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Old 11-02-2005   #81
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Answer the question. Was Pendry wrong for throwing on third down? Were the Texans attempting to run clock with 3 minutes left? No, they were trying to get a first down or a TD. I heard what the commentator said, as well. He's a buffoon. You can't run clock with 3 minutes left in a tied game.

The Browns still had the 2 minute warning & 2 timeouts. Plenty of time to score a TD, which they almost did. The Texans would have needed every second left on that clock. Get your head in the game.
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Old 11-02-2005   #82
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Originally Posted by the wonger need food
My point was that PR seems to override winning...

1) Riley starting immediately because he was signed to solve the LT problems.
2) Bradford was signed to solve the #2 receiver problem and started the first 6 games.
3) Hollings on the roster.

-----------------------------------

"...I just don't see where you get the PR out of this..." -- infantrycak

-----------------------------------

Check the front page of this website, specifically the article about Phillip Buchanon and how great he's turning out to be.

If that isn't a slice of Homer pie...I don't know what is.

Wasn't there any Texans reading books to kids at libraries this week, or something else to run as a story other than how much of turn around Buchanon is beginning to make?

Wonger's right on this one. Too much PR, and not enough truth serum.
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Old 11-02-2005   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky
Answer the question. Was Pendry wrong for throwing on third down? Were the Texans attempting to run clock with 3 minutes left? No, they were trying to get a first down or a TD. I heard what the commentator said, as well. He's a buffoon. You can't run clock with 3 minutes left in a tied game.

The Browns still had the 2 minute warning & 2 timeouts. Plenty of time to score a TD, which they almost did. The Texans would have needed every second left on that clock. Get your head in the game.
I was at the game so I cannot comment about the commentator.

Not sure why I need to answer your question, but will give it a try. Since DC ran out of bounds it put the Texans in a passing situation. If DC stays in bounds then we would run the ball again on 3rd and 5 taking us to the two minute warning.

Once again DC put us in a tight spot because of HIS decison to go out of bounds.

What would make you think that we have the luxury to pick spots for our offense to succeed? Has this team shown the ability to run a 1 minute offense.
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Old 11-02-2005   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky
Answer the question. ... Get your head in the game.
Can we have less rude moderators please?

Kaiser. I see your point.

A slide at that point seems like a smart thing to do, especially if the play wasn't going anywhere anyway. Stopping the clock, especially when you have all your time outs left, seems a bit odd when you're tied and driving from your opponent's 22 with just under three minutes left. A Carr slide would have kept the clock running and would likely have coaxed time out #2 out of Crennel. I don't think they were necessarily playing for the FG at that point and if you asked Capers, I'm sure he would have preferred a first down and a few more plays to suck away all their TO's before either a shorter FG or a TD.
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Old 11-02-2005   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro
Not sure why I need to answer your question, but will give it a try. Since DC ran out of bounds it put the Texans in a passing situation. If DC stays in bounds then we would run the ball again on 3rd and 5 taking us to the two minute warning.

Once again DC put us in a tight spot because of HIS decison to go out of bounds.
OK, that was weak. You're saying you don't want the Texans trying for a TD or a completion inside the 5? Dom, is that you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro
What would make you think that we have the luxury to pick spots for our offense to succeed? Has this team shown the ability to run a 1 minute offense.
Jerome Mathis has shown the ability to return a kickoff. Come on, this is silly. I'm sure you'll have much better rips on Carr next week.
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Old 11-02-2005   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aj.
Can we have less rude moderators please?
I probably shouldn't have gone "A Few Good Men" on Kaiser. Not without a smilie.
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Old 11-02-2005   #87
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Originally Posted by Lucky
I probably shouldn't have gone "A Few Good Men" on Kaiser. Not without a smilie.


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Old 11-02-2005   #88
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a slide was the right thing for Carr to do in that play. Would it have eaten all of the clock up, no. But it would have given the Browns even less time. A pass play on the next play was the right thing to call for a first down attempt. But that doesn't negate the dumbness of Carr running out of bounds and stopping the clock. Just another in the list of dumb things Carr does that makes you wonder how in the heck he is not only a 1st round pick but has been playing for over 3 seasons now, IMHO.
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Old 11-02-2005   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky
OK, that was weak. You're saying you don't want the Texans trying for a TD or a completion inside the 5? Dom, is that you?


Jerome Mathis has shown the ability to return a kickoff. Come on, this is silly. I'm sure you'll have much better rips on Carr next week.
I really do not understand your first statement. I answered your question after you did not bother to answer my first one, which is no big deal. But to call my position weak is asinine at best.

As far as Jerome goes I think that the Browns would have figured it out not to kick to him. I do appreciate your unbridled enthusiasm for Mathis as nonsensical it may make your judgement.

As Billy Bats says to Joey D in Good Fellas, "now go get your ******* shine box!"
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Old 11-02-2005   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro
As far as Jerome goes I think that the Browns would have figured it out not to kick to him.
Why didn't they figure that out earlier? You're giving a coaching staff that lost to the Texans a lot of credit here.

OK, try this on. Carr slides for probably a one yard loss (he's killed for giving up a sack). The Browns let the clock run down to 2:15ish (why not, the score is tied and they have 2 time outs). Pendry inexplicably still calls for the pass on 3rd down (what an *****). Kris Brown duffs again. The Browns have the ball at the 30 with 2 time outs.

Same plays happen on the following drive. Except let's say there's 5 seconds on the 4th and forever. P-Buch mistimes his leap & Bryant scores the winning TD. Here's what the CBA (Carr Bashing Association) has to say on the Texans board.

"Carr's an ***** for taking that sack! He should have thrown the ball away, he wasted precious seconds in the game! Cut him now!"

Heads you win, tails Carr loses. Again.
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Old 11-02-2005   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky
Why didn't they figure that out earlier? You're giving a coaching staff that lost to the Texans a lot of credit here.

OK, try this on. Carr slides for probably a one yard loss (he's killed for giving up a sack). The Browns let the clock run down to 2:15ish (why not, the score is tied and they have 2 time outs). Pendry inexplicably still calls for the pass on 3rd down (what an *****). Kris Brown duffs again. The Browns have the ball at the 30 with 2 time outs.

Same plays happen on the following drive. Except let's say there's 5 seconds on the 4th and forever. P-Buch mistimes his leap & Bryant scores the winning TD. Here's what the CBA (Carr Bashing Association) has to say on the Texans board.

"Carr's an ***** for taking that sack! He should have thrown the ball away, he wasted precious seconds in the game! Cut him now!"

Heads you win, tails Carr loses. Again.
Emotions can be an obstruction to moments of clarity. Go back and read this dialogue and see what you have written. You are truly an enigma wrapped in a moderating riddle.
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Old 11-02-2005   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro
You are truly an enigma wrapped in a moderating riddle.
Dude, I'm just a member like you. When someone posts something naughty, I yank it. Not much too it. I'm just having a good time. Sortof.

I really think wonger needs to form the CBA and hand out titles. I mean if you guys can take the time to rip someone after what may quite possibly be the only win of the season, there's some hatin' going on. Embrace the hate, form the CBA.
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Old 11-02-2005   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky
Dude, I'm just a member like you. When someone posts something naughty, I yank it. Not much too it. I'm just having a good time. Sortof.

I really think wonger needs to form the CBA and hand out titles. I mean if you guys can take the time to rip someone after what may quite possibly be the only win of the season, there's some hatin' going on. Embrace the hate, form the CBA.
Not a hater, just someone who expects results. If we were 5-2 right now and we lost that game we would be talkng about that type of mental lapse. It boggles my mind how many who have a down right allegiance to Carr ask for tangible plays to discuss his performance rather than spout hyperbole. I call out a situation that Carr addressed and did not agree with his decision. The best that you can come back with is pushback in the form of deflecting the question and a crafting of your own association and other half baked innuendos. Tell tell signs of being in over your head.
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Old 11-02-2005   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro
...I call out a situation that Carr addressed and did not agree with his decision...
Are you planning on analyzing the guys every move in the game? Did this one play trump everything that went on during the game? From here, it looks like a fixation.

I gave you a scenario that showed the non-slide was not an absolute blunder. You didn't care for my explanation because it didn't fit your bashing, so sorry. You made a poor argument on a trivial point. After a big, big win. That's how I see it.
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Old 11-02-2005   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpshafer_1976
-----------------------------------

"...I just don't see where you get the PR out of this..." -- infantrycak

-----------------------------------
Step into Wonger's shoes there big boy. He declined to because his points on Riley and Bradford made no sense. Care to have a go at explaining how money and draft pick choices (the issue you chose to quote on) have made a difference on starter selection?
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Old 11-02-2005   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky
Are you planning on analyzing the guys every move in the game? Did this one play trump everything that went on during the game? From here, it looks like a fixation.

I gave you a scenario that showed the non-slide was not an absolute blunder. You didn't care for my explanation because it didn't fit your bashing, so sorry. You made a poor argument on a trivial point. After a big, big win. That's how I see it.
Nerp. Thank you for the thoughts and may the forces of evil be confused upon your path to the next Texans game.
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Old 11-02-2005   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro
We were at the 22 yard line and it would have been third and five. So you would actually play the clock that way? Forget Carr for a second and let me know if the time, score and situation were the same and QB X was running for the sideline you would want him to go out of bounds?
Well aside from our intent to be rude moderators, here is more what happened:

Quote:
3:03 2nd & 5 Cruddy camera work. 1 WR, 2 TE, FB. Designed roll right kept for 1. (OK I called it 1 off the tape, nfl.com calls it none--either way no sack).

2:56 3rd & 5. 3 WR-2L, TE-R. 5 step drop—2:54 out to Armstrong in endzone. Ball overthrown a little but Armstrong mugged at goal line—no call. Wade gets abused, his guy is in Carr’s face. DD has weak block, his guy is behind Carr.
The play you are talking about is 2nd and 5. Maybe he should have thrown it away, but how did that effect the game? The Browns were on the roll out all day long, are you really saying 1 yard, plus or minus made the difference on the day? It was not counted as a sack. 3rd & 5 Carr took his shot--so what are you saying was wrong? Are we really down to time management and pessimism to the level where we want our QB running out the clock (where have I heard this described as playing not to lose) rather than trying to get a game winning lead? Hmmm.
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Old 11-02-2005   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infantrycak
Well aside from our intent to be rude moderators, here is more what happened:



The play you are talking about is 2nd and 5. Maybe he should have thrown it away, but how did that effect the game? The Browns were on the roll out all day long, are you really saying 1 yard, plus or minus made the difference on the day? It was not counted as a sack. 3rd & 5 Carr took his shot--so what are you saying was wrong?
What I was saying, but was thrown off by a message board filibuster, is that Carr went out of bounds on 2nd and 5 when he should have stayed in bounds. This was a mental mistake that I thought most would agree needs to be addressed.
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Old 11-02-2005   #99
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not to speak for Kaiser, but what Carr did wrong is run out of bounds for no gain and stopping the clock. He should have slid or went down INBOUNDS and let the clock continue to run. Which could have meant that instead of the Browns getting the ball with 2:38 left in the game they could have easily gotten it with only 2:00 left instead. Given that the Browns last play was with 50 seconds left, I think that Carr running out of bounds was a big mistake. It meant that 45 seconds of the game could have been ran off the clock.

and as you so astutely pointed out the very next play Armstrong was LITERALLY mugged but didn't get the call. How THAT happened is beyond me with todays NFL rules regarding touching the WR after the 5 yard mark, but that is the breaks of the game. So I don't fault Pendry for calling a pass play that should have resulted in us getting at least a first down, with the proper officiating call being made there.

but hey, hindsight is always 20/20 right.
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Old 11-02-2005   #100
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Originally Posted by thegr8fan
...Which could have meant that instead of the Browns getting the ball with 2:38 left in the game they could have easily gotten it with only 2:00 left instead...
gr8, do you remember that the Browns ran off the :45 to the 2:00 warning themselves with a couple of running plays?

Cleveland Browns at 2:45, (1st play from scrimmage 2:38)
1-10-CLV 27 (2:38) 31-W.Green right end to CLV 33 for 6 yards (51-D.Polk).
2-4-CLV 33 (2:05) 31-W.Green left guard to CLV 40 for 7 yards (30-J.Simmons). R15
Two-Minute Warning

You know what I'm thinking? That Crennel wanted to run all the clock off so that the Texans wouldn't get another shot. He basically wasted that precious :45 seconds that you think Carr blundered. So in reality (where the Texans actually win the game), it wasn't a "big mistake". Or a mistake at all. It's a non-issue, except for those who want to overanalyze David Carr's every movement. Them's the facts.
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