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Old 01-19-2006   #1
Spoda
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Default is the defense that bad?

or was it the coaching? do we really only have 1 salvageable starter on defense? was our pass defense so bad because of the players? or because we were playing 3-4 soft zone with no passrush?

who is a legit starter on defense? i can count only 4

D'rob
babin..i think he will improve in 4-3 or 3-4
TJ hopefully he'll start and go crazy after the QB...
and ....don't laugh.....phillip.....shh ..shh...i know...pburnt..pukeburnt....pukebuch...ya ya ya..but i think he was not put in a position to do well...i just find it funny that everyone of our guys in the seconday all of a sudden sucked..even d'rob....i'm blaming the coaches...but who else can you honestly say shouldn't be upgraded? i know i know..orr showed promise...earl and cc are young..but they don't strike me as the kind of players i see on pittsburgh or carolinas D...what do y'all think



oh ya..please trade the pick
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Old 01-19-2006   #2
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Define legit? I'd say--starting quality in the NFL, i.e. would likely be picked up and be a starter for another team if released (although not necessarily at their current salary)? With that as the standard--Walker, Payne & Smith would all be picked up to start somewhere, probably TJ as well. Greenwood and Wong would get picked up somewhere to start. Babin and Peek would both get picked up but probably only as situational players until they show more. Dunta no doubt. Faggins after 2004 would have been, after 2005 probably only as a nickle. Buchanon would catch on somewhere at least as a nickle. Brown & Earl, could be--seems some team is always looking at inexpensive safeties. The talent on the D needs help, but it isn't the absolute train wreck some make it out to be.
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Old 01-19-2006   #3
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Dunta Robinson is a future Pro-Bowler, not much question to that as long as we can get a competent D-Coordinator and better personnel around him, which we are working on I'm sure. Robaire Smith, Seth Payne, and Gary Walker are all worthy 3-4 DLinemen or 4-3 DTs and could start almost anywhere, although Walker and Payne are starting to get old. Travis Johnson is hopefully going to get there, but I'm not sure. Kailee Wong is a solid LB and would start on many teams as an OLB (he's not a true MLB/ILB). Morlon Greenwood would start on several teams, we didn't use him well and he's not a MLB/ILB but I still don't think he's as good as he's hyped to be. Babin and Peek have a shot at being good 4-3 DEs, maybe as a 3-4 OLBs, and Orr is a pretty solid OLB, but he wouldn't start on many teams at this point in time. Marcus Coleman was decent until this year and if he changes teams he may get his groove back and start again. Buchanon has the athletic abilities to be a solid starting CB if he'd be more physical and stick with his man more, hopefully our new coaches can bring that out of him but I don't know on him either.
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Old 01-19-2006   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infantrycak
Define legit? I'd say--starting quality in the NFL, i.e. would likely be picked up and be a starter for another team if released (although not necessarily at their current salary)? With that as the standard--Walker, Payne & Smith would all be picked up to start somewhere, probably TJ as well. Greenwood and Wong would get picked up somewhere to start. Babin and Peek would both get picked up but probably only as situational players until they show more. Dunta no doubt. Faggins after 2004 would have been, after 2005 probably only as a nickle. Buchanon would catch on somewhere at least as a nickle. Brown & Earl, could be--seems some team is always looking at inexpensive safeties. The talent on the D needs help, but it isn't the absolute train wreck some make it out to be.
I don't know. Other than DRob, our best players on defense are aging and often injured. When they go out, there is a huge drop off in play. Other than DRob, our secondary right now prolly needs to see Dr. Phil. PBuc was trashed in the paper by the owner as a mistake, and I don't know what the story is with Coleman. Any secondary woulda been having problems with the lack of pass rush early in the season against tough teams. The rest of the secondary is young.

I don't know about Wong. Has anyone heard about his rehab? He is not a big guy and relies a lot on energy and smarts. It is hard to come back with a serious knee injury.

Though it would be nice to think it is all scheme and coaching, I just think a lot of it is depth and experienced smart playmakers.

Things were looking a little better at the end of the season, but I attribute a ton of that to the schedule being a whole lot easier. Hopefully 2005, just gave our young guys more seasoning and maybe with a few key acquisitions, we can gain more quality depth.

I will feel better when I know who the coordinator is, and maybe whether it is someone who can help convince FAs to take a risk coming to a newish franchise.
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Old 01-19-2006   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spoda
and ....don't laugh.....phillip.....shh ..shh...i know...pburnt..pukeburnt....pukebuch...ya ya ya..but i think he was not put in a position to do well...i just find it funny that everyone of our guys in the seconday all of a sudden sucked..even d'rob....i'm blaming the coaches
I love this post. Buchanon will sucede under a coach that puts him in the position to do so.
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Old 01-19-2006   #6
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this was the coaches fault for such a bad defense. They tried to run a 3-4 D when they didn't have the type of players for any kind of D.
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Old 01-19-2006   #7
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If the D wasn't on the field all the time their numbers would improve dramatically.
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Old 01-20-2006   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tale Gator
If the D wasn't on the field all the time their numbers would improve dramatically.
There is something to that.

I felt horrible for them early in the season. Maybe the defense gets a stop and then the offense does a 3 and out, or a stupid fumble, and then the defense has to trudge back on the field.

This is why a lot of games got completely away from them. Time of possession really can help your D look a lot better.
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