to play OLB because College OLB's do not tend to be 250 pounds with legit pass rushing skills (which are different from blitzing skills if you have paid attention to the coaches over the last few years).
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Old 07-25-2006   #9
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Wasn't Kearse a LB in college that went to DE?
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Old 07-25-2006   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TommyS
and Merriman was the DRotY for the Chargers... DE for the Terps, OLB in San Diego...
Merriman may have actually started quite a bit as a LB but at the very least played alot of LB at Maryland, one of the few colleges to use the 3-4 D. And his collegiate experience showed and payed off big time, as he was not only the D RoY in '05, but went to Honolulu.
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Old 07-25-2006   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fastpitchwoof
There have been many DEs or LBs that come out of college at one position and switch to the other. I think that it is mostly DEs switching to LB (Babin / Peek). How many times does this actually work out well. In our case we were switching them for the 3-4. I just don't see this switching positions that these guys have been playing for their entire college career working out that often. It must work sometime or they wouldn't do it. Help me out here. How often does this work??

I am looking forward to seeing Babin and Peek get back to their "natural" positions this year so that we can see what they can do. I know they are a bit undersized (hence the switch) but maybe they can think less and play more.


OLB / DE = same position...it is only the scheme that changes (4-3 / 3-4)....thats why
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Old 07-25-2006   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosewood
OLB / DE = same position...it is only the scheme that changes (4-3 / 3-4)....thats why
um, wrong. 3-4 OLB's play in space and have linebacker responsibilities while 4-3 ends rarely play in space. True that both are the primary edge rushers for each alignment but you are not correct when you say that the two positions are essentially the same.....big men have a hard time playing in space so that is why it takes a certain body type and special athlete to man the 3-4 OLB.
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Old 07-25-2006   #13
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Originally Posted by Vinny
um, wrong. 3-4 OLB's play in space and have linebacker responsibilities while 4-3 ends rarely play in space. True that both are the primary edge rushers for each alignment but you are not correct when you say that the two positions are essentially the same.....big men have a hard time playing in space so that is why it takes a certain body type and special athlete to man the 3-4 OLB.
lol..space...big men...hard time....????.....if you played football then you know the assignments...no need for the breakdown and actually they are the same position..once again its the scheme that changes the technique....lol
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Old 07-25-2006   #14
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lol...if you played football then you know the assignments...no need for the breakdown and actually they are the same position...lol
I played for a loooong time as well as being a DE in a 4-3 D. I'm 6-5 250 pds and highly doubt could ever be an OLB in a 3-4. Do some research to validate your point and I might change my mind.....umm then again I might not.
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Old 07-25-2006   #15
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I played for a loooong time as well as being a DE in a 4-3 D. I'm 6-5 250 pds and highly doubt could ever be an OLB in a 3-4. Do some research to validate your point and I might change my mind.....umm then again I might not.
OK 6'5 250.....no research needed...i played ball....NCAA as a matter of fact so my knowledge is up to par...I not trying to offend you are anything and if i did my bad...just talking football...I'm just saying an OLB / DE is the same...OLB tend to be more athletic but its the same position...big ir small...lol....Check A. Peek, Hugh Dug, J. Porter, and all the OLB's in the game. The spacing only depends on the scheme once again..not questioning your life...a football player would understand me....
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Old 07-25-2006   #16
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OK 6'5 250.....no research needed...i played ball....NCAA as a matter of fact so my knowledge is up to par...I not trying to offend you are anything and if i did my bad...just talking football...I'm just saying an OLB / DE is the same...OLB tend to be more athletic but its the same position...big ir small...lol....Check A. Peek, Hugh Dug, J. Porter, and all the OLB's in the game. The spacing only depends on the scheme once again..not questioning your life...a football player would understand me....
I played college ball as well but enough of the "my dad can beat up your dad" type of posts. Ummm lets see maybe we can drop Mario and Weaver out in coverage.. hmm..not. I guess it's your opinion. Good luck
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Old 07-25-2006   #17
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6' 198lb
Former College Safety Here..

So I'm just gonna stay out of this one...
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Old 07-25-2006   #18
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I'm having a real difficult time with the 'Reggie Hayward or Paul Spicer at OLB' visual. LOL.
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