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Old 01-09-2006   #1
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Default All you bush wanters

Why would you want him? Or better stated, you have many options needed more. Your strongest position is RB. Double D, was the 9th best runner in football in YPG, and would have been considerably higher in yards if he didnt miss three games. So are you just going to pitch probowl caliber talent? I dont blame you for wanting bush, but what are you planning on doing with Davis? Now if you traded him for a late first rounder, and took a LT, or RG Gilles, then its more understandable. Just trying to understand where your coming from.
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Old 01-09-2006   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boylanca
Why would you want him? Or better stated, you have many options needed more. Your strongest position is RB. Double D, was the 9th best runner in football in YPG, and would have been considerably higher in yards if he didnt miss three games. So are you just going to pitch probowl caliber talent? I dont blame you for wanting bush, but what are you planning on doing with Davis? Now if you traded him for a late first rounder, and took a LT, or RG Gilles, then its more understandable. Just trying to understand where your coming from.
DD is not pro bowl caliber. He is slightly above average for an NFL back.
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Old 01-09-2006   #3
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Originally Posted by LBC_Justin
DD is not pro bowl caliber. He is slightly above average for an NFL back.
I agree, and an injury prone back at that. But he could stay and we cut Hollings.
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Old 01-09-2006   #4
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I can't speak for everyone else, but I like Reggie Bush's versatility. I like the fact that he can not only be lined up as a RB for some plays, but also a WR. He will give us another much needed playmaker and hopefully cause defenses to unglue themselves from Andre Johnson which will allow him to do his thing. I don't think that we should get rid of Domanick because I think that both him and Reggie will benefit from each other because it will lighten both loads.
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Old 01-09-2006   #5
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DAvis is pro bowl caliber. He was a top 8 pick in all of my fanatsy leagues this year, he definatly has the potential. Look at these stats. The final 8 weeks of the 04 05 season:


8 games 988 yards 11TD 465rec yards 4TD. Better than any back in the second half of last year.
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Old 01-09-2006   #6
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DD cannot pass block and is not a home run hitter. He is a fine back but not a star. If we draft Bush, it makes Morency expendable. Perhaps we could get a solid 3rd rounder or perhaps a conditional 2nd rounder for him.

I was an advocate of trading down, but I don't think the team will do it with Bush and Young on the board. The fans would revolt if we don't take one of those two. I have come to this realization and have adjusted my thinking.

Kubiak is good with QB's (see the reincarnation of Jake Plummer) and great with RB's (think of all of the great seasons various backs have had there). I think he can turn this offense around in a heartbeat.
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Old 01-09-2006   #7
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DD cannot pass block
sorry man but if you guys are taking reggie to pass block, you'll be in for a surprise
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Old 01-09-2006   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boylanca
sorry man but if you guys are taking reggie to pass block, you'll be in for a surprise

1st, you obviously arent a scout because Bush is a very good blocker.


2nd, the day Davis makes the pro bowl, ill shave my entire body bald and glue the hair to my face.

ypg isnt whta they use to measure a rb's skills, oyu know why? because durability is a very desired trait in a RB. seasonal yadage totals are all that matters, and DD falls painfully short in this, as well as TD's.



and just watch the guy, hes just not that good.
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Old 01-09-2006   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boylanca
DAvis is pro bowl caliber. He was a top 8 pick in all of my fanatsy leagues this year, he definatly has the potential. Look at these stats. The final 8 weeks of the 04 05 season:


8 games 988 yards 11TD 465rec yards 4TD. Better than any back in the second half of last year.
Note!: THIS IS NOT FANTASY FOOTBALL.

That is a good point for us. 8 games total. This is a 16+ game season. Not 8. Aparently he needs some help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boylanca
So are you just going to pitch probowl caliber talent? I dont blame you for wanting bush, but what are you planning on doing with Davis?
You know its weird...USC found a way to use LenDale White, but the Texans are just going to "pitch" Davis.

Recap. Davis is a good back. I like him. But adding Bush will not make us a worse team. We will have great depth at RB. We can use him in a variety of ways.
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Old 01-09-2006   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boylanca
Why would you want him? Or better stated, you have many options needed more. Your strongest position is RB. Double D, was the 9th best runner in football in YPG, and would have been considerably higher in yards if he didnt miss three games. So are you just going to pitch probowl caliber talent? I dont blame you for wanting bush, but what are you planning on doing with Davis? Now if you traded him for a late first rounder, and took a LT, or RG Gilles, then its more understandable. Just trying to understand where your coming from.
Davis missed 5 games this year, and has been injured both of his previous two seasons. How is RB not a need for this team if their best RB can't stay on the field? The real question should be why do you want them to draft VY? We already have a QB. To but the blame of this team sucking on Carr's shoulders is not fair. He should be given a chance with the new coaching regime, and with a new offensive line.

By drafting Young you're basically trading David Carr and Reggie Bush to get him. Would you do that? I wouldn't.
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Old 01-09-2006   #11
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I've flip-flopped more than anyone on this subject, but when Mario Williams and Leonard Pope declared I quickly got back on the fence. The defense needs a superstar / impact player, too, ya know.

Cass said last night on ABC that they will shop the pick and see what it's worth, but I expect to see Reggie Bush in a Texan's jersey come fall.
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Old 01-09-2006   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pskinny
Davis missed 5 games this year, and has been injured both of his previous two seasons. How is RB not a need for this team if their best RB can't stay on the field? The real question should be why do you want them to draft VY? We already have a QB. To but the blame of this team sucking on Carr's shoulders is not fair. He should be given a chance with the new coaching regime, and with a new offensive line.

By drafting Young you're basically trading David Carr and Reggie Bush to get him. Would you do that? I wouldn't.

I would trade Reggie and David Carr for a bag of kc masterpiece barbecue ruffles (i know, but you really CANT get them in florida...anybody wanna ship a bag to a friend?), much less a talent like vince young. He will throw more than carr and gain more on the ground than reggie. JMO
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Old 01-09-2006   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackDizzle
I've flip-flopped more than anyone on this subject, but when Mario Williams and Leonard Pope declared I quickly got back on the fence. The defense needs a superstar / impact player, too, ya know.
Cass said last night on ABC that they will shop the pick and see what it's worth, but I expect to see Reggie Bush in a Texan's jersey come fall.
Leonard Pope, the Georgia TE declared ! Wow, could we use that guy !
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Old 01-09-2006   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swtbound07
I would trade Reggie and David Carr for a bag of kc masterpiece barbecue ruffles (i know, but you really CANT get them in florida...anybody wanna ship a bag to a friend?), much less a talent like vince young. He will throw more than carr and gain more on the ground than reggie. JMO

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Old 01-09-2006   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevo3883
1st, you obviously arent a scout because Bush is a very good blocker.
So was Davis...in college.
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Old 01-09-2006   #16
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Reasons DD is not a solid #1 RB:
1. DD is injury prone.
2. DD has 4 100 rushing games every year. I realize his YPG is high, but we need a RUNNING back. We need someone who can get more 100 yard games and help control the clock. Portis had 9 100 yard games this year which is the reason Washington is in the playoffs (and he can pass block - but he sucks for fantasy because he doesn't score)
3. DD is injury prone.
4. We need a RB that can pass block, which DD can't. If he could block better, Carr would have had a lot more time to throw to WRs instead of dumping off to DD. Side effect: As our OL improves, we should throw more to WRs and less to RBs, which means DD value will decrease
5. DD is injury prone.
6. DD does not break long runs. Even when DD gets a big hole, he gets caught. We need a RB that is threat to take it to the house if he breaks through the line. DD had 2 games this year where he had 44 yard runs, and didn't score (note that both of these games were against Tenn who was terrible this year). His next longest run was 29 yards, and didn't score (against Balt). After that his longest rushing gains per game were: 19, 18, 15, 13, 12, 11, 7, and 6 (nad his previous years are similar). His longest pass catches were 30 and 33 yards. He just isn't fast.
7. DD is injury prone.
8. DD does not score rushing TDs. He had 2 rushing tds all year. Arguably this is an anomaly for this year, or it could be a trend.
9. Did I mention DD is injury prone?

Untrue Bush comparisons:
(I think everyone admits he is fast(4.28 40), can catch and has awesome juke moves - I taped his games against UT and UCLA and watched some of his runs in slow motion, the only thing I could say is WOW) (before watching those games I was in the "trade the pick" category, as I have been since year one)
1. He can't pass block: The dude is a great blocker - as other posters have attested to.
2. He is too small and weak to go inside: He benches over 400 pounds, is 6 foot and 220 pounds. According to CBS: Alexander is 5'11 and 220; LJ is 6'1 and 230; LT is 5'10 and 220; Tiki is 5'10 and 200; EJames is 6' and 215. So, it's not his size or strength that is the problem (Carroll played to the strength of each of his stud RBs - Bush's speed and White's size - but that doesn't mean Bush can't get his inside - watch the UCLA game film for proof). Also, like most RBs, he will add about 20 pounds of bulk over the next two years.
3. He is too . . . . err... that's about it.

DD's limitations aside, I have no problem keeping DD, as a complement to Bush. If we can't get anything for him, keep him (and trade Morency for a 4th or keep him too). It would be nice to have depth and strength at a position (especially RB due to the higher injury % for RBs).

One last note: RBs that are pass catchers (Tiki/LT/DD) will always rank high in fantasy, but that doesn't make them the best in real life. I remember the king of YPG - MFaulk in his prime. DD is no Faulk (and neither is Tiki or LT). Bush might not be, but then again he might be. I would just be happy if he is the next Terrell Davis (especially with Kubiak here). I drafted him #1 a couple of times.
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Old 01-09-2006   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xman
2. DD has 4 100 rushing games every year. I realize his YPG is high, but we need a RUNNING back. We need someone who can get more 100 yard games and help control the clock. Portis had 9 100 yard games this year which is the reason Washington is in the playoffs (and he can pass block - but he sucks for fantasy because he doesn't score)
So why draft Bush #1 overall? Portis was a 2nd round draft pick.
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Old 01-09-2006   #18
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So why draft Bush #1 overall? Portis was a 2nd round draft pick.

So, since one second round RB is good, RBs should never be selected in the first round? That logic doesn't work.

Bush has the speed (and the moves and pass catching ability) to be something special. Based on his skill set, he should succeed . . . and excel.

Sometimes you get lucky later in the draft, but the odds are against you (which is why I would pay JJohnson about a mil to be a 'draft' consultant - that guy can evaluate talent like no other). But (without a supergenuis like JJ), if you want to draft RBs in the second round every year, you might get lucky and get a pro-bowler every 6-8 years and a hall of famer every 12-15 years or so. Or, you could just take the one being served up on a platter that has a much higher percentage chance of being that guy. There is a chance that he does not become that guy, but I would take him over a dozen 2nd round RBs.
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Old 01-09-2006   #19
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I'am firmly in the trade down camp, but I doubt very much we trade out, so the next best option IMO is Bush. I see good things being POSSIBLE with either Bush or Young, but there are even more BAD things that are possible and even quit likely with picking either one.
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Old 01-09-2006   #20
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8.6 a carry
longs per game of (this year): 78, 65, 65, 65, 45, 42, 41, 38, 34 . . . . not one game this year without a long over 10 yards.
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