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Old 04-28-2006   #21
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Originally Posted by kcwilson
Not for garnering national attention... Chicks dig the longball. Imagine the Texans power by having a native SoCal product on your team... with no LA team and SD moving to Vegas.

Reggie has way more star power than Williams... undisputed. And that is what will drive national attention.
What I'm imagining is having two runningbacks with FAT contracts on the same team. A team who was DEAD last in rush defense and middle of the pack in rush offense last season. A team who gave up THE MOST POINTS IN THE LEAGUE.

Media attention is nice and all, but I'll take Ws.
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Old 04-28-2006   #22
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Originally Posted by Porky
Ditto. Williams will not have the impact a Bush will have, and the fans will revolt. Mcnair will be persona non grata and worse than Bottom Line Bud. Picking a player because of signability has to be the stupidest thing I have ever heard. I truly hope this is a smokescreen.

I think that the Texans are being aggressive with this because of Joel Segal being a wild card. He has never had a first pick in the draft and he has had a high percentage of his first round players hold out. We cannot afford to spend a bunch of money on RB holding out--too many things that he needs to work on in the offense--there is too much stuff going on with new stuff--don't need a non-signed first pick too.

Segal gets his money from this contract. Not from all the marketing stuff going on because that goes to the marketing firm.
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Old 04-28-2006   #23
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Originally Posted by Hulk75
Okay buddy.........Bets?
I will put up $25 to the first four takers, though I am sketchy about MB bets because I frankly do not put much faith in being paid if I win. So if you accept, I sincerely hope you will be a big man and pay. And I only wager that $100 max because while I am a gambling man that takes educated risks, I do not wager what I cannot afford to lose, and I do not intend to wager more than is necessary to prove a point and have a little fun in the process.
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Old 04-28-2006   #24
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Originally Posted by WildBlackBear32
What I'm imagining is having two runningbacks with FAT contracts on the same team. A team who was DEAD last in rush defense and middle of the pack in rush offense last season. A team who gave up THE MOST POINTS IN THE LEAGUE.

Media attention is nice and all, but I'll take Ws.
Correct... there is no disputing that. I want W's as well because there is nothing like sitting home and watching your team win the a**-hander's award for the 16th straight week.

It is McNair's money and he will do with it as he pleases to grow that money. Having Reggie with national endorsements increases the Texans exposure. More team revenue, more national fervor and attendance for Texans, more free agents... better long term outlook. I have long said on different posts that this is not a 1 year turn around project. Next year's draft is about the defense.
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Old 04-28-2006   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerek
I will put up $25 to the first four takers, though I am sketchy about MB bets because I frankly do not put much faith in being paid if I win. So if you accept, I sincerely hope you will be a big man and pay. And I only wager that $100 max because while I am a gambling man that takes educated risks, I do not wager what I cannot afford to lose, and I do not intend to wager more than is necessary to prove a point and have a little fun in the process.
I am in... $25, provided that Houston keeps the #1 pick. If Houston doesn't keep the #1, all best off.
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Old 04-28-2006   #26
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Originally Posted by kcwilson
With all due respecet, it isn't about what you want. It is what McNair wants. A man doesn't get that rich and then say, "You know what? I am good now. I don't want too much money."

Bush is more marketable, and I feel McNair would like to believe that with his talent, he can get a stud offense and if we suck this year (which is a distinct possibility), take a stud DE next year after the Peek/Babin at RDE experiment turns into a debacle. This team has never had an explosive offense... and if we can fix that, then football is more exciting because at least we score.

CHICKS DIG THE LONGBALL.

I like MW too. If we get him I am 100% behind him. Tomorrow only really tells us as fans what development path mgmt is taking with the team - win now vs. win later.
You are correct that Bush is more marketable and will generate more revenue (at first).

That said, winning teams generate revenue. We've been over this argument before (not necessarily you and I, but I and others on this board) and I thought I had sufficiently proven that winning is a far more reliable and consistent generator of revenue. This argument didn't fly when it was a question of drafting Vince and it doesn't fly for questions of drafting Reggie either. As I said, show me the Reggie Bush-esque player on the New England Patriots. I wonder how Robert Kraft manages to sleep at night with all of that revenue his mini dynasty generates, knowing that he doesn't have an ESPN nightly highlight reel guy on that entire roster.

As well, Bob McNair hires coaches and scouting staffs and VPs and all sorts of people with neat titles and job duties to assemble his team. You are sorely mistaken if you believe Bob McNair is going to step in and tell them to draft Reggie because of his "marketability." If that were the case then you and I both know Vince would have been the obvious choice from Day 1. You can't go five minutes on the board or listening to the radio in this city without hearing some teary-eyed rant about Vince and why so and so will no longer support the Texans now that they aren't drafting him, or some last minute plea to McNair to draft the guy, as if Vince was on death row looking for a last minute stay. Drafting Vince Young would give the Texans an immediate strangehold on the entire state of Texas.

This isn't about marketability, this is about who gives us the best shot at winning. Winning produces consistent and eventually much more explosive revenue, cut and dried, end of story.
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Old 04-28-2006   #27
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Originally Posted by jerek
As I said, show me the Reggie Bush-esque player on the New England Patriots. I wonder how Robert Kraft manages to sleep at night with all of that revenue his mini dynasty generates, knowing that he doesn't have an ESPN nightly highlight reel guy on that entire roster.
ummm, Tom Brady?
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Old 04-28-2006   #28
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But jerek, Mario Williams is such a RAW talent and has only had ONE GOOD YEAR, he's going to require some work in the NFL.

Wow, that looks strangely familiar ....
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Old 04-28-2006   #29
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Maybe it is who helps most. If RB is going to be a hold out, it could stunt his growth in Kube's system. Which would be a waste.

Defensive pass rush has been a problem for the Texans since the inception of the team, save for James Posey! LOL. So this is a no-brainer.

BTW, he had 14.5 sacks in 2005, not 13. Besides, his skills were sharpened in the 3rd quarter of the season, and look what he did. Upside anyone??
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Old 04-28-2006   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Texans_Chick
I think that the Texans are being aggressive with this because of Joel Segal being a wild card. He has never had a first pick in the draft and he has had a high percentage of his first round players hold out. We cannot afford to spend a bunch of money on RB holding out--too many things that he needs to work on in the offense--there is too much stuff going on with new stuff--don't need a non-signed first pick too.

Segal gets his money from this contract. Not from all the marketing stuff going on because that goes to the marketing firm.
Aren't you jumping the gun here? You are making a big leap of logic. So, now if a prospect doesn't sign by draft day he is a holdout? They have 3 months to sign him after the draft. You don't let that rule your decision on draft day, and if they do take Williams that WILL be the deciding factor which is pathetic.
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Old 04-28-2006   #31
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Originally Posted by stevo3883
ummm, Tom Brady?
Tom Brady was drafted in the sixth round. He isn't fast, he doesn't have a big arm, doesn't do much of anything but make good decisions in the pocket, and he was absolutely unknown until he became the cool-under-fire, topdog QB on a very well-rounded and well coached franchise.

If you want to liken him to Reggie Bush, feel free, but I don't. Any way, this has gotten off point. I'm not here to argue against Reggie Bush. I'm here to argue for Mario Williams.
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Old 04-28-2006   #32
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Originally Posted by MikeMc
Maybe it is who helps most. If RB is going to be a hold out, it could stunt his growth in Kube's system. Which would be a waste.

Defensive pass rush has been a problem for the Texans since the inception of the team, save for James Posey! LOL. So this is a no-brainer.

BTW, he had 14.5 sacks in 2005, not 13. Besides, his skills were sharpened in the 3rd quarter of the season, and look what he did. Upside anyone??
Sounds like upside to me. I am glad to see you and others embracing Mario already. This is going better than I had expected it to.
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Old 04-28-2006   #33
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Here Here!!

He averaged almost 20 TFL per season!!!! Considering he avg's about 60 tckls per season.......he was in the backfield a lot!

Strong, big and fast! What's not to love??? Long arms, can jump, is dominating. Need I say more? Started as a Freshman!

Oh, I have been on the "Draft Mario" circuit for some time now. He is a beast, and he is the DE that the team needs to help the defense....which will help the offense.
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Last edited by MikeMc; 04-28-2006 at 04:19 PM.
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Old 04-28-2006   #34
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Originally Posted by Porky
Aren't you jumping the gun here? You are making a big leap of logic. So, now if a prospect doesn't sign by draft day he is a holdout? They have 3 months to sign him after the draft.

Triple true - but McNair doesn't like to play that 3 month game. He has a horse race next weekend and certainly can't be worrying his pretty little head about football players not signing contracts. Can't blame him - if Bush wants to be drafted as #1 - he will sign.

You don't let that rule your decision on draft day, and if they do take Williams that WILL be the deciding factor which is pathetic.
Also true - but between these two players, I don't think you can go wrong - so you might as well get the one who is willing to sign, get the show on the road, and make it to camp on time. Whichever one - Williams or Bush - the Texans will be a better team because they are here - maybe not as flashy with Williams - but still better. No matter which one we sign - there will be the woulda shoulda coulda folks who follow those we didn't pick ad nauseum.

My sincere hope is that the Texans are never in this position again.
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Old 04-28-2006   #35
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Originally Posted by jerek
Tom Brady was drafted in the sixth round. He isn't fast, he doesn't have a big arm, doesn't do much of anything but make good decisions in the pocket, and he was absolutely unknown until he became the cool-under-fire, topdog QB on a very well-rounded and well coached franchise.

If you want to liken him to Reggie Bush, feel free, but I don't. Any way, this has gotten off point. I'm not here to argue against Reggie Bush. I'm here to argue for Mario Williams.

seemed like you asked who the patriots superstar money maker media darling was, and it's obviously tom brady. I don't know about all of that other stuff...
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Old 04-28-2006   #36
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Originally Posted by jerek
You are correct that Bush is more marketable and will generate more revenue (at first).

That said, winning teams generate revenue. We've been over this argument before (not necessarily you and I, but I and others on this board) and I thought I had sufficiently proven that winning is a far more reliable and consistent generator of revenue. This argument didn't fly when it was a question of drafting Vince and it doesn't fly for questions of drafting Reggie either. As I said, show me the Reggie Bush-esque player on the New England Patriots. I wonder how Robert Kraft manages to sleep at night with all of that revenue his mini dynasty generates, knowing that he doesn't have an ESPN nightly highlight reel guy on that entire roster.

As well, Bob McNair hires coaches and scouting staffs and VPs and all sorts of people with neat titles and job duties to assemble his team. You are sorely mistaken if you believe Bob McNair is going to step in and tell them to draft Reggie because of his "marketability." If that were the case then you and I both know Vince would have been the obvious choice from Day 1. You can't go five minutes on the board or listening to the radio in this city without hearing some teary-eyed rant about Vince and why so and so will no longer support the Texans now that they aren't drafting him, or some last minute plea to McNair to draft the guy, as if Vince was on death row looking for a last minute stay. Drafting Vince Young would give the Texans an immediate strangehold on the entire state of Texas.

This isn't about marketability, this is about who gives us the best shot at winning. Winning produces consistent and eventually much more explosive revenue, cut and dried, end of story.
I am not taking the VY bait, but the fact that Reggie has an adidas deal already signed is proof enough as to who America would be interested in tuning in to see.

Don't you want to be "America's team"?
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Old 04-28-2006   #37
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Originally Posted by MikeMc
Here Here!!

He averaged almost 20 TFL per season!!!! Considering he avg's about 60 tckls per season.......he was in the backfield a lot!

Strong, big and fast! What's not to love??? Long arms, can jump, is dominating. Need I say more? Started as a Freshman!
inconsistant, questionable motor, and workout warrior.

can you say CAUTION FLAGS???
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Old 04-28-2006   #38
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Originally Posted by stevo3883
inconsistant, questionable motor, and workout warrior.

can you say CAUTION FLAGS???
I wouldn't say that inconsistent and questionable motor are the red flags...

He was rumored to be asked to play within a scheme that limited his play (or something to that effect).

The red flag on him is the unknown of what he can/can't do because of that. Is it an inconsistent motor or a product of the system. It is up to coaching to decide.

Knowing that, I think that makes him more of a risk, which is not what you want at #1, with #1 money at risk. Some believe there is more upside, some believe that the upside is minimal. Either way, it is a trememdous risk for a #1 selection in my opinion.

I think he has tremendous upside.
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Old 04-28-2006   #39
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Originally Posted by kcwilson
I am not taking the VY bait, but the fact that Reggie has an adidas deal already signed is proof enough as to who America would be interested in tuning in to see.

Don't you want to be "America's team"?
I understand your point, and as I have stated many times, IMO, Reggie Bush is one hell of a pickup for us. I am simply stating that I believe we are draftng Mario Williams. Casserly practically stamped it on his forehead these last three days. In the end, winning generates revenue.

America's team would be awesome, but look around the NFL. Who is currently "America's team?" The closest thing we've got, IMO, are the Steelers and the Patriots. Both are headlined by unflashy, fairly simplistic but extremely efficient quarterbacks. Neither have any Reggie-Bush-esque player on their roster. Both feature fantastic, dominating defenses. Neither show up on the ESPN highlight reels all too often. Both are brutally efficient in their execution of the game.

I myself am a fan of winning, first and foremost. Understand me: other than being $100 poorer for it, I have absolutely zero issue with us drafting Reggie. He will be a great NFL player, and I think he will make us that much better for having him. But, IMO, the "draft for popularity" is a weak argument. If it is a dead coin flip between MW and RB, then give the tie-breaker to popularity, sure. But if our coaches feel MW is going to make us better than RB will, then we simply have to draft MW. IMO.
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Old 04-28-2006   #40
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It is fine and all to make your prediction Jerek but to act like most people on these boards don't know much about Mario Williams is ridiculous.
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