Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQDonate Automatic Monthly Contribution Members List Mark Forums Read


Texans Talk Football talk only please. Keep it to the game, the players, the coaches and management.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-09-2006   #1
Daonly
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Age: 38
Posts: 165
Rep Power: 10 Daonly is ridin' the pine
Default Would you trade Carr and Reggie for VY??

If you don't resign Carr and don't draft Bush and draft Young that's practically what you be doing, and that's the most stupid trade EVER! Back in the day I had an older model car (Nissan) and my transmission went out. I got it towed to a repair shop. I ask them how much will it cost to get it fixed? After looking over the car they said $1,200 bucks. I was like Hell No! The car not even worth $1,200 bucks!! I'll just go buy me another used car with that money. I lived in Los Angeles, and I couldn't afford a new car at that time;anyways the guy was like why go out and get another used car and don't know what you'll be getting in the long run (another lemon) just fix the car you have now, at least you know what's wrong with it and you'll have a brand new transmission with a year's warranty.

I was like yeah that's true; so I took his word and the rest is history. Best Decision I made. So what IM trying to say is by keeping Carr we already know what we have. Fellas he is not that bad of a QB; he's not Boller who keep making dumb plays and fumbles! He just don't get enough time to throw, not enough playmakers, if he had enough playmakers he still don't have enough time to throw.Carr is tuff! Mc Nair owns the car. Reeves was the Mechanic, The New Coaching Staff will be the New Transmission.

You fix and improve on what you have, you add you don't subtract. By letting go Carr you be subtracting 1 then adding 1 in Vince Young and will be back in the same boat maybe even worst shape; cause you all know there's a learning curve Vince Young has to go through and it may take longer than Carr had to go through, Hell Young may be injury Prone like Charlie Rogers! You don't want to make the same mistakes as Detroit, giving into the Fans because he's from the Home Town and the State Hero! About the time Young reaches that level (If and when); Andre Johnson and the rest of our good players will reach their prime or past it; or resign on another team cause they are tired of waiting around! By resigning Carr it tells the rest of the Team they committed to they're players already aboard and they believe in they're value and that's make a difference mentally in the locker room.

So here we go all on board for the Texans not individuals! Resign Carr, Draft Best of Available (Bush) rest of the draft fill needs trade down high 3rd pick up and extra 4th. Sign a few free agents, Bentley from the Saints, etc etc.. New Offense, Coaching, Motivation! Ready to Rock N Roll!

Last edited by Daonly; 01-09-2006 at 12:42 PM.
Daonly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #2
texan279
Hall of Fame
 
texan279's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Rosenberg TX
Age: 35
Posts: 5,677
Rep Power: 13829 texan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexan279 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

I think we need a Vince Young/Reggie Bush forum...:brickwall
__________________
Fire It Up, Let the engines roll, It's time to burn it down
texan279 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #3
chuckm
Hall of Fame
 
chuckm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Spring
Age: 53
Posts: 1,896
Rep Power: 15 chuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVP
Default

I see your Carr & Reggie and raise you my firstborn child ...
__________________
Sabbatical: an extended period away from our daily routine to refresh our minds and spirits
chuckm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #4
HoustonFrog
Chitown Frog
 
HoustonFrog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Chicago
Age: 44
Posts: 12,418
Rep Power: 32827 HoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

I don't see the correlation here. You don't have Reggie and are taking a guy who can run and pass. You also aren't going to give Carr away. You can take the cap hit, hope he looks great under Kubiak and trade him for a #1(iffy) or #2 or you can work a trade out now. Either way, the anolgy doesn't work. I think Bush is the smart move but the anaolgy doesn't fit.
HoustonFrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #5
Htown34s
Veteran
 
Htown34s's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Age: 44
Posts: 384
Rep Power: 11 Htown34s is a team player
Default

Ouch. My brain hurts 4 lines into your post. Try hitting the Return key every now and then! Your comparison counts on us cutting Carr outright, which even Casserly wouldn't be dumb enough to do.
__________________
"I'm going to win them over regardless" -Mario Williams
Htown34s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #6
groutfulone
Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 29
Rep Power: 0 groutfulone is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daonly
If you don't resign Carr and don't draft Bush and draft Young that's practically what you be doing, and that's the most stupid trade EVER!
Yes. I guess I'm stupid.
groutfulone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #7
tulexan
Hall of Fame
 
tulexan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 30
Posts: 5,080
Rep Power: 28 tulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famer
Default

They aren't going to sign David Carr and then trade him. They are either going to not pick up David Carr and draft Vince Young or they are going to pick up David Carr and draft Reggie Bush unless there is a trade too good to pass up to drop down to a lower pick. And right now it looks like they are going to do the latter. I don't know how many times you need to hear it. If there was some doubt, then there would be reports with evidence. Not the Skip Bayless's, Richard Justice's, and the John McClain's, who are all basing their decision on emotion and not reason. All of the people who are saying that we are drafting Bush have evidence. Casserly himself said that we aren't drafting a QB, McNair said that we are picking a player with an immediate impact, Mortensen said that we are picking Bush, Glazer said that we are having coaching candidates break down game film of Bush, Woody Paige said that McNair has gone to several GMs around the league and asked their opinion about Carr and they like him, Glauber said that we are picking Bush after talking with Casserly.

Do you see the difference? One group has evidence, one group has emotion.
tulexan is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
Old 01-09-2006   #8
Daonly
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Age: 38
Posts: 165
Rep Power: 10 Daonly is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonFrog
I don't see the correlation here. You don't have Reggie and are taking a guy who can run and pass. You also aren't going to give Carr away. You can take the cap hit, hope he looks great under Kubiak and trade him for a #1(iffy) or #2 or you can work a trade out now. Either way, the anolgy doesn't work. I think Bush is the smart move but the anaolgy doesn't fit.

It does fit because you already know what you have in David Carr as an NFL QB over tha past 4 years under a coaching staff that's done nothing to improve this team. So by fixing the problem (Coaching Staff). would be the smarter move than Drafting an unproven QB in Vince Young; Pay him all that money before he takes one snap; and don't know if he pans out as an NFL QB, he may be injury prone? WHO to KNOW?? that's what im saying; but what we DO know is Carr is not the problem. The System and Coaching he had was and we need to surround him with another Playmaker. Passing TE, Few OL let it be one from the draft and a couple from free agency and a agressive coach. You go for what you know in the case of our QB position. Experience goes a long way more than pure talent; Which Young doesnt have; There's nothing more to debate, I can see if his talents merit to being a pocket passer, but he's not one. take away 60% of his playbook in College make him a pocket passer, The Texas LongHorns wouldn't even be National Champions!
Daonly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #9
HoustonFrog
Chitown Frog
 
HoustonFrog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Chicago
Age: 44
Posts: 12,418
Rep Power: 32827 HoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tulexan
They aren't going to sign David Carr and then trade him. They are either going to not pick up David Carr and draft Vince Young or they are going to pick up David Carr and draft Reggie Bush unless there is a trade too good to pass up to drop down to a lower pick. And right now it looks like they are going to do the latter. I don't know how many times you need to hear it. If there was some doubt, then there would be reports with evidence. Not the Skip Bayless's, Richard Justice's, and the John McClain's, who are all basing their decision on emotion and not reason. All of the people who are saying that we are drafting Bush have evidence. Casserly himself said that we aren't drafting a QB, McNair said that we are picking a player with an immediate impact, Mortensen said that we are picking Bush, Glazer said that we are having coaching candidates break down game film of Bush, Woody Paige said that McNair has gone to several GMs around the league and asked their opinion about Carr and they like him, Glauber said that we are picking Bush after talking with Casserly. Do you see the difference? One group has evidence, one group has emotion.

I can't stand Casserly and am just shaking my head thinking that he would just announce our plan without thinking. "IF" was used in many of statements and I still think you have to scout before making the decision. You don't even have a coach in place yet. As long as we are bashing guys, Woody page would not be someone I'd trust either. Mortenson said we were hiring Jeff Fischer. Right now I'm wwaiting. I like either guy but think the safe route with Bush and O-line in the mid picks is the way they will go. I don't hink it is all emotion on Young because alot of these statements was pre-last week and no one has scouted up VY yet.
HoustonFrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #10
HoustonFrog
Chitown Frog
 
HoustonFrog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Chicago
Age: 44
Posts: 12,418
Rep Power: 32827 HoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respectedHoustonFrog is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daonly
It does fit because you already know what you have in David Carr as an NFL QB over tha past 4 years under a coaching staff that's done nothing to improve this team. So by fixing the problem (Coaching Staff). would be the smarter move than Drafting an unproven QB in Vince Young; Pay him all that money before he takes one snap; and don't know if he pans out as an NFL QB, he may be injury prone? WHO to KNOW?? that's what im saying; but what we DO know is Carr is not the problem. The System and Coaching he had was and we need to surround him with another Playmaker. Passing TE, Few OL let it be one from the draft and a couple from free agency and a agressive coach. You go for what you know in the case of our QB position. Experience goes a long way more than pure talent; Which Young doesnt have; There's nothing more to debate, I can see if his talents merit to being a pocket passer, but he's not one. take away 60% of his playbook in College make him a pocket passer, The Texas LongHorns wouldn't even be National Champions!
I don't know where to start here. First why would you throw out a scenario where you take away 60% of his playbook and make him a pocket passer?That isn't VY and part of his skills is the running game and his ability to lead. I'm not saying we draft him but that statement doesn't make sense. What makes you think that all we need is a coach and Carr will be good?If this was such a simple formula there would be new coaches every year turning the Ryan Leaf's of the world into All-Pro QBs. Not comparing the two but that is a huge generalization. How do you know CARR is not the problem. He has regressed and many sacks are his fault, not the lines. I'm just not seeing the correlation with any of this since they could still get value from the guy.
HoustonFrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #11
tulexan
Hall of Fame
 
tulexan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 30
Posts: 5,080
Rep Power: 28 tulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famer
Default

I think Casserly's use of "if" goes back to his surliness in interviews. He seemed like he didn't want to be there, and was getting tired of repetitive questions that he has heard countless times.

If you stick the word "obviously" in front of those statements, which is probably what he was thinking, they make much more sense.

For example:

Obviously if we pick up David Carr then we are not going to take a QB
tulexan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #12
texanGoon22
Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Age: 28
Posts: 15
Rep Power: 0 texanGoon22 is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daonly
If you don't resign Carr and don't draft Bush and draft Young that's practically what you be doing, and that's the most stupid trade EVER! Back in the day I had an older model car (Nissan) and my transmission went out. I got it towed to a repair shop. I ask them how much will it cost to get it fixed? After looking over the car they said $1,200 bucks. I was like Hell No! The car not even worth $1,200 bucks!! I'll just go buy me another used car with that money. I lived in Los Angeles, and I couldn't afford a new car at that time;anyways the guy was like why go out and get another used car and don't know what you'll be getting in the long run (another lemon) just fix the car you have now, at least you know what's wrong with it and you'll have a brand new transmission with a year's warranty.

I was like yeah that's true; so I took his word and the rest is history. Best Decision I made. So what IM trying to say is by keeping Carr we already know what we have. Fellas he is not that bad of a QB; he's not Boller who keep making dumb plays and fumbles! He just don't get enough time to throw, not enough playmakers, if he had enough playmakers he still don't have enough time to throw.Carr is tuff! Mc Nair owns the car. Reeves was the Mechanic, The New Coaching Staff will be the New Transmission.

You fix and improve on what you have, you add you don't subtract. By letting go Carr you be subtracting 1 then adding 1 in Vince Young and will be back in the same boat maybe even worst shape; cause you all know there's a learning curve Vince Young has to go through and it may take longer than Carr had to go through, Hell Young may be injury Prone like Charlie Rogers! You don't want to make the same mistakes as Detroit, giving into the Fans because he's from the Home Town and the State Hero! About the time Young reaches that level (If and when); Andre Johnson and the rest of our good players will reach their prime or past it; or resign on another team cause they are tired of waiting around! By resigning Carr it tells the rest of the Team they committed to they're players already aboard and they believe in they're value and that's make a difference mentally in the locker room.

So here we go all on board for the Texans not individuals! Resign Carr, Draft Best of Available (Bush) rest of the draft fill needs trade down high 3rd pick up and extra 4th. Sign a few free agents, Bentley from the Saints, etc etc.. New Offense, Coaching, Motivation! Ready to Rock N Roll!

Good Stuff, I completely agree. Plus Bush will automatically make the line better just by keeping opposing defenses honest.
texanGoon22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #13
chuckm
Hall of Fame
 
chuckm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Spring
Age: 53
Posts: 1,896
Rep Power: 15 chuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVP
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tulexan
Obviously if we pick up David Carr then we are not going to take a QB

please define the word "if" ....... just kidding :brickwall
__________________
Sabbatical: an extended period away from our daily routine to refresh our minds and spirits
chuckm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #14
tulexan
Hall of Fame
 
tulexan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 30
Posts: 5,080
Rep Power: 28 tulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famertulexan is a Hall of Famer
Default

And if you actually watched the show last night, and didn't just read quotes, you could hear the typical angry tone on Casserly when answering the questions.
tulexan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #15
TheOgre
Hall of Fame
 
TheOgre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Back in the cellar again
Posts: 3,739
Rep Power: 17 TheOgre was voted MVPTheOgre was voted MVPTheOgre was voted MVPTheOgre was voted MVP
Default

Texan's options with respect to Carr between now and March 1st:

1. Let him go and get nothing.

2. Don't re-sign him but transitional tag him. We can match any offer from any team but get no compensation if he is signed.

3. Don't re-sign him but franchise tag him. We get compensation if he is signed. He gets no signing bonus but is a pretty big cap hit this season.

4. Go with the 2 year option on his current contract. That would include a $5 million bonus that would be prorated onto this season if we traded him.

5. Go with the 3 year option on his current contract. That would include an $8 million bonus that would be prorated onto this season if we traded him.

6. Sign him to a brand new contract.

What we do should give us an indication of our draft intensions.
__________________
"...the Texans select...Adrian Peterson, RB, University of Oklahoma."
TheOgre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #16
Daonly
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Age: 38
Posts: 165
Rep Power: 10 Daonly is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonFrog
I don't know where to start here. First why would you throw out a scenario where you take away 60% of his playbook and make him a pocket passer?That isn't VY and part of his skills is the running game and his ability to lead. I'm not saying we draft him but that statement doesn't make sense. What makes you think that all we need is a coach and Carr will be good?If this was such a simple formula there would be new coaches every year turning the Ryan Leaf's of the world into All-Pro QBs. Not comparing the two but that is a huge generalization. How do you know CARR is not the problem. He has regressed and many sacks are his fault, not the lines. I'm just not seeing the correlation with any of this since they could still get value from the guy.
Ok before the rosebowl, before all the Reggie Bush Hype. Way before we knew we would be in line for a high draft pick not even #1 over all, Well let's take it back to last year! We all know the problem lies in the OLINE!!! We all knew that!! Carr is not great! we all know that, but you ADD, ADD around him to make his job easier, We have plenty pieces to the puzzle already, The New Coaching staff will know how to work those pieces together to make them fit. Vince Young will have to learn a new playbook twice the size of his, and 95% of that playbook is not going to be calling his number. The Texans are Not I repeat Not running a QB option with a 55 Million dollar QB, if that's the case will take Marcus Vick in the 4th round! Vince Young learning curve will take at least 2 years; and that's not FAIR to the other Players on this team wanting to go out and win and want this team to improve NOW!!!
Daonly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #17
ImSoTexas
Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Age: 42
Posts: 20
Rep Power: 0 ImSoTexas is ridin' the pine
Default

This is a no brainer if you're McNair...Take Vince! Carr is a good QB but the pressure to win is about to become insurmountable & if we pass on VY and Carr struggles we will end up getting another QB in a couple of years anyway. I say let Carr get a fresh start somewhere else and since we are hiring a new coach anyway. Let him rebuild with a new QB. WE cant any worse than we were this past year anyway. Do you think we would have the same record with Vince at QB this year? I dont think so, he's atleast 2 to 3 wins better than Carr right now. Plus DD is one of the most productive backs in the league & we have Morency to back him up. Or take Vince & trade Carr to Miami or Detriot for some pics.
ImSoTexas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #18
CenTexNative
Veteran
 
CenTexNative's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: In the booonies
Posts: 210
Rep Power: 9 CenTexNative is ridin' the pine
Send a message via AIM to CenTexNative Send a message via Yahoo to CenTexNative
Default

I don't think people are giving David Carr enough credit. It's not an easy thing to do, throwing a pass while running. But that bieng said. I do believe that having Vince Young as Davids backup for a year maybe two would help him get his wings at it were. Even as good as Vince can scramble he would still get clobbered in the NFL where the game is twice as fast as it is at the college level. But none of this will ever happen until the offensive line can be strengthened.
__________________
I'll Just Wait And See What Happens
CenTexNative is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #19
Wordem
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 185
Rep Power: 0 Wordem has been demoted to the practice squad
Default

In a heartbeat.
Wordem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006   #20
swtbound07
Jackass of Day!
 
swtbound07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Tampa, Florida
Age: 29
Posts: 9,474
Rep Power: 904 swtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respectedswtbound07 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

shrugs...its lunchtime. i trade reggie bush for a sammich and a bag of kc masterpiece ruffles (you cant get them in florida)
__________________

Sig by Michaelm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Maher
"I'll show you Obama's birth certificate when you show me Sarah Palin's high school diploma"
swtbound07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ad Management by RedTyger