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Old 06-29-2006   #1
johnny_tlmn
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Post What totally ticks me off when.....

...people who supposedly know a little something about the game making statements like "David Carr is 18-46 as a starter." That statement is an idiot finder, and its always helpful to know who those people are, so that is the one redeeming value. It's like fingernails on a chalkboard. It's the same sensation I get when I hear people STILL pronouncing Craig Biggio's last name as Beeegio...(see: Patrick, Dan) he has only been in the majors nineteen years... ...

Anyone who honesty believes that wins and losses can be fairly assigned to quarterbacks as they are to baseball pitchers could fit their knowledge of football on a kicking tee. Actually, it isn't always fair in baseball (see: Clemens, Rodger) much less football.
If you simply are not a fan of David Carr thats fine. There are legitimate points to be brought up regarding his performance, but don't attempt to pin all 46 losses on his shoulders just as he is not always the person most responsible for the wins ( example: Aaron Glenn scoring two touchdowns in Pittsburg). Assigning the wins & losses to the QB because his is the most visible position on the field is intellectualy lazy hence this rant..
David is 18-46 while he was leading the league in sacks three out of his four years in the league - all his fault, had nothing to do with a dishwater-weak line in front of him, zero playmakers sans Andre Johnson, and Fred Flinstone calling the plays.
Gee then I guess Ben Roethlisberger is 27-4. Its all Big Ben to be sure. The fact that he leads the league in fewest pass attempts by a starting quarterback would just be an "excuse" made by Steeler-haters. Add playmakers like Hines Ward, Plaxico Burress, Antwaan Randle El, & Heath Miller...oh and that ground game wasn't too bad either, to the "excuse list". Bill Cower - the best coach of his generation (who has done more with less year in & year out?), well he just happened to be there; clearly it was all Ben. Casey Hampton on defense along with Joey Porter, and that Polamalu guy - you may have heard of him - wait stop making "excuses"! It was Ben.

I mean, he is the quarterback after all...
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Old 06-29-2006   #2
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He's 18-46? Really? OK, I changed my mind. I'm anti-Carr now too.

That avatar is hilarious.
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Old 06-29-2006   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HJam72
He's 18-46? Really? OK, I changed my mind. I'm anti-Carr now too.

That avatar is hilarious.
He gets five quacks for the post and a harumph on the avatar.
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Old 06-29-2006   #4
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best post i've seen in a WHILE.
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Old 06-29-2006   #5
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actually Carr is 17-60. Make ya feel better?
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Old 06-29-2006   #6
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Originally Posted by thegr8fan
actually Carr is 17-60. Make ya feel better?
Why am I having a sense of deja vu?
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Old 06-29-2006   #7
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I think we need a David Carr sub forum...
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Old 06-29-2006   #8
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We should take all of the David Carr threads and combine them into one Now that would be one huge thread.

But yes, I agree with you, the team loses, not the QB.
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Old 06-29-2006   #9
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If we ever do release or trade Carr, this forum will require fewer servers.
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Old 06-29-2006   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HJam72
If we ever do release or trade Carr, this forum will require fewer servers.
Either that or more servers to accomodate all of the "I told you so's" and the people who join the board just to tell everyone "I told you so", we'd have all kinds coming out of the woodwork...
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Old 06-29-2006   #11
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i completely agree with this thread. all these dang carr bashers dont know didly. carr is one pro bowl away from being a pro bowl caliber player, you carr bashers need to realize that!
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Old 06-29-2006   #12
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Just for the heck of it:

Jake Plummer pre-Denver (6 seasons)
55.9 comp. % (0 years over 60%), 6.39 ypa, 90 TD's (3.26% of attempts), 114 INT's (4.13% of attempts), 68.3 QB rating (72.6 last two years at AZ).

David Carr pre-Kubiak
57.8 comp. % (2 years over 60%), 6.53 ypa, 48 TD's (2.95% of attempts), 53 INT's (3.25 % of attempts), 73.7 QB rating (80.5 last two years).

Jake Plummer post-Denver
60.1 comp. %, 7.53 ypa, 60 TD's (4.69% of attempts), 34 INT's (2.66 % of attempts), 88.1 QB rating.

David Carr post-Kubiak
???????????????????????
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Old 06-29-2006   #13
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You would need to administer shock therapy to Carr haters before they would even consider changing their minds. It's not about Carr, it's about something else. Just like those who may have a silent resentment against Mario for us surpassing Bush. Who knows. It is a waste of time to quarrel with them and we should focus on more meaningful things. Carr is our QB, and that will not change in the next year.
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Old 06-30-2006   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infantrycak
Just for the heck of it:

Jake Plummer pre-Denver (6 seasons)
55.9 comp. % (0 years over 60%), 6.39 ypa, 90 TD's (3.26% of attempts), 114 INT's (4.13% of attempts), 68.3 QB rating (72.6 last two years at AZ).

David Carr pre-Kubiak
57.8 comp. % (2 years over 60%), 6.53 ypa, 48 TD's (2.95% of attempts), 53 INT's (3.25 % of attempts), 73.7 QB rating (80.5 last two years).

Jake Plummer post-Denver
60.1 comp. %, 7.53 ypa, 60 TD's (4.69% of attempts), 34 INT's (2.66 % of attempts), 88.1 QB rating.

David Carr post-Kubiak
???????????????????????
Great. However, we paid #1 money for Plummer like numbers for the first four years. We better be getting a lot more production from Carr than Plummer got with Kubiak as we have surely compensated him more. Return on investment has been nil from Carr. Total cost of ownership is sky rocketing.

The love fest is great. The optimism is needed, but the only numbers that matter are what his percentage of the team's cap and how many wins does the team have. If this were a business in the corporate world we would have fired, demoted or reassigned him. Giving him a raise would have never been in the forecast since his contribution to the team's record based on his percentage of operating expense would be very high.
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Old 06-30-2006   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexansLucky13
You would need to administer shock therapy to Carr haters before they would even consider changing their minds. It's not about Carr, it's about something else. Just like those who may have a silent resentment against Mario for us surpassing Bush. Who knows. It is a waste of time to quarrel with them and we should focus on more meaningful things. Carr is our QB, and that will not change in the next year.
If Carr made Sage Rosenfels money, was not the first pick in the NFL draft or people make comparisions to other great QB's we would not be having a duscussion about him. However, he has been a cornerstone of our team and we have compensated him as such. I would have loved to have him back this year even at Plummer like numbers.

The team will get better and I do not expect Carr to really have any bearing on it as a top paid player should.
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Old 06-30-2006   #16
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Why do people make such a huge deal out of Carr's draft number?

if we had gotten him in the 7th round would you all be praising his performance?

You act like you cant pay your bills because David Carr took all your money. The way I see it, you look at his numbers, his performance, and his potential, and then you decide to support him based on that. Neither his draft number, or his paycheck, should have any bearing on his worth when he is on the field.
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Old 06-30-2006   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro
Great. However, we paid #1 money for Plummer like numbers for the first four years. We better be getting a lot more production from Carr than Plummer got with Kubiak as we have surely compensated him more. Return on investment has been nil from Carr. Total cost of ownership is sky rocketing.
The money paid in the 1st 4 years is irrelevant now--it is sunk, gone, in the past just like the money for Boselli, Walker, Wade, Smith and everyone else on the team to date--or the money paid by other teams in the past for example to Philip Rivers not to play for 2 years. No one is paying it back, re-earning it or earning it. The only pertinent salary question going forward is does a player earn his money on the field this year.

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The love fest is great. The optimism is needed, but the only numbers that matter are what his percentage of the team's cap and how many wins does the team have.
Interesting, so some naked stats with no prediction for Carr's performance in the future is a "love fest"? Seems to me you are looking for wabbits to hunt.

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If this were a business in the corporate world we would have fired, demoted or reassigned him. Giving him a raise would have never been in the forecast since his contribution to the team's record based on his percentage of operating expense would be very high.
I wouldn't be so fast there. The corporate world can be even better at overcompensating performance (no salary cap and all)--Home Depot CEO Nardelli has received $200 mil in the last 5 years as his shareholder returns are down and they are losing ground rapidly to Loews (whose CEO has received $10.5 mil over the same period--who has rising shareholder returns and market share).
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Old 06-30-2006   #18
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Quote:
The love fest is great. The optimism is needed, but the only numbers that matter are what his percentage of the team's cap and how many wins does the team have.
I don't think we can blame lack of wins on Carr.

Quote:
If this were a business in the corporate world we would have fired, demoted or reassigned him. Giving him a raise would have never been in the forecast since his contribution to the team's record based on his percentage of operating expense would be very high.
It was either give Carr the extension or let him walk and look for a QB in free agency or the draft.
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Old 06-30-2006   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grid
Why do people make such a huge deal out of Carr's draft number?

if we had gotten him in the 7th round would you all be praising his performance?

You act like you cant pay your bills because David Carr took all your money. The way I see it, you look at his numbers, his performance, and his potential, and then you decide to support him based on that. Neither his draft number, or his paycheck, should have any bearing on his worth when he is on the field.
Since I am fan of a team that is in a sport that has a finite salary cap it matters to me.
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Old 06-30-2006   #20
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Where you get drafted dictates how much money you get paid in the NFL.

Is it fair? Maybe not. Is it always like that? No. Is it a big factor? Absolutely.
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