Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQDonate Automatic Monthly Contribution Members List Mark Forums Read


Texans Talk Football talk only please. Keep it to the game, the players, the coaches and management.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-21-2006   #1
jmerog
Veteran
 
jmerog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 264
Rep Power: 9 jmerog is a fan favorite
Default Davis, Bush, or Both..can we keep both?

Davis, Bush, or both..? Realistically..considering that we just sighned Dom to a hefty contract last year and Reggie wanting #1 $$$, is there any way we could carry both over more than a single season. I just Love the idea of having both in the backfield combined with all of our other weapons and the nightmares it would cause d-coord's... but is that do-able ? If not then does it make more sense to trade down and get picks and keep Davis or get bush and build dom's stock to trade him next year?

For the purposes of this thread VINCE YOUNG DOES NOT EXIST

its not a slam to young or an endorsement of bush, its just not the scenario under inquiry in this thread.
__________________
Texans honor the cow- we eat steak, wear leather, and pile our Tex-mex with cheese.
jmerog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #2
Bobo
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Age: 61
Posts: 1,375
Rep Power: 0 Bobo does not work well with others
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmerog
Davis, Bush, or both..? Realistically..considering that we just sighned Dom to a hefty contract last year and Reggie wanting #1 $$$, is there any way we could carry both over more than a single season. I just Love the idea of having both in the backfield combined with all of our other weapons and the nightmares it would cause d-coord's... but is that do-able ? If not then does it make more sense to trade down and get picks and keep Davis or get bush and build dom's stock to trade him next year?

For the purposes of this thread VINCE YOUNG DOES NOT EXIST

its not a slam to young or an endorsement of bush, its just not the scenario under inquiry in this thread.
With the status of the offensive line, the opposing defensive coordinators will be smacking their lips. Before Carr even gets the ball, they'll be all over him. And then the chorus will be "Get rid of Carr!" as though he was the problem.
Bobo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #3
outofhnd
All Pro
 
outofhnd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Dallas, TX
Age: 37
Posts: 723
Rep Power: 10 outofhnd is ridin' the pine
Default

We keep both, Look at the broncos they use running backs in a rotation there really wasnt a majority ball carrier for them. also, the knock on DD has always been he isnt a homerun threat. With Bush you are getting a homerun threat everytime he touches the ball. DD would be our change of pace to pick up 10 yard chunks and wear down the defense with his consistent attack.
__________________
Where have all the Running backs gone?
outofhnd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #4
jmerog
Veteran
 
jmerog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 264
Rep Power: 9 jmerog is a fan favorite
Default

Perhaps you have failed to notice that we have already improved the line with a probowl center, a playoff caliber tight end, new coaching by proven winners(kubes, sherman), a new system proven to be effective, and we still have the draft to go which will likely get us at least one more starting caliber o-lineman.with Flannigan at center, its like we improved two spots at once since Mckinny can now move to guard where he accually excells.
__________________
Texans honor the cow- we eat steak, wear leather, and pile our Tex-mex with cheese.
jmerog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #5
CoachJim
Veteran
 
CoachJim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pasadena, Texas
Age: 49
Posts: 324
Rep Power: 11 CoachJim is ridin' the pine
Send a message via AIM to CoachJim Send a message via Yahoo to CoachJim
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobo
With the status of the offensive line, the opposing defensive coordinators will be smacking their lips. Before Carr even gets the ball, they'll be all over him. And then the chorus will be "Get rid of Carr!" as though he was the problem.
And this has what to do with DD & RB both being on this team past this upcoming season?
__________________
It's official ... I am now employed by K.S. "Bud" Adams.
CoachJim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #6
jmerog
Veteran
 
jmerog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 264
Rep Power: 9 jmerog is a fan favorite
Default

my last post was in response to bobo. i forgot to quote.
__________________
Texans honor the cow- we eat steak, wear leather, and pile our Tex-mex with cheese.
jmerog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #7
jmerog
Veteran
 
jmerog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 264
Rep Power: 9 jmerog is a fan favorite
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by outofhnd
We keep both, Look at the broncos they use running backs in a rotation there really wasnt a majority ball carrier for them. also, the knock on DD has always been he isnt a homerun threat. With Bush you are getting a homerun threat everytime he touches the ball. DD would be our change of pace to pick up 10 yard chunks and wear down the defense with his consistent attack.

i see it the same way, i would love to keep both. it would be a beautiful thing. i'm wondering if we can afford it money wise? what did denver pay Bell and anderson? do you know? i'll hafta find out now i suppose.
__________________
Texans honor the cow- we eat steak, wear leather, and pile our Tex-mex with cheese.
jmerog is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
Old 04-21-2006   #8
Bobo
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Age: 61
Posts: 1,375
Rep Power: 0 Bobo does not work well with others
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmerog
Perhaps you have failed to notice that we have already improved the line with a probowl center, a playoff caliber tight end, new coaching by proven winners(kubes, sherman), a new system proven to be effective, and we still have the draft to go which will likely get us at least one more starting caliber o-lineman.with Flannigan at center, its like we improved two spots at once since Mckinny can now move to guard where he accually excells.
HUH? Flanagan has a history of injuries and Putzier is NOT a blocking TE! Kubiak has never been an NFL head coach before and Sherman was fired from GB. The Texans need a heckuva lot of help in the OL and defense in general. And folks on this board have already said that you can't expect McKinney to improve a lot just by teaching him a different dance.
Bobo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #9
Bobo
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Age: 61
Posts: 1,375
Rep Power: 0 Bobo does not work well with others
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by outofhnd
We keep both, Look at the broncos they use running backs in a rotation there really wasnt a majority ball carrier for them. also, the knock on DD has always been he isnt a homerun threat. With Bush you are getting a homerun threat everytime he touches the ball. DD would be our change of pace to pick up 10 yard chunks and wear down the defense with his consistent attack.
Yeah, that's right. Draft a RB #1 and make him a part-time player by putting him in a rotation and pull a RBBC. Meanwhile, make the real problems of this team lower on the priority list so you can pay a bunch of money to somebody who will be a part-time player. Sounds real good to me.
Bobo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #10
outofhnd
All Pro
 
outofhnd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Dallas, TX
Age: 37
Posts: 723
Rep Power: 10 outofhnd is ridin' the pine
Default

Hey Bobo I disagree maybe with an actual offensive line blocking scheme and set positions for our line man we improve greatly. You cant fix a sinking ship by constantly plugging the whole with bubblegum, That was what happened for our line when boselli retired not ever playing a down for us he pretty much caused a ripple effect that lasted 5 years.

We plugged that hole with bubble gum (chester Pitts in 02 &03, Seth wand in 04, Victor Riley, Wand, Pitts 05) Then Instead of picking up a true center we thought we could change a guard into one (another buble gum fix) Along the way we thought we could solidify the right side with todd wade then when that leak sprouted we tried Wiegart, Riley and wade. Bubble gum fix 3 Also along the way we picked up a Huge blocking TE in Bruener because our franchise TE joppru has yet to pan out another bubble gum fix because he lost his ability to get open and catch.. which limited carrs options) Then there was the switch from man to zone blocking schemes (yet another bubblegum fix that did not fair, then we fire the OC and make Pendry the OC another bubble gum fix...

Kubiak and Co have taken the sunking ship out of the water drawn up plans and started getting the tools needed to fix the leaks.

Tool #1 Bring the Denver Offense gives the QB some leway and mobility to notbe in the pocket so there can be some ad libs on a busted play.

Tool #2 Bringing in a True veteran center that understands the offense and the calls on the line.

Tool #3 Bringing in a rec tight end to complement Brueners blocking ability another option for carr to get the ball too if he is in trouble

Tool #4 Bringing in another top tier WR to lineup with AJ to prohibit defenses from taking AJ out of the offense.

After the draft we will see what other tools we have to help us.
__________________
Where have all the Running backs gone?
outofhnd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #11
jmerog
Veteran
 
jmerog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 264
Rep Power: 9 jmerog is a fan favorite
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobo
HUH? Flanagan has a history of injuries and Putzier is NOT a blocking TE! Kubiak has never been an NFL head coach before and Sherman was fired from GB. The Texans need a heckuva lot of help in the OL and defense in general. And folks on this board have already said that you can't expect McKinney to improve a lot just by teaching him a different dance.
Your response shows that you are not capable of understanding a real rebuttal. if someone else has a similer response (which i doubt), perhaps i will take the time to hold your hand and walk you through it.

on second thought, Outofhnd already walked you through part of it ( and a simple bit too) and you didn't understand so i will not bother explaining any further (to you that is). If another wants to challange then i will be happy to discuss it. I'm sure you will respond will your ussual ranting garbage but i have put you on ignore and will not have to see it.
__________________
Texans honor the cow- we eat steak, wear leather, and pile our Tex-mex with cheese.
jmerog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #12
jdog
All Pro
 
jdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 838
Rep Power: 16 jdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden cover
Default

I know that you are asking if we can afford both in a different sense, but I do not think the Texans can afford both backs without affecting other areas of the team. There are several areas of need, and the running back position would be very low on my list.

If we can afford to have both, we really can not afford to have so much money in one position. If the two running backs had different, complementary styles we still could not afford it, but these two are similar backs even if Bush is better.

On the other hand, can we afford to miss out on a unique talent like Bush? If you had the opportunity to draft Barry Sanders would you trade down for an offensive lineman? What if Reggie Bush is injured? What if he goes Ricky Williams on us?

Although you are discussing a different type of cost, I think the cost of drafting Reggie Bush is too high in terms of opportunity cost. Good teams are not made by ignoring team needs in order to draft great players, otherwise, the Detroit Lions and Arizona Cardinals would rock.
jdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #13
jmerog
Veteran
 
jmerog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 264
Rep Power: 9 jmerog is a fan favorite
Default

great post. definatly food for thought. I started out solidly in the trade down camp but after watching alot of film of Reggie, I am now truely conflicted. He is amazing. I agree with you that we have alot of needs to address and trading down would do more to help fill needs but still- theres the 'what if this guy is the next phenom' factor too.

What if we used the first on reggie,#33 on Mcneil, and the rest on defense?

i know- it would be nice to get more linemen but... 2 1000yd rushers in the backfield who can also catch is attractive. too bad we couldn't do some extreme swapping and still end up with reggie and extra picks besides.

what the heck-while i'm wishing-maybe indy and tenn. will give us all thier picks for pbuc and wong. lol
__________________
Texans honor the cow- we eat steak, wear leather, and pile our Tex-mex with cheese.
jmerog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #14
tex
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2004
Age: 55
Posts: 183
Rep Power: 11 tex is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdog
What if Reggie Bush is injured?
What if whoever the Texans draft gets injured? Isn't that a gamble ever team takes when drafting a player?
tex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #15
jdog
All Pro
 
jdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 838
Rep Power: 16 jdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden cover
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tex
What if whoever the Texans draft gets injured? Isn't that a gamble ever team takes when drafting a player?
Yes. However, if we trade down we receive more than one pick in return, and each of these picks is less expensive.
jdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #16
jdog
All Pro
 
jdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 838
Rep Power: 16 jdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden coverjdog could be on the next Madden cover
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmerog
great post. definatly food for thought. I started out solidly in the trade down camp but after watching alot of film of Reggie, I am now truely conflicted. He is amazing. I agree with you that we have alot of needs to address and trading down would do more to help fill needs but still- theres the 'what if this guy is the next phenom' factor too.

What if we used the first on reggie,#33 on Mcneil, and the rest on defense?

i know- it would be nice to get more linemen but... 2 1000yd rushers in the backfield who can also catch is attractive. too bad we couldn't do some extreme swapping and still end up with reggie and extra picks besides.

what the heck-while i'm wishing-maybe indy and tenn. will give us all thier picks for pbuc and wong. lol
I'm conflicted too. It's a good thing they are making this decision. :brickwall
jdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #17
Caesar
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 107
Rep Power: 0 Caesar is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Perhaps you have failed to notice that we have already improved the line with a probowl center
Unfortunately, there are five positions on the offensive line, and we've upgraded only one of them.
Caesar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #18
jmerog
Veteran
 
jmerog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 264
Rep Power: 9 jmerog is a fan favorite
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caesar
Unfortunately, there are five positions on the offensive line, and we've upgraded only one of them.
Not exactly, by putting Flannegan at center it allows mckinney to move to guerd which is his natural position and one he is accually good at. It's really a two for one kind of deal. Also, we'll likely pick up at least one more in the draft. thats 3 positions. all of that together with the denver blocking scheme will greatly improve the line because they wont be able to 'send the house'.

Now with a legit #2, a pass catching tight end, DD,AJ and possably Bush- the defense will pay if they try to rush all of the time.

All we need now is a defense of our own.lets hope
__________________
Texans honor the cow- we eat steak, wear leather, and pile our Tex-mex with cheese.
jmerog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #19
Seņor Stan
El Guapo
 
Seņor Stan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Age: 44
Posts: 4,083
Rep Power: 44650 Seņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respectedSeņor Stan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caesar
Unfortunately, there are five positions on the offensive line, and we've upgraded only one of them.
Mckinney to guard is an upgrade.

Also that draft thing is coming up in a week or so. And then June cuts.

We're not even half way through the off season yet.
Seņor Stan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2006   #20
jmerog
Veteran
 
jmerog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 40
Posts: 264
Rep Power: 9 jmerog is a fan favorite
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seņor Stan
Mckinney to guard is an upgrade.

Also that draft thing is coming up in a week or so. And then June cuts.

We're not even half way through the off season yet.
we must have been writing at the same time
__________________
Texans honor the cow- we eat steak, wear leather, and pile our Tex-mex with cheese.
jmerog is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:10 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ad Management by RedTyger