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Old 01-12-2006   #1
MikeMc
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Default Kubiak is the Key to the Draft

If Kubiak is the new HC (which will happen as soon as DEN is eliminated from the playoffs), I think OL is the starting point. I could still see a trade down scenario to help gain more picks for 2006 and/or 2007. An OT like Trueblood or Colledge in the 2nd would not be bad.......both are your typical OTs for a Denver style run game. Here is what TSN says about them:

Jeremy Trueblood
T, Boston College

War Room analysis
Strengths: Is a giant with a huge wingspan. Is strong and quick. Is tough, and plays hard on every snap. Is efficient and sets up quickly in pass protection. Plays with good leverage when he gets low. Is an excellent run blocker who moves well and finishes blocks. Plays with a nasty streak. Is solid and durable.

Weaknesses: Is very tall, and can struggle with defenders who get under his pads. Lacks elite athleticism. Can struggle to stop bull rushers. Will struggle against quick NFL ends who get a step on. Must learn to use hands better in pass protection.

Bottom line: Trueblood is a solid player who gives his all on every down. He has the size and quickness to play in the NFL. He'll need time to develop behind a veteran. The '06 offensive tackle class is loaded, but Trueblood should be among the top selections.

Daryn Colledge
T, Boise State

War Room analysis
Strengths: Is explosive. Strong upper body, good footwork, balance and knee bend make him outstanding in pass protection. Good angles, speed and reach make him an above-average downfield blocker. Has all the intangibles: plays with a mean streak, plays hard to the whistle and has outstanding work ethic. Can be a leader on the line.

Weaknesses: Must add bulk to play against larger NFL defensive linemen. Needs bigger body to add strength, leverage and anchor, and to keep from getting overpowered.

Bottom line: Colledge has great experience despite playing outside a major conference. He could become the nation's best pass protector.
*******************************************

This is key if the D is switching to a 4-3. The DL basically has all DTs. Look at it this way, who plays DE?? Walker, Payne, RSmith, TJohnson, Deloach, Ioane, and Malone are all DT in a 4-3. The OLBs we have would get killed in a 4-3: Babin, Peek and Wong (and maybe Pettway) are too small to play DE in a 4-3.

So maybe the Texans trade down, but take Mario Williams (who many compare to Julius Peppers - the player most want in 2003 draft at #1). It looks like #6 and #7 spot would be the spots to take a DE (SF & Raiders), so a trade with SF would allow them to get the dream tandem of Smith & Bush (old HS teammates from SD area). This would allow the Texans to get MWIlliams or MKiwanuka. Either would be excellent choices at DE.

The rotation at DT would be incredible! Having Walker, Payne, Smith, TJ & Deloach being part of a 5-man rotation would be crazy! Plus a major Pass Rush specialist like the above mentioned rookies paired with Babin at the other DE spot!

LBs should be fine with the guys the Texans have (Greenwood, Wong, Evans, Peek) and draft at least two LBs this year.

I think the DBs can be upgraded next year. If you have a solid Front Four pressuring the QB, the LBs and DBs can take care of coverage.
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Old 01-12-2006   #2
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Old 01-12-2006   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeMc
If Kubiak is the new HC (which will happen as soon as DEN is eliminated from the playoffs), I think OL is the starting point. I could still see a trade down scenario to help gain more picks for 2006 and/or 2007. An OT like Trueblood or Colledge in the 2nd would not be bad.......both are your typical OTs for a Denver style run game. Here is what TSN says about them:

Jeremy Trueblood
T, Boston College

War Room analysis
Strengths: Is a giant with a huge wingspan. Is strong and quick. Is tough, and plays hard on every snap. Is efficient and sets up quickly in pass protection. Plays with good leverage when he gets low. Is an excellent run blocker who moves well and finishes blocks. Plays with a nasty streak. Is solid and durable.

Weaknesses: Is very tall, and can struggle with defenders who get under his pads. Lacks elite athleticism. Can struggle to stop bull rushers. Will struggle against quick NFL ends who get a step on. Must learn to use hands better in pass protection.

Bottom line: Trueblood is a solid player who gives his all on every down. He has the size and quickness to play in the NFL. He'll need time to develop behind a veteran. The '06 offensive tackle class is loaded, but Trueblood should be among the top selections.

Daryn Colledge
T, Boise State

War Room analysis
Strengths: Is explosive. Strong upper body, good footwork, balance and knee bend make him outstanding in pass protection. Good angles, speed and reach make him an above-average downfield blocker. Has all the intangibles: plays with a mean streak, plays hard to the whistle and has outstanding work ethic. Can be a leader on the line.

Weaknesses: Must add bulk to play against larger NFL defensive linemen. Needs bigger body to add strength, leverage and anchor, and to keep from getting overpowered.

Bottom line: Colledge has great experience despite playing outside a major conference. He could become the nation's best pass protector.
*******************************************

This is key if the D is switching to a 4-3. The DL basically has all DTs. Look at it this way, who plays DE?? Walker, Payne, RSmith, TJohnson, Deloach, Ioane, and Malone are all DT in a 4-3. The OLBs we have would get killed in a 4-3: Babin, Peek and Wong (and maybe Pettway) are too small to play DE in a 4-3.

So maybe the Texans trade down, but take Mario Williams (who many compare to Julius Peppers - the player most want in 2003 draft at #1). It looks like #6 and #7 spot would be the spots to take a DE (SF & Raiders), so a trade with SF would allow them to get the dream tandem of Smith & Bush (old HS teammates from SD area). This would allow the Texans to get MWIlliams or MKiwanuka. Either would be excellent choices at DE.

The rotation at DT would be incredible! Having Walker, Payne, Smith, TJ & Deloach being part of a 5-man rotation would be crazy! Plus a major Pass Rush specialist like the above mentioned rookies paired with Babin at the other DE spot!

LBs should be fine with the guys the Texans have (Greenwood, Wong, Evans, Peek) and draft at least two LBs this year.

I think the DBs can be upgraded next year. If you have a solid Front Four pressuring the QB, the LBs and DBs can take care of coverage.
I agree, but recently I started think we could trade down with NY to #4 and take Mario.

I like how you are not calling out Buchanon and actually seem to have faith, a refreshing and shared view.

I do not agree with your assesment of the LB corps though, as Greenwood and Peek could both walk. Greenwood is stuck because of his contract. Orr earned a starting spot going into ST. Wong is solid. Babin should be a DE in the 4-3. We have almost NO starter quality MLB on our roster. I love Ahmad Brooks potential, and would not mind drafting him if we traded down again. Nick Reid seems like a good MLB to groom who can step in immediatly on special teams.
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Old 01-12-2006   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeMc
This is key if the D is switching to a 4-3. The DL basically has all DTs. Look at it this way, who plays DE?? Walker, Payne, RSmith, TJohnson, Deloach, Ioane, and Malone are all DT in a 4-3. The OLBs we have would get killed in a 4-3: Babin, Peek and Wong (and maybe Pettway) are too small to play DE in a 4-3.
Babin could play the RDE no problem. I would rather see him there in a 3 point stance. And size would not be a problem for Babin, although he may have to bulk up just a little. He is listed as 6'2'' 259, compare that to Dwight Freeney at 6'1'' 268, Javon Kearse at 6'4'' 265, and Derrick Burgess at 6'2'' 260.
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Old 01-12-2006   #5
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Originally Posted by YoungTexanFan
I agree, but recently I started think we could trade down with NY to #4 and take Mario.

I like how you are not calling out Buchanon and actually seem to have faith, a refreshing and shared view.

I do not agree with your assesment of the LB corps though, as Greenwood and Peek could both walk. Greenwood is stuck because of his contract. Orr earned a starting spot going into ST. Wong is solid. Babin should be a DE in the 4-3. We have almost NO starter quality MLB on our roster. I love Ahmad Brooks potential, and would not mind drafting him if we traded down again. Nick Reid seems like a good MLB to groom who can step in immediatly on special teams.
One probem I see switching to a 4-3 is the ILB spot, both Wong and Greenwood have played the ILB spot in the 4-3 though they are both in high end contracts right now. I know they could battle it out for the starting spot, but what happens to the one who doesn't get the starting spot?
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Old 01-12-2006   #6
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Originally Posted by texan279
One probem I see switching to a 4-3 is the ILB spot, both Wong and Greenwood have played the ILB spot in the 4-3 though they are both in high end contracts right now. I know they could battle it out for the starting spot, but what happens to the one who doesn't get the starting spot?
Neither one is a true MLB, they are both OLB...especially greenwood. Ahmad Brooks is the answer folks.
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Old 01-12-2006   #7
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You see what Kubiak can do with mediocre RBs (aka Tatam Bell, Olandis Gary, Mike Anderson) imangine what he can do with president Bush. Despite Bush's "average" performance in the Rose Bowl I am jumping back on the bandwagon.
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Old 01-12-2006   #8
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Im sorry but the name Trueblood is so incredibly awesome that have to draft him just so I can buy that jersey
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Old 01-12-2006   #9
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Originally Posted by gtexan02
Im sorry but the name Trueblood is so incredibly awesome that have to draft him just so I can buy that jersey
Thats not an awsome name really.

Dwayne Slay has a cool name, and it fits.

there was a thread where we talked about this a long time ago.
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Old 01-12-2006   #10
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Not so fast my friend...Kubiak is from the Alex Gibbs school of Zone Blocking and running backs. This is a good thing considering Atlanta and Denver lead the league in rushing. What Gibbs looks for in his OL is quickness, lateral speed and good footwork, size is not important. Alex believes he can find what he wants in OL in the 4-7 rds and 3-4 rds for RBs. Denver's OL are under 300 lbs w/ the exception of Foster. All were taken in the 4th Rd or later w/ the exception of Foster...I think this is similar to what you will find with Kubiak as HC.
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Old 01-12-2006   #11
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Originally Posted by YoungTexanFan
Neither one is a true MLB, they are both OLB...especially greenwood. Ahmad Brooks is the answer folks.
Wong played 4 years at Minnesota and in the last 2 years there he started all 16 games, 32 total, and in that time had 211 total tackles, 5 sacks, and 3 INT's. In the last 2 years Greenwood played ILB at Miami, in 32 games, he had 183 tackles and .5 sack. I don't understand why you say they are not true MLB's.
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Old 01-12-2006   #12
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I thought that Zach Thomas played ILB for the dolphins and Greenwood was an OLB.
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Old 01-12-2006   #13
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yep if we get Kubiak ive got my eye on Daryn Colledge.. he looks like a great fit for the Denver blocking scheme. I also am watching Davin Joseph in the 3rd.

Here is his scouting report from TSN

Quote:
Davin Joseph
G, Oklahoma

War Room analysis

Strengths: Has a good frame. Is strong and powerful, with great mobility and very good lateral movement. Moves smoothly; plays particularly well in the open field. Is tough, plays with a mean streak and can consistently reach the second level. Can knock back defenders with initial hand punch. Rarely loses a battle once locked on. Plays under control and has excellent quickness.

Weaknesses: Lacks ideal height and size. Will struggle on the perimeter. Must improve footwork, hand placement and awareness against stunts and blitzes.

Bottom line: A former defensive lineman, Joseph moved to guard as freshman and will move to left tackle as a senior. He might be the 2006 draft's best guard prospect. Only a lack of height will prevent him being elite.
(he is 6'3" 312 btw)


I also think that Mark Setterstrom might make a good second day prospect(5th or 6th round) if he is available.

Quote:
Mark Setterstrom
G, Minnesota

War Room analysis

Strengths: Has average upper-body strength. Is a striker. Not fast but gets into pass protection well. Can pick up a blitz. Is durable and experienced. Is a very good athlete with excellent potential.

Weaknesses: Is undersized and might not have the frame to add bulk. Must improve his technique for both pass and rushing situations. Because of his size, he will have limited opportunities and have trouble anchoring against a strong bull rusher.

Bottom line: A durable player, Setterstrom has decent upper-body strength and could be an average pass protector. He doesn't have a strong base and will not be effective in a power running game. His inferior size will result in a limited playing role

and as long as im posting them.. I wouldnt mind Cedric Griffin in the 4th.

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Cedric Griffin
CB, Texas

War Room analysis

Strengths: Is big and athletic. Plays a physical, aggressive, attacking style. Likes to play bump-and-run coverage. Attacks the line of scrimmage. Is strong, and uses hands well. Shows good instincts, reads plays well and makes good decisions. Is quick, and shows a nice closing burst. Is a hard hitter and a solid tackler. Is willing in run support. Is a great special teams player. Is durable and dependable.

Weaknesses: Lacks elite speed, and will struggle against fast NFL receivers downfield. Will have trouble turning and running with receivers. Comes out of backpedal too high. Must improve ball skills and playmaking ability. Must become more consistent.

Bottom line: Griffin is solid and versatile; he played cornerback and safety at Texas and has the potential to play either position in the NFL. He has the size and athleticism to play cornerback but lacks the elite speed and must hone his ball skills. Griffin's talent and potential will make him a solid Day 2 pick.
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Old 01-12-2006   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F-minus67
I thought that Zach Thomas played ILB for the dolphins and Greenwood was an OLB.
You're right, for some reason I was thinking he played ILB. Brain fart I guess.
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Last edited by texan279; 01-13-2006 at 12:09 AM.
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Old 01-12-2006   #15
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Originally Posted by F-minus67
I thought that Zach Thomas played ILB for the dolphins and Greenwood was an OLB.

You would be correct.
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Old 01-13-2006   #16
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Originally Posted by Texian
Not so fast my friend...Kubiak is from the Alex Gibbs school of Zone Blocking and running backs. This is a good thing considering Atlanta and Denver lead the league in rushing. What Gibbs looks for in his OL is quickness, lateral speed and good footwork, size is not important. Alex believes he can find what he wants in OL in the 4-7 rds and 3-4 rds for RBs. Denver's OL are under 300 lbs w/ the exception of Foster. All were taken in the 4th Rd or later w/ the exception of Foster...I think this is similar to what you will find with Kubiak as HC.
Well, the thing is, Atlanta's pass blocking is terrible, and much of their edge in rushing comes from Vick. Just because they don't need top draft picks to build a functioning line doesn't mean a top pass blocking tackle won't solidify the line in terms of pass protection. If you could add an Orlando Pace lite lite (yes, two lites) to keep Carr on his feet, wouldn't you be tempted? Zone-blocking is great for the run game, but not quite as great for the passing game IMO.
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Old 01-13-2006   #17
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its not AS great.. but that doesnt mean it cant be good. I think.. and dont quote me on this.. but I think that zone run blocking is more about technique than power. I dont see how 280-300lb linemen could be such great run blockers if that wasnt the case.

For that reason.. I think prospects like Colledge and Joseph are good investments.

As for Kubiak building his line in the later rounds.. this is true.. but I think you will also find that alot of his linemen were groomed over a couple of seasons, and I dont think we can wait two more seasons to have an effective line. We may need to invest higher picks in our line in order to get it up to snuff more quickly.
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Old 01-13-2006   #18
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its not AS great.. but that doesnt mean it cant be good. I think.. and dont quote me on this.. but I think that zone run blocking is more about technique than power. I dont see how 280-300lb linemen could be such great run blockers if that wasnt the case.

For that reason.. I think prospects like Colledge and Joseph are good investments.

As for Kubiak building his line in the later rounds.. this is true.. but I think you will also find that alot of his linemen were groomed over a couple of seasons, and I dont think we can wait two more seasons to have an effective line. We may need to invest higher picks in our line in order to get it up to snuff more quickly.
You are right about the zone blocking. In zone blocking you basically take two or three linemen and have them block an "area" in unison instead of one on one matchups.
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Old 01-13-2006   #19
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Originally Posted by F-minus67
I thought that Zach Thomas played ILB for the dolphins and Greenwood was an OLB.
If I remember correctly, Greenwood lead the team in tackles or maybe 2nd in tackles one or two years... at OLB
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Old 01-13-2006   #20
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You are right about the zone blocking. In zone blocking you basically take two or three linemen and have them block an "area" in unison instead of one on one matchups.

Yes, but I'm pretty sure that zone blocking is used ONLY in the running game. Traditional drop back blocking is used for passing plays.
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