Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQDonate Automatic Monthly Contribution Members List Mark Forums Read


Texans Talk Football talk only please. Keep it to the game, the players, the coaches and management.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-06-2005   #1
Exascor
Hall of Fame
 
Exascor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Atascocita
Posts: 1,582
Rep Power: 35348 Exascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respectedExascor is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Is Casserly to Blame?

I hear a lot of rubblings that Casserly is as much or more to blame than the coaching staff. I'm not a huge Casserly fan but his only downfall IMO has been listening to his coaching staff on players selection/value. I really can't fault him for that. Isn't it his job to bring in players that the coaching staff feels will make the team better? Isn't that why some coaches want to be GMs as well?

We don't know what goes on for sure but there's no way Casserly makes all the picks and signings on his own. He has to have a ton of input from the coaching staff and the scouts. I'd bet that if it was the Raiders that approached us for the Buchanon trade that he would have cleared it with the coaching staff...including what picks we were giving up. You think Casserly just plopped a 2nd rounder on Hollings without the coaches making some kind of push for him? I doubt it. The fact that Casserly has been able to make moves like the Babin trade, Joppru trade down, Henson deal and a few "this year's draft picks for next year's higher draft pick" deals shows he's capable of making deals when needed. Are they all great moves? No way. Are they all Casserly's fault. No way. At least he shows he can get a deal done when needed.

Casserly is ultimately responsible for the entire team, players and coaching staff. I suppose that he should have nixed some of the deals like the Babin and Buchanon trades. If I was a GM and my coaches told me that "Babin will be the pass rusher we've been looking for" and had them compared to probowl caliber players then I might have pulled the trigger on that trade as well. OK-that one I still wouldn't have made but can understand why he would do it. I'll just point back to the fact that the GM must rely of info from the coaches and scouts. If that info is flawed, it could take years to find out. So far Buchanon and Hollings (and to a lesser extent Babin) at the very least seemed to have been the result of flawed info. Joppru was back luck period.

I'm not saying that the entire regime doesn't need to go. Maybe they do. I just think that some people are blaming Casserly for the player moves that he only has a partial part in. Should he be let go along with the coaching staff after this season? What could he do for a new coaching staff? Mr Mcnair has a lot of thinking to do.
__________________
Texans v3.0 - Currently in alpha testing - Expected release date 9/7/2014
Exascor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #2
Double Barrel
Modified Simian
 
Double Barrel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Onward, Upward, and back into the Trees
Section: Gridiron, Tx
Age: 47
Posts: 30,448
Rep Power: 281064 Double Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Good post, man, and excellent points.

I agree with you for the most part. I know Casserly has taken a lot of heat on the boards, and there are even questions about his ability to GM.

But, he has great respect among both the national media (who covers all NFL teams), as well as team owners and football experts. That has to account for something...at least in my book.

He's also a whiz on the salary cap from what I've read about him. You can never discount the effect that poor salary cap management has on a team's future potential. It can be devastating, and carry for many years beyond the one season you're dealing with at the present.

Personally, if there is change in the front office, I hope it starts with the HC instead of the GM. But that's just my take, and I'm a mere fan, so what do I know.
__________________
"Football is only a diversion." ~ HOUSTON TEXANS
Double Barrel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #3
CowboysTexansFan
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Age: 47
Posts: 311
Rep Power: 10 CowboysTexansFan is a team player
Default

I think you guys are being way too easy on Casserly.

Of course he's going to make personnel decisions based on the heavy input of the coaching staff, but ultimately, the buck stops with him. It's HIS job to run the team's football operations. If the team's picks and personnel moves ultimately don't work out, he has to take the responsibility. If the coaches and/or scouts gave him bad advice, they should be sent packing along with him.

For years the quality of the O-Line has been a weak spot and nothing has been done to address it. But more to the point, look at all the bad draft picks made by this regime.

Second and third round picks have been wasted on Hollings, Joppru, Wand, Weary, Gaffney, Buchanon (via trade) and Babin (all those picks given up for him).

On the plus side, they picked Davis in the fourth round and were able to swap the Henson sixth round pick for a third round pick.

The first round picks have been good, but they SHOULD have been, because they were so high, and it's hard to mangle those. Having said that, talk to just about any Redskins fan about Casserly and what they're most likely to remember about him is that he wasted the team's 3rd overall pick in the draft on Heath Shuler.

In my opinion, on the whole, Casserly has done a lousy job of building the team through the draft, which he said he was going to do. Everyone is going to make mistakes and have bad luck, but any objective evaluation of the Texans' picks does not reflect well on the organization.

The team has regressed badly and I'm sick of all the excuses. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't see how the team is possibly going to win more than 4 games this year. If the Texans don't, in Year 4, win more games than they did in Year 1, Casserly, Capers and the whole bunch deserve to get FIRED!

Last edited by CowboysTexansFan; 10-06-2005 at 03:19 PM.
CowboysTexansFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #4
texasguy346
Mod Squad
 
texasguy346's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Deer Park, TX
Age: 31
Posts: 7,091
Rep Power: 3792 texasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respectedtexasguy346 is a quality contributor and well respected
Send a message via Yahoo to texasguy346
Default

Great post Exascor. I don't think CC deserves all of the blame he's been given, but he certainly deserves some. One interesting question to ponder is how would this team be different if CC didn't listen to the coaching staff? I'm sure there were players that the coaching staff may have been pushing for that CC wouldn't sign off on, and vice versa. I'm curious what it was about players like Hollings, etc. that made CC feel like they were worth the gamble of taking them. I guess we'll never know for sure.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwallaia View Post
God wants spiritual fruit, not religious nuts.
texasguy346 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #5
CowboysTexansFan
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Age: 47
Posts: 311
Rep Power: 10 CowboysTexansFan is a team player
Default

LOL!

What kind of boss worth his salt listens to his underlings and then blames them when he followed their advice?

If Casserly listened to the coaches and made bad decisions based on their advice, he deserves whatever blame comes his way.
CowboysTexansFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #6
disaacks3
Site Contributor
 
disaacks3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Spring, TX
Section: 116 - Row M
Age: 45
Posts: 10,296
Rep Power: 106068 disaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respecteddisaacks3 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

My only "correction" to make is that the scouts don't work for the Coaching staff, they work for the G.M. They weren't hired by Capers, they were hired by Casserly. So, any "blame" associated with poor scouting goes right to CC, nobody else.
disaacks3 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #7
Texas
Hall of Fame
 
Texas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Clear Lake
Age: 25
Posts: 1,030
Rep Power: 10 Texas is ridin' the pine
Send a message via AIM to Texas
Default

The whole coaching staff including managers and all are to blame!

Also gotta throw it on some of the players
Texas is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
Old 10-06-2005   #8
beerlover
Site Contributor
 
beerlover's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 12,308
Rep Power: 49476 beerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowboysTexansFan
LOL!

What kind of boss worth his salt listens to his underlings and then blames them when he followed their advice?

If Casserly listened to the coaches and made bad decisions based on their advice, he deserves whatever blame comes his way.
thats what I was thinking too, Casserly does not seem like the non-opinionated type I believe its his plan, his players & his decisons. at the same time he also seems like a stand-up kinda guy and will take the heat & explain his moves with McNair in detail (communication with your boss is key & he probably cover's his bases well).
beerlover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #9
beerlover
Site Contributor
 
beerlover's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 12,308
Rep Power: 49476 beerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by disaacks3
My only "correction" to make is that the scouts don't work for the Coaching staff, they work for the G.M. They weren't hired by Capers, they were hired by Casserly. So, any "blame" associated with poor scouting goes right to CC, nobody else.
ditto could not have said it better
beerlover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #10
Honoring Earl 34
Hey Koolaid
 
Honoring Earl 34's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Houston
Age: 51
Posts: 18,826
Rep Power: 144920 Honoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respectedHonoring Earl 34 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Casserly took alot of chances . If they work he's a genius if they don't the fans go on the message boards and want him fired .
Honoring Earl 34 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #11
Marcus
Hall of Fame
 
Marcus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Stafford, Texas
Age: 60
Posts: 7,526
Rep Power: 70276 Marcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respectedMarcus is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowboysTexansFan
LOL!

What kind of boss worth his salt listens to his underlings and then blames them when he followed their advice?

If Casserly listened to the coaches and made bad decisions based on their advice, he deserves whatever blame comes his way.
Ahhh yes, the good ole 'buck stops here' argument. 'Last man off the ship', 'fall on your sword' . . . and on, and on, and on. Tell me something. Do you actually want a GM that doesn't listen to the coaches?

Here's another little catchy cliche. How about '****** rolls downhill'? If Casserly goes out the door, everyone below him goes, too. Ain't no way in hell anyone's going to convince me that Babin was NOT Capers' boy.
Marcus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #12
Texas_Thrill
Hall of Fame
 
Texas_Thrill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: H-Town stomping once again!
Age: 34
Posts: 1,473
Rep Power: 12 Texas_Thrill is on the Pro-Bowl ballotTexas_Thrill is on the Pro-Bowl ballot
Default

I think CC is an excellent GM....that being said he's not doing an excellent job.

Going into last offseason when your #1 priority is to get an offensive line and after the Pace trade falls through you seem to abandon all sense of it and dont draft not one until the 5th round....you shoulder the majority of that blame.

There's enough blame in this situation to go around though. I mean I know this was our season to go young but we went young and terrible.

We've drafted too many PROJECTS imo. Babin, Hollings, Joppru....etc.
I want to see some PLAYMAKERS. .....PROVEN ones for once.
Texas_Thrill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2005   #13
eriadoc
Texan-American
 
eriadoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 18,046
Rep Power: 208658 eriadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respectederiadoc is a quality contributor and well respected
Send a message via ICQ to eriadoc Send a message via Yahoo to eriadoc
Default

Casserly has been credited with choosing eight of the defensive players from the Redskins team that won the Super Bowl. Hence, the question - Did he assemble those players at the request of his coaches? And if so, does he deserve credit for listening to his coach when, in hindsight, he clearly should have? Or is he just a puppet on a string choosing what his coaches want and he gets no credit? Or maybe he picked a few of them and has some knowledge of being a GM in the NFL.

I don't know the answer, but I figured I'd toss that out there.
eriadoc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2005   #14
tsip
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,277
Rep Power: 13 tsip was voted MVPtsip was voted MVPtsip was voted MVP
Default Bo Scaife

This is the All-Big 12 TE from UT that the Texans passed on and the Titans drafted. At UT, he was a good blocker that could catch and run with the ball. Even listed as 3rd team for the Titans, he's caught 9 passes/1 TD vs the 3 passes our TE's have caught.

It's amazing that everyone but the Texans think they need an all-purpose TE! :brickwall
tsip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2006   #15
El Amigo Invisible
All Pro
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 571
Rep Power: 9 El Amigo Invisible is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsip
This is the All-Big 12 TE from UT that the Texans passed on and the Titans drafted. At UT, he was a good blocker that could catch and run with the ball. Even listed as 3rd team for the Titans, he's caught 9 passes/1 TD vs the 3 passes our TE's have caught.

It's amazing that everyone but the Texans think they need an all-purpose TE! :brickwall
We passed on L.Pope too. We will be seeing him twice a year(Jacksonville):brickwall
El Amigo Invisible is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2006   #16
Double Barrel
Modified Simian
 
Double Barrel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Onward, Upward, and back into the Trees
Section: Gridiron, Tx
Age: 47
Posts: 30,448
Rep Power: 281064 Double Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respectedDouble Barrel is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

This thread is six months old. What's up?
__________________
"Football is only a diversion." ~ HOUSTON TEXANS
Double Barrel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2006   #17
D-ReK
RAWWWRR!
 
D-ReK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Avalon
Age: 29
Posts: 3,406
Rep Power: 685 D-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Amigo Invisible
We passed on L.Pope too. We will be seeing him twice a year(Jacksonville):brickwall
Jacksonville took Marcedes Lewis, genius...
__________________
Smoke 'em if you got 'em...
D-ReK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006   #18
El Amigo Invisible
All Pro
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 571
Rep Power: 9 El Amigo Invisible is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by D-ReK
Jacksonville took Marcedes Lewis, genius...
It was a long weekend. Pope went to Arizona but we picked some guy in the fourth from Wisconsin?Brilliant !

Last edited by El Amigo Invisible; 05-01-2006 at 09:56 AM.
El Amigo Invisible is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006   #19
chuckm
Hall of Fame
 
chuckm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Spring
Age: 52
Posts: 1,896
Rep Power: 14 chuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVPchuckm was voted MVP
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Amigo Invisible
It was a long weekend. Pope went to Arizona but we picked some guy in the thrid from Wisconsin?Brilliant !

4th and he's Owen Daniels
__________________
Sabbatical: an extended period away from our daily routine to refresh our minds and spirits
chuckm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006   #20
kingh99
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exascor
I hear a lot of rubblings that Casserly is as much or more to blame than the coaching staff. I'm not a huge Casserly fan but his only downfall IMO has been listening to his coaching staff on players selection/value. I really can't fault him for that. Isn't it his job to bring in players that the coaching staff feels will make the team better? Isn't that why some coaches want to be GMs as well?

We don't know what goes on for sure but there's no way Casserly makes all the picks and signings on his own. He has to have a ton of input from the coaching staff and the scouts. I'd bet that if it was the Raiders that approached us for the Buchanon trade that he would have cleared it with the coaching staff...including what picks we were giving up. You think Casserly just plopped a 2nd rounder on Hollings without the coaches making some kind of push for him? I doubt it. The fact that Casserly has been able to make moves like the Babin trade, Joppru trade down, Henson deal and a few "this year's draft picks for next year's higher draft pick" deals shows he's capable of making deals when needed. Are they all great moves? No way. Are they all Casserly's fault. No way. At least he shows he can get a deal done when needed.

Casserly is ultimately responsible for the entire team, players and coaching staff. I suppose that he should have nixed some of the deals like the Babin and Buchanon trades. If I was a GM and my coaches told me that "Babin will be the pass rusher we've been looking for" and had them compared to probowl caliber players then I might have pulled the trigger on that trade as well. OK-that one I still wouldn't have made but can understand why he would do it. I'll just point back to the fact that the GM must rely of info from the coaches and scouts. If that info is flawed, it could take years to find out. So far Buchanon and Hollings (and to a lesser extent Babin) at the very least seemed to have been the result of flawed info. Joppru was back luck period.

I'm not saying that the entire regime doesn't need to go. Maybe they do. I just think that some people are blaming Casserly for the player moves that he only has a partial part in. Should he be let go along with the coaching staff after this season? What could he do for a new coaching staff? Mr Mcnair has a lot of thinking to do.
So then you remember this dolt gushing about these busts right after his "coups" getting them. And he's still in front of the podium.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ad Management by RedTyger