Punt/Kick off returner needed: Bring Back JJ!!! - Houston Texans Message Board & Forum

Mean Machine · 10-14-2005

Well, after seeing potential in Mathis as a return guy, but his being slowed by injuries....and seeing how P Buch just doesn't seem to be running straight ahead on punt returns...now is the time to DUMP HOLLINGS and bring back JJ MOSES!

JJ always made positive yards, and while he never 'broke' one all the way, he was getting us decent field postion quite a few times.
We need players to step up and perform. Nothing against Hollings but exactly what IS he doing on the Texans? He's a 4th string tailback for crying outloud. JJ contributes to the team with solid returns every time.

JfromthaTray · 10-14-2005

I feel you, but the sacks would nullify the good field position just like last year.

Texans Horror · 10-14-2005

I may be way off on this, but wasn't Swinton making some pretty good runs for us in the pre-season? Help me out if I have the wrong guy, but why did he get cut?

Exascor · 10-14-2005

I would rather the team try to improve on offense and defense before being too concerned with our OK special teams. The special teams aren't great but it's the best unit we have right now.

rmartin65 · 10-14-2005

i like mathis as returner.

TheOgre · 10-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by oso

I may be way off on this, but wasn't Swinton making some pretty good runs for us in the pre-season? Help me out if I have the wrong guy, but why did he get cut?

They didn't want to keep another WR on the roster. We already had AJ, Bradford, Gaffney, Armstrong, and Mathis making it. I think they also thought that Mathis (KR) and Buchanon (PR) would be almost as good. Buchanon was one of the best PR's in the league his first two years. Mathis has 4.28 speed. All of that said, I was shocked that we let Swinton go too.

Texans Horror · 10-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOgre

They didn't want to keep another WR on the roster. We already had AJ, Bradford, Gaffney, Armstrong, and Mathis making it. I think they also thought that Mathis (KR) and Buchanon (PR) would be almost as good. Buchanon was one of the best PR's in the league his first two years. Mathis has 4.28 speed. All of that said, I was shocked that we let Swinton go too.

Thanks for the info. I thought he looked really impressive and so assumed it was a personality/economic issue. But I agree with other posters that while our special teams could use some punch, we need to get our offense and defense jumpstarted first.

**Malloy** · 10-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOgre

They didn't want to keep another WR on the roster. We already had AJ, Bradford, Gaffney, Armstrong, and Mathis making it. I think they also thought that Mathis (KR) and Buchanon (PR) would be almost as good. Buchanon was one of the best PR's in the league his first two years. Mathis has 4.28 speed. All of that said, I was shocked that we let Swinton go too.

Mathis performed very well against the Titans, P-buc were not succesfull in that game but did show some amazing moves. I think he'll return at least one ball this season.

From what I've seen Swinton has not been very effecient in Arizona. Does not make him a bad player though, just one that's older and more expensive than Mathis

Mean Machine · 10-14-2005

I really like Mathis and he will be a great pick for us. My only concern right now is RIGHT NOW, he's banged up and so they're even thinking about having Dunta return kicks according to the Chronicle. JJ was a sure thing for positive yards on returns and jeesh, what good is Hollings doing, truly.
Mathis will be a good one, he just needs to get healthy.

**eriadoc** · 10-14-2005

I would have certainly cut Hollings and kept Swinton. I guess that's why I'm not a coach or GM.

**Kaiser Toro** · 10-14-2005

So we need JJ Moses back because why? Not sure if anyone has noticed, but we do not stop many people so there have not been many punt returns. We need better defense and maybe an offense to stay on the field before we worry about a situational player as JJ.

We have returned 6 punts to date. The team returned 40 last year. Kickoff returns have been pretty much even steven from an avergae standpoint.

I see no value in needing Moses or Swinton.

http://www.nfl.com/teams/stats/HOU/2005/regular

http://www.nfl.com/teams/stats/HOU/2004/regular

touttail · 10-14-2005

JJ Moses just doesn't have the speed. He got some good yardage, but just couldn't break away, too slow!

bobby 119C :brickwall

**infantrycak** · 10-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by touttail

JJ Moses just doesn't have the speed. He got some good yardage, but just couldn't break away, too slow!

bobby 119C :brickwall

Ahhh, yes the he is just too slow argument. OK folks, trivia question, what is the most KR's for a TD in a career by a kick returner? I mean it should be up there for some fast guy who can consistantly enough return it to make a difference for their team. So what is the record for these fleet footed saviours?

touttail · 10-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by infantrycak

Ahhh, yes the he is just too slow argument. OK folks, trivia question, what is the most KR's for a TD in a career by a kick returner? I mean it should be up there for some fast guy who can consistantly enough return it to make a difference for their team. So what is the record for these fleet footed saviours?

Don't know what Dion Sanders numbers were, but they were up there on returns.

Dave Maggett
9years
3,708 yards 6 TDs on punts
5,566 yards 1 TD on kickoffs

Brian Mitchell
14, 014 yards--4 TDs on kickoffs--40 with 40+ yards
4,999 yards---9 TDs on punts--53 with 20+ yards

Billy White Shoes Johnson
1975--4 TDs on returns
1977--3 TDs on returns
1976 Pro Bowl--1TD--90 yard return--159 total return yards, still a Pro bowl record
5 punts and 2 kickoff for TDs with his first 4 years with the Oilers

Is this enough for ya!

bobby 119C

rmartin65 · 10-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by touttail

Don't know what Dion Sanders numbers were, but they were up there on returns.

Dave Maggett
9years
3,708 yards 6 TDs on punts
5,566 yards 1 TD on kickoffs

Brian Mitchell
14, 014 yards--4 TDs on kickoffs--40 with 40+ yards
4,999 yards---9 TDs on punts--53 with 20+ yards

Billy White Shoes Johnson
1975--4 TDs on returns
1977--3 TDs on returns
1976 Pro Bowl--1TD--90 yard return--159 total return yards, still a Pro bowl record
5 punts and 2 kickoff for TDs with his first 4 years with the Oilers

Is this enough for ya!

bobby 119C

I think mathis could have those kind of numbers, if he gets healthy

touttail · 10-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by rmartin65

I think mathis could have those kind of numbers, if he gets healthy

I agree with you rmartin, he's definitely got the goods if he's not too fragile and can stay healthy!

bobby 119C

**infantrycak** · 10-14-2005

The answer for kick returns is 6. It was just set by Dante Hall. Umpteen thousand KR's in the NFL. Tons of home run threat guys and the record was 5 for a career for 60+ years and just got set at 6. The point being, while the idea of a home run KR threat is appealing, it really doesn't exist--not so far as it is going to affect the season of a team. Field position and not putting the ball on the ground count.

Scooter · 10-14-2005

infantrycak nailed it. homerun speed is nice, but being fast (contrary to popular belief) does not automatically make someone a better player than anyone else. see corey bradford. i'll always be on the moses bandwagon because he consistantly got us solid field position and didnt put the ball on the ground. that's his job, and he did it well. dont forget that without penalties, he would have ATLEAST 1 td. the NFL is built on guys that are "too old", "too slow", and "too small". heart and football instincts are what creates the elite players.

however, i've really liked the way mathis has looked so far. he moves quickly forward without hesitation and runs with his eyes down the field. i think he's going to be someone who can make a difference in games. not necessarily as a td threat, but as someone who can keep the offense in a workable field position. the blocking has been almost as bad as him as it has been for carr though, so it's going to be tough to have many miracles.

**infantrycak** · 10-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by touttail

Don't know what Dion Sanders numbers were, but they were up there on returns.

Dave Maggett
9years
3,708 yards 6 TDs on punts
5,566 yards 1 TD on kickoffs

Brian Mitchell
14, 014 yards--4 TDs on kickoffs--40 with 40+ yards
4,999 yards---9 TDs on punts--53 with 20+ yards

Billy White Shoes Johnson
1975--4 TDs on returns
1977--3 TDs on returns
1976 Pro Bowl--1TD--90 yard return--159 total return yards, still a Pro bowl record
5 punts and 2 kickoff for TDs with his first 4 years with the Oilers

Is this enough for ya!

bobby 119C

Sorry, no that does nothing for me in terms of deciding home run threat. Domanick Davis is the all time returning leader in the SEC on yards. Basically the same stats as you have. See above for the real answer.

touttail · 10-15-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by infantrycak

Sorry, no that does nothing for me in terms of deciding home run threat. Domanick Davis is the all time returning leader in the SEC on yards. Basically the same stats as you have. See above for the real answer.

Funny that of all the people I listed, that opposing teams were always trying to punt the ball AWAY from them because of the threat they presented!

Double D is NOT the all time returning leader in the SEC.
Double D-LSU
Punt Returns-------1126 yds.
Kick Off returns----2168 yds.
Total--------------3294 yds.
Derek Abney-Kentucky
Punt returns-------1042 yds.
Kick off returns----2315 yds.
Total-------------3357 yds.

bobby 119C

10-14-2005	#1
Mean Machine Veteran Join Date: May 2004 Location: Round Rock, TX Age: 50 Posts: 238 Rep Power: 113	Punt/Kick off returner needed: Bring Back JJ!!! Well, after seeing potential in Mathis as a return guy, but his being slowed by injuries....and seeing how P Buch just doesn't seem to be running straight ahead on punt returns...now is the time to DUMP HOLLINGS and bring back JJ MOSES! JJ always made positive yards, and while he never 'broke' one all the way, he was getting us decent field postion quite a few times. We need players to step up and perform. Nothing against Hollings but exactly what IS he doing on the Texans? He's a 4th string tailback for crying outloud. JJ contributes to the team with solid returns every time.

10-14-2005	#4
Exascor Hall of Fame Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Atascocita Posts: 1,147 Rep Power: 4938	I would rather the team try to improve on offense and defense before being too concerned with our OK special teams. The special teams aren't great but it's the best unit we have right now. __________________ I like you but...if zombies start to chase us I'm tripping you.

10-14-2005	#11
Kaiser Toro Native Mod Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Straight Outta Austin Age: 43 Posts: 15,886 Rep Power: 19756	So we need JJ Moses back because why? Not sure if anyone has noticed, but we do not stop many people so there have not been many punt returns. We need better defense and maybe an offense to stay on the field before we worry about a situational player as JJ. We have returned 6 punts to date. The team returned 40 last year. Kickoff returns have been pretty much even steven from an avergae standpoint. I see no value in needing Moses or Swinton. http://www.nfl.com/teams/stats/HOU/2005/regular http://www.nfl.com/teams/stats/HOU/2004/regular __________________ Texans 2012: Kidz II Men

10-14-2005	#17
infantrycak Lead Moderator Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Houston, TX Age: 45 Posts: 37,418 Rep Power: 76017	The answer for kick returns is 6. It was just set by Dante Hall. Umpteen thousand KR's in the NFL. Tons of home run threat guys and the record was 5 for a career for 60+ years and just got set at 6. The point being, while the idea of a home run KR threat is appealing, it really doesn't exist--not so far as it is going to affect the season of a team. Field position and not putting the ball on the ground count. __________________ The Art of War

10-14-2005	#18
Scooter Funky Join Date: Apr 2004 Age: 33 Posts: 4,209 Rep Power: 11587	infantrycak nailed it. homerun speed is nice, but being fast (contrary to popular belief) does not automatically make someone a better player than anyone else. see corey bradford. i'll always be on the moses bandwagon because he consistantly got us solid field position and didnt put the ball on the ground. that's his job, and he did it well. dont forget that without penalties, he would have ATLEAST 1 td. the NFL is built on guys that are "too old", "too slow", and "too small". heart and football instincts are what creates the elite players. however, i've really liked the way mathis has looked so far. he moves quickly forward without hesitation and runs with his eyes down the field. i think he's going to be someone who can make a difference in games. not necessarily as a td threat, but as someone who can keep the offense in a workable field position. the blocking has been almost as bad as him as it has been for carr though, so it's going to be tough to have many miracles. __________________

10-14-2005	#2
JfromthaTray Veteran Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 108 Rep Power: 9	I feel you, but the sacks would nullify the good field position just like last year.

10-14-2005	#3
Texans Horror Hall of Fame Join Date: Sep 2005 Age: 39 Posts: 2,303 Rep Power: 24	I may be way off on this, but wasn't Swinton making some pretty good runs for us in the pre-season? Help me out if I have the wrong guy, but why did he get cut?

10-14-2005	#5
rmartin65 I'm Score Join Date: Jul 2005 Age: 23 Posts: 7,492 Rep Power: 19221	i like mathis as returner.

10-14-2005	#10
eriadoc Texan-American Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 15,313 Rep Power: 69005	I would have certainly cut Hollings and kept Swinton. I guess that's why I'm not a coach or GM.

10-14-2005	#12
touttail All Pro Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Baytown Age: 58 Posts: 948 Rep Power: 9	JJ Moses just doesn't have the speed. He got some good yardage, but just couldn't break away, too slow! bobby 119C :brickwall

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