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Old 10-05-2005   #21
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Originally Posted by infantrycak
I agree both were good players still. And I agree getting overhyped isn't the only sign of leadership. That is why I mentioned sideline demeanor. I happen to sit on the Texans sideline very low and was surprised by how little different players interacted in between series. I particularly noticed (because he was one of my favorite D players by the way) that Jamie came off the field and either stood around with his gatorade or sat down and didn't talk much with anyone particularly not with the younger LBs. In contrast, you could often see a big group of DB's standing together talking. None of us knows what happens in the lockerroom, but from what we could see on the field and at the sideline IMO Sharper was a great player with no significant leadership role.
Good observation, this is a granular issue that needs to be resolved immediately. Just not sure if we have that type of leader(s) on the team or on the staff.
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Old 10-05-2005   #22
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Jamie Sharper: "We need somebody to direct us to wins instead of close games."

Dom Capers this week: "our goal was to get the game into the fourth quarter and find a way to make plays to finish the game off."


I'll let this speak for itself. Some things are just self-evident.
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Old 10-05-2005   #23
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Originally Posted by Porky
Jamie Sharper: "We need somebody to direct us to wins instead of close games."

Dom Capers this week: "our goal was to get the game into the fourth quarter and find a way to make plays to finish the game off."


I'll let this speak for itself. Some things are just self-evident.
He may very well have been right, but does that make him a leader? Not in my book anymore than the twenty five people that have complained and second guessed around the kitchen of every business I have been around--they are right sometimes as well, but they aren't leaders.
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Old 10-05-2005   #24
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Originally Posted by infantrycak
He may very well have been right, but does that make him a leader? Not in my book anymore than the twenty five people that have complained and second guessed around the kitchen of every business I have been around--they are right sometimes as well, but they aren't leaders.
I wasn't neccesarily commenting on his leadership, I was commenting on the correctness of his comments. IMO, it's pretty clear, that Dom plays not to lose, rather than to win. That kind of BS has got to go.
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Old 10-05-2005   #25
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Originally Posted by infantrycak
Really? How is that so obvious other than it is what you thought prior to the season?

Total D
2004 341.1 ypg 19 1st downs pg 43.4% 3rd down conv. 30:01 TOP 4.4 ypc
2005 358.3 ypg 20 1st downs pg 31.4 3rd down conv. 33:58 TOP 4.1 ypc

Looks like they are doing better against the run and a lot better on 3rd down with a blip on total yards and 1st downs because the offense can't stay on the field.
Let's file that under Lies, Damn Lies & Statistics shall we? Our first two games the dogs were obviously called off; it's obvious those stats could have been worse. Did the Steelers even attempt a pass in the 4th quarter? The Bills offense has also gone in the toliet after facing us. These aren't coincidences, we DESERVE to be ranked #32.

Sharper definitely hasn't been "lighting up the charts" in Seattle, but he's not done yet either. I still would've like he & Glenn along for this years ride as Mentors, but it wasn't gonna happen. As for his comments, he an experienced enough Veteran to now when things are broken. Most people chalked up his comments to 'sour grapes'; perhaps he was trying to send a signal to the front office?
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Old 10-05-2005   #26
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Yeah, but if you cannot AFFECT change, it doesn't matter how hard you try on the field, how vocal you are on the sideline, in the lockeroom, in the media, with other guys after hours, etc., etc., etc.

You can have the right answers. You can have the support of your teammates and the trust and the accountability--ALL OF IT--and in the end it won;t do squat if the people in charge (the coaches) go about THEIR jobs in such a way that undercuts your ability and talents.

You're just spinning your wheels as a player on this team, and that's probably what Sharper meant. And that's probably why Sharper just sat and drank Gatorade and didn't make the effort to be the leader that we expect a guy like him to be. It makes me respect Dunta more.

It gets to be very discouraging when you're the one on the front lines and the generals are calling the strategy in such a way that just doesn't produce an outcome the soldiers know is possible.

WWII was won on the beaches of Normandy, and Eisenhower was given the incredible responsibility of coordinating the Allied assault on the beaches. What a weight to carry! But he did it right, and it worked. Those kind of leaders are out there, in terms of caoches, but it just seems like Capers is more of a Big Brother-Big Sister mentor who was hired for his knack of being a solid character guy who would get this team built with class and integrity.

And that was fine a few years ago, but he doesn't have what it takes in today's NFL. Nobody can spin it in such a way that shows Capers is definitely a guy who knows today's NFL. Gibbs' Redskins are undefeated by LUCK, and Parcells' team is showing itself to be not as big a deal as we thought in the first two weeks. It always comes full circle. Always. And it's come full circle for Capers, IMO. Great job on laying a foundation of character, Dom Capers. Thank you for getting us started in the right direction. But...it's time for the level of playcalling and philosopohy to get updated to today's standard.

Coaching and players have to be matched together. Tampa Bay won a Super Bowl with great player-coaching matching. Then, Keyshawn happened. They cut him. They didn't re-sign Lynch. They got rid of Sapp. And look at them now, the chemistry is back. The defense is back. Gruden didn't just stop being a good coach after he won the Super Bowl, only to magically reappear this season. He re-vamped his players to fit that same mentaility he had in the SUper Bowl season, and it's working because HIS SYSTEM and HIS PLAYERS are matched. I just don;t think Carr, DD, and AJ match capers' philosophy. They are explosive, flammable, exciting. Capers is a FB dive kind of guy, and that era is just over. It's over. Even the Steelers know that Bettis can't be expected to grind out 200 yards and run-run-run-run-run-run all game long. They got 'em a guy in Cheeseburger who is capable of throwing the ball, and they mix it up to where the other team's defense doesn;t know what's coming next: Run or Pass? And when you do that, you win games.

But there's no guessing against this Houston team. It's "Play a safety along with the CB over AJ, and plant your LBs in the middle of the field for either a pass rush or key on DD," and you've basically stopped our offense.

There is a ceiling on this team with regards to the coaching, the players, and the system ran by the coaches. The players cannot overcome Capers' "let''s pound out field goals and just keep it close to the end" philosophy.

You play the game to win, according to one head coach. And we're not playing it to win right now. We're playing it to POSSIBLY win if we can keep it close. His philospohy and him stating it publicly should be all that an owner needs to realize that there's a head coach (Capers) who is basically trying to minimize RISK OF FAILURE for the sake of either keeping it close and winning it in the end, or at least not getting blown out for making risky and failing playcalling.

My goodness.

Beat up the other team from the opening kickoff and make THEM keep it close to the end. Why does he do this to us? No wonder players like Sharper make those comments. I would, too.
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Old 10-05-2005   #27
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Originally Posted by infantrycak
He may very well have been right, but does that make him a leader? Not in my book anymore than the twenty five people that have complained and second guessed around the kitchen of every business I have been around--they are right sometimes as well, but they aren't leaders.
ok you've won me over on the leadership thing, Sharper was not a great leader. But he was a solid veteran that gave good commands on the field, that in indeniable. What I thought the problem was, was that we didn't bring in a player that was better then him to compliment him or take the lead. Instead we let him go and replaced him with lesser talent. If we would have brought in Hartwell or Bell or Boulware or Haggans or Trotter or etc... then we would have had a good upgrade of our linebackers. Same goes for the CB situation.

Oh, and by the way are AJ and Walker considered not leaders, they basically said the same thing as Sharper did?
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Old 10-05-2005   #28
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Originally Posted by disaacks3
Let's file that under Lies, Damn Lies & Statistics shall we? Our first two games the dogs were obviously called off; it's obvious those stats could have been worse. Did the Steelers even attempt a pass in the 4th quarter? The Bills offense has also gone in the toliet after facing us. These aren't coincidences, we DESERVE to be ranked #32.
We got blown out of games and coasted on last year as well. What I was basically pointing out were rushing average--that isn't something teams coast on--and 3rd down %--also something teams don't coast on much if any since they are trying to burn out the clock. In any event, the original statement was it is obvious we are missing Sharper's leadership. While I see plenty of things to complain about on D, I don't see where Sharper's leadership is obviously missing. What exactly would be different?
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Old 10-05-2005   #29
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Heck of a post gp...

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Coaching and players have to be matched together. Tampa Bay won a Super Bowl with great player-coaching matching. Then, Keyshawn happened. They cut him. They didn't re-sign Lynch. They got rid of Sapp. And look at them now, the chemistry is back. The defense is back. Gruden didn't just stop being a good coach after he won the Super Bowl, only to magically reappear this season. He re-vamped his players to fit that same mentaility he had in the SUper Bowl season, and it's working because HIS SYSTEM and HIS PLAYERS are matched. I just don;t think Carr, DD, and AJ match capers' philosophy. They are explosive, flammable, exciting. Capers is a FB dive kind of guy, and that era is just over. It's over. Even the Steelers know that Bettis can't be expected to grind out 200 yards and run-run-run-run-run-run all game long. They got 'em a guy in Cheeseburger who is capable of throwing the ball, and they mix it up to where the other team's defense doesn;t know what's coming next: Run or Pass? And when you do that, you win games.
Alas, so we have come full circle it seems with the issue. Question for my sake is - Is Capers not communicating to CC his needs for the system to work? (I think so, as Capers has said that he and CC discuss players to go get during the draft, FA, etc.)

So if they ARE communicating... who really doesn't know what the team needs... Capers or Casserly... or both?
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Old 10-05-2005   #30
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Originally Posted by SESupergenius
What I thought the problem was, was that we didn't bring in a player that was better then him to compliment him or take the lead. Instead we let him go and replaced him with lesser talent. If we would have brought in Hartwell or Bell or Boulware or Haggans or Trotter or etc... then we would have had a good upgrade of our linebackers.
I agree on this. I still haven't seen enough of Greenwood to conclude he can't be a solid player and I understood the money reasons on the Sharper decision. That said, a more proven commodity to replace a proven commodity, especially at the new car price, would have been a better idea.

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Oh, and by the way are AJ and Walker considered not leaders, they basically said the same thing as Sharper did?
When I am commenting about Sharper it is basically on in game observations not his comments. Same thing applies to other players. I haven't focused as much on Walker, but generally I don't notice as much interaction with players and their units on the sidelines as I would like. I would like to see one of the DL talking to the DL, one of the LB's talking to the LB's, etc. Pretty much have only seen that consistantly from the DB's. I'd also like to see the WR's talking to Carr more in between series as well.
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Old 10-05-2005   #31
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QB's more or less talk to the lineman, whereas the WR usually bunch up. They try and pump each other within their own units. I'd love to see more mentoring too (Glenn comes to mind when was doing that with Dunta), but I just don't get that vibe. Wong should be mentoring Babin, does that happen? Wong played on the left side and did a fantastic job, he should be guiding Babin now that he is(was) there. Who is the leader on the defense, I have no idea?
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Old 10-05-2005   #32
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I guess some of the DL are leaders? G-Funk is pretty emotional during the games. (When he isn't hurt)

Most of our D leaders seem like the reserved vets (at most) like Wong, Coleman, etc. Strangely the most vocal leader we seem to have right now is a 2nd year pro, nothing against Robinson but that usually isn't a good thing. We need more players on defense to take control.
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Old 10-05-2005   #33
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Some of this is leadership, some is just excitement, involvement whatever. TO and Moss are prima donnas, but they are over talking to their QB's about what routes they think they can get open on, moves they are going to pull, etc. Of course maybe in the 15" Palmer notebook there wasn't a page for do what the QB and WR see is a weakness in the D. Same thing with other teams and positions. It isn't constant between every series but watch the sidelines for pro-bowlers and they are prowling, talking to their units, other players on D, etc.. More involvement than "well the coaches decided on Monday and Tuesday what we are going to do so let's sit around and wait for our next chance to try to do it." On the other hand, I wonder about coaching that doesn't appear to encourage that kind of thing.
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Old 10-05-2005   #34
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Dunta is the leader.

it's not just his talent, which we know he has loads of.

It's the fire. The passion. The open-field tackles. The look in his eyes. The getting up in P-Buch's grill and not caring what the response might be.

TJ is supposedly the same kind of guy, but I just see him trailing into the TV screen at the end of most plays...gradually slowing down to a walk by the time the pile forms.

I am seriously concerned that TJ might be a weird Ricky Williams-type of player that has social disorders and thinks he's some sort of modern-day warrior but can't produce on the field when needed. If not, then he's just half-timing it and playing a rope-a-dope for some big-time explosion when he's palnning to take over full time for Walker or someone else.

But right now, the guy is a puzzle to me. Maybe I drank the kool-aid on draft day. He needs to show up and be a first-rounder for goodness sakes.
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Old 10-05-2005   #35
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Originally Posted by infantrycak
In any event, the original statement was it is obvious we are missing Sharper's leadership. While I see plenty of things to complain about on D, I don't see where Sharper's leadership is obviously missing. What exactly would be different?
Perhaps nothing would be different, but we'll never know for sure. We are definitely missing leadership ITSELF on Defense, especially as regards our LB corps. When you bench a OLB starter due to non-performance and mistakes, it doesn't bode well, especially when your other OLB has a hard time going a game w/o a bonehead penalty.

I've reached the point where you can't really blame it on the players any more. If you brought in players w/o potential, it's the GM's fault. If you can't make them perform to their potential, it's the Head Coach's fault.
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Old 10-05-2005   #36
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This has been my biggest thing from the beginning, we don't make adjustments. It's cruial in battle to make adjustments. (page 34 Sun Tzu -Art of War) But really, are we making on the field adjustements??
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Old 10-05-2005   #37
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I've reached the point where you can't really blame it on the players any more. If you brought in players w/o potential, it's the GM's fault. If you can't make them perform to their potential, it's the Head Coach's fault.
This is where I am at. We may not have average NFL talent (I think we actually do)--if we don't it is on Casserly's head--if we do it is on the coaches heads. One thing is certain IMO--these coaches are not getting the best out of the players they do have.

As for adjustments, heck in game adjustments seem like a tall order when the coaching staff can't react over an entire season or several seasons.

I'll give you an adjustment a blind hog could make:

AJ's 7 most successful games, where he went for over 100 yds--what WR's were a factor?

AJ 47 rec. 849 yds

Bradford 8 rec. 63 yds
Armstrong 10 rec. 144 yds
Gaffney 17 rec. 151 yds

I don't care if Armstrong and Gaffney are turtles either they are just plain boring the DB's into getting open, they actually have some moves and understanding of zones and/or Carr is comfortable with them, but they are getting receptions when they are in the game or lord forbid actually on the active roster. Coaching conclusion?--let's keep trotting Bradford out there to draw coverage away. Great adjustment there coach.
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Old 10-05-2005   #38
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i dont know about that. weve had a slight case of growing pains but i still believe we will be just fine, if not better, without both of the defensive "leaders"


my god! we're 0 and 3 and will finish with less than 4 wins. Are you capers OR casserley? get rid of all the leaders and keep the scrubs mentality!!!

people like you scare me because you probably have offspring, vote, drive a car and owna firearm... :brickwall
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Old 10-05-2005   #39
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Sharper won a superbowl with the Ravens. I think that in itself causes younger players to respect you and look up to you regardless if you ever utter a word.

Glenn was a probowl player that had plenty of knowledge to pass on. I think things would have been different if the Texans would have drafted a rookie cb for him to mentor like he did with Dunta.
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Old 10-07-2005   #40
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Originally Posted by touttail
"I was done with losing that first season," linebacker Jamie Sharper said. "No more positives. You have to produce. Somebody has to show us the way. There's a light at the end of the tunnel, but who's going to direct us there? We need somebody to direct us to wins instead of close games."

Does Sharper mean a player? Different coaches? Who?

"I don't know," he said.

Jamie is not a soothsayer. He knew there was a problem. Well, a year later, we still have a problem. Guess Jamie knew what he was talking about.

Please bring Jamie back------I have 3 of his jerseys---LOL!

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LOL I do, too. And I'm reminded EVERYTIME I wear them: *um, Shell? You KNOW he's in Seattle now, right?*

DUH.

And, for the record...when they traded him, our defensive ranking dropped from 23rd to 28th.

BAD MOVE, people!!!
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