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Old 02-13-2006   #1
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Default What if???

I just have to ask this question, because it has been bothering me everytime I read the spreads regarding the Bush/Young debate. I realize that fans are going to be divided....Pick young "Houston Native, Longhorn, etc.... and the list goes one. I realize that it would be a heart-warming story to keep the hometown native here, win take us to the super bowl, and carry him out on a white horse as he is glorified by the Texan fans. Or, trade the pick and get every known availbable player to make us better in the near future. BUT, what happens if the Texans draft Reggie Bush. I'm almost scared and worried for this kid, that he will be shown the same type of class and disresprect Donavan McNabb was when he was drafted, on April 29th. Did anyone remember that? Donavan, Pro Bowl QB, Super Bowl Participant. Does anyone remember how the Eagle fans yelled the unthinkables at a kid, who just wanted to play, and represent the team that felt enough about him to make him the number #2 overall pick. OR, they could have gone with Ricky Williams. Let him breakdown in the locker room, lose it, go smoke dope in a few years and eventually leave the team. The bottom line, the Eagles organization did what would make their team immediately better, neglecting what the fans thought, and realized as long as they win the fans will still come. Last I saw, fans are cheering his name, and T.O or Ricky doesn't even enter their minds. I'm glad Donavan was strong enough to take the local abuse of Philadelphia fans after the draft and still succeed. I just hope Bush will be able to do the same, if he is indeed drafted by Houston. Bottom line, I personally just want to get better right away. If Kubiak feels Bush is the guy, do it. Young, do it. Carr, do it. Obviously, after many years in the NFL, Super Bowl rings as a coordinator, and a great offensive mind with many mentors that are excellent leaders, he knows more than the passionate Houston fan. I wish both Bush and Young the best in their careers. I pray that both live up to the hype, but more than that, represent their repsective teams as class acts on and off the field. If neither can't do that..........give many some other player to begin with!
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Old 02-13-2006   #2
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if he does get booed, he will probably be crying all the way to the bank.
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Old 02-13-2006   #3
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True, but I just hope the Texan nation gets behind the guy, and gives him the same similar support they would Young!......Who would just be cheered to the bank!!!
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Old 02-13-2006   #4
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Actually, I think it's a pretty good post. Regardless of who is picked there are going to be second guessers and those that say I told you so. If they don't pick Young, Carr better have a career year. Also I think we should know well in advance who they are going to pick or there may be riot on draft day. Known disappointment can be tempered easier than surprised disappointment.
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Old 02-14-2006   #5
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Originally Posted by Tayton
Actually, I think it's a pretty good post. Regardless of who is picked there are going to be second guessers and those that say I told you so. If they don't pick Young, Carr better have a career year. Also I think we should know well in advance who they are going to pick or there may be riot on draft day. Known disappointment can be tempered easier than surprised disappointment.
I think the pick is well known already based on the praise and moves by the front office towards Carr. I really don't think it's a debate on the #1 pick. You can take either Young or Bush. I feel that the people that want Bush feel that Carr can be "salvaged" and become the QB we all thought he would be. And the people that want Young (which I do) feel that Carr is not the answer and has digressed to a point of no return. Will new coaching help Carr? For the franchise and Carr's sake, I hope so. I believe the pick will be Bush. I would like to think it will be Young but I don't see it.
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Old 02-14-2006   #6
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Default Carr.....

I don't know if it is a situation of Carr not being able to do the job. If we look at it realistically, Carr could be a capable QB of running this offense, but quite frankly, when has he had the chance. I'm not going to make excuses for the bad decisions he makes, checking down to early to Dominic and bad reads at times, but all QB's do that. Peyton Manning looked horrible against Pittsburgh in the playoffs. Carr has been in a bad situation since he got here. The left tackle we picked up (Boselli), never played. He's been running with Rottweiller's (opposing team DE's) on his back from day one! Although we added WR help in year 2, we never added GOOD Wr depth in any other year. Bradford went to FA and no one offeredd a contract! We gladly took him back and he was our number 2 wideout? Ask the Andre Johnson & Carr what it is like to be triple teamed, and other receivers not running great routes, being able to get open, and horrible play calling to free them up. Better yet, ask Steve Smith what happened to him in Seattle during the playoffs, when his QB had no other options under the same circumstances. There are many pieces that can make Carr go, but I feel regardless if he was a corvette or a chevette at this time, houston fans would still be screaming for Vince Young. I firmly believe, spend some money in FA on veteran linemen (less time to learn the system), Hutchinson from Seattle, pick up a DE or safety in FA, Pick Bush and use him in multiple sets, and add depth through the draft. Even if you trade down and add Ferguson from VA, we're still waiting for him to develop. Playeing against College DE's he was great, but the ACC ain't the NFL. His learning curve will be a year or two. Point blank, let's just get better immediately!
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Old 02-14-2006   #7
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I think that the Texans would be smart to make their pick known as soon as possible, if they're going to stay in that position, just so that fans have time to get used to the idea. You don't want a rookie coming to town and getting ridden out on a rail because he's not their guy. The more time the fans have to get used to the idea that Vince Young isn't going to be a Texan (or Reggie Bush isn't going to be a Texan) the less murderous they'll likely be when the guy comes to town.

That said, as the draft comes closer and closer, if we haven't made a deal with someone, I'll become more and more convinced that we're trading down.

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Old 02-14-2006   #8
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First, Fans will deal, there is no reason to show their hand at any point other than on draft day. Hopefully we do trade down, but not for Ferguson, but we lock up the one area that we must get a big time help and that is D. Mario Williams best defensive player prospect in the draft.
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Old 02-14-2006   #9
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Originally Posted by Coach C.
First, Fans will deal, there is no reason to show their hand at any point other than on draft day. Hopefully we do trade down, but not for Ferguson, but we lock up the one area that we must get a big time help and that is D. Mario Williams best defensive player prospect in the draft.
Agreed, more important that giving the fans ample time to cope with the decision before it is made (or to just whine about it more, one or the other) is far less important than keeping other teams guessing and keeping options open. If we keep other teams in the dark and pump up the value of the pick, teams will be willing to offer bigger trades to us to get the #1 pick if they are interested, whereas if they know we are taking a particular guy, then they'll just deal with the Saints rather than us. The Texans also probably don't know what they are going to do yet anyways, the combine starts next week then they will have pro days and workouts so that will make the picture a little clearer, but still until they have gathered all the information they can on all the draft possibilities and free agency has a chance to work it's toll, the team can't make it's most-informed decision on what to do.
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Old 02-14-2006   #10
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well all i know is that David Carr is going to have it harder from the fans if he tought the booooooo's he got before were bad just wait until next year when he starts playing like he knows how to play. cant wait
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Old 02-14-2006   #11
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If/when Bush wears Texans colors, I have no doubt that Texan Nation will stand behind him and cheer his name.

Same for Young, or whoever else they might pick with no. 1. This team's short history has no reference to a winning season, and any upgrade will be greatly appreciated his immediate impact. I can't see Texans fans acting like Philly thugs at the draft. Although anything is possible, I would be surprised at any booing on our part.
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Old 02-14-2006   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double Barrel
If/when Bush wears Texans colors, I have no doubt that Texan Nation will stand behind him and cheer his name.

Same for Young, or whoever else they might pick with no. 1. This team's short history has no reference to a winning season, and any upgrade will be greatly appreciated his immediate impact. I can't see Texans fans acting like Philly thugs at the draft. Although anything is possible, I would be surprised at any booing on our part.
I wish I agreed, but I know that there are going to be a moderate but nonetheless vocal minority of fans at this year's draft party that boo when we don't get Young.
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Old 02-14-2006   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerek
I wish I agreed, but I know that there are going to be a moderate but nonetheless vocal minority of fans at this year's draft party that boo when we don't get Young.
When you see the people boo bush - hit 'em!!

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Old 02-14-2006   #14
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You also have to take into consideration the fact that our fans arent like Philly fans. They dont boo Santa Clause, and us Texans just have more class as a whole. And I tend to agree with the earlier poster, if your in the FO and you know without a shadow of a doubt that you want RB or Vy, you have to announce that ASAP. If your still unsure then you hint and poke around, but if you have ade your choice, then the negative impact will be lessened given time, and for the sake of your locker room you need to be upfront about it.
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Old 02-14-2006   #15
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The problem with announcing too early is that people will start negotiating with other teams below us. We need to stand strong for as long as we can in order to field as many offers as possible.

Look, I want BUSH bad! Lots of guys want VY bad! I'm fine either way, really. However, if New York trades us Abraham and/or Vilma, swap spots and throw in their #2 - well, I'd listen to that. Don't forget - Cleveland traded their SECOND ROUND PICK to move up one spot to get Kellen Winslow. The offers will come.

Do I want Bush? Yeah.
Do I want Vilma and/or Abraham, Brick, and their #2?


...yeah!
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Old 02-14-2006   #16
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Also I think we should know well in advance who they are going to pick or there may be riot on draft day. Known disappointment can be tempered easier than surprised disappointment.[/quote]
I have been saying this since Vince declared. Judging with all the phone calls on the radio and just overall posts on this board, if Vince is not holding a Texan uni, our lovely Reliant is going to have a riot on it's hands. I am supposed to go to the draft day party but I have been thinking hard about just staying home. I hope there is plenty of security.
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Old 02-14-2006   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Napa Auto Parts
well all i know is that David Carr is going to have it harder from the fans if he tought the booooooo's he got before were bad just wait until next year when he starts playing like he knows how to play. cant wait

Even if there were no Vince Young in this Draft.. & the Texans did draft bush, or trade down and made sensible picks.... it wouldn't be easy for fans to swallow any excuse for their 5th year QB...

He's got to win. The Texans have got to win regardless who they pick, or what they do in the draft.

I've been a Texans fan from before Day 1. I wanted Pro Football in Houston so much, that I didn't want the oilers to leave. As such, I supported and defended Carr 'til Vince entered the draft. Every game I watched, I wondered why David was picked #1 overall. 2004, I thought I was finally seeing what they saw.

I've already been confronted before, because I have said it wasn't David's fault. I've even been quoted saying that you could put anyone behind our line, and the results would be the same.

Truth is, I've never seen a QB that would make much difference than Carr, that we had access to, until now. If we weren't the #1 overall, I wouldn't be saying we need to trade up. I wouldn't be interested in a Drew Bledsoe or a Kurt Warner in FA. Just like it is hard to find a LT worth a darn in FA, I think it is the same with QB. You either draft a good one, or trade for an unknown, that might be good....... Bret Favre..... Steve Young. Teams don't let quality, proven QBs go.

I honestly feel like we'll be looking for a QB in the next two years. It'd be nice, if we had one ready to go already.

Edit:

I meant to add, I'll be 100% behind our team come training camp. No ifs ands or buts. I'll do my part as a fan to help us win.
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Old 02-14-2006   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Tejano
Also I think we should know well in advance who they are going to pick or there may be riot on draft day. Known disappointment can be tempered easier than surprised disappointment.
I have been saying this since Vince declared. Judging with all the phone calls on the radio and just overall posts on this board, if Vince is not holding a Texan uni, our lovely Reliant is going to have a riot on it's hands. I am supposed to go to the draft day party but I have been thinking hard about just staying home. I hope there is plenty of security.[/quote]


The number of people that will be upset if they don't pick Young is tremendously small compared to those that just want the team to get better. 95% of the phone calls are pro Vince because a)that's what Rich Lord wants them to do, and b)those are the people that are speaking up. The most passionate people are always more vocal. If there is a riot, I hope each UT fan that helps start it gets sent to jail and follows through with the threat to never watch the Texans again. If that's the kind of fan they are, the Texans don't need them.
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Old 02-14-2006   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexanBacker93
I have been saying this since Vince declared. Judging with all the phone calls on the radio and just overall posts on this board, if Vince is not holding a Texan uni, our lovely Reliant is going to have a riot on it's hands. I am supposed to go to the draft day party but I have been thinking hard about just staying home. I hope there is plenty of security.

I hope each UT fan that helps start it gets sent to jail and follows through with the threat to never watch the Texans again. If that's the kind of fan they are, the Texans don't need them.[/quote]


Yeah I was thinking about how many bandwagoner would be around here and all the posts that would say Start Vince and all that and started thinking about how much I would hate for this team to go to the corporate dogs.
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Old 02-14-2006   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Tejano
Yeah I was thinking about how many bandwagoner would be around here and all the posts that would say Start Vince and all that and started thinking about how much I would hate for this team to go to the corporate dogs.
The NFL could probably care less about the UT alums and their booster money, as has been suggested by UT fans. Those guys sit in the boxes and don't constitute real fans. The money is already in the pocket of the team and that won't change no matter who is QBing the team. The people that pay for their seats with their own money are the ones that will stop coming if a team isn't winning. It won't matter if VY is the QB or not. If the team doesn't win the stadium will be half full. Half empty if you are a pessimist. Houston fans are too bandwaggony. Heck, when the Astros were struggling at the beginning of last season the stadium wasn't full for Roger Clemens games. He's as much of a hometown hero than VY. Probably more since he's done it for longer and at the ultimate level. The NBA is the only game where you can expect a sellout because of a specific player and they are few and far between.
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