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Old 09-09-2005   #21
gr8slayer
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Nate Clements

4.33 in the 40-yard dash...38-inch vertical jump.

http://www.jsonline.com/packer/rev/a...teclements.asp

Andre Johnson

4.3 in the 40-yard dash 41-inch vertical jump

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/johnson_andre

So explain to me again, where the huge difference is?

One is six feet tall and one is six two, who cares?
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Old 09-09-2005   #22
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Clements rated number four CB in the league by Yahoo.

NO. 4 NATE CLEMENTS (Buffalo Bills)
Strengths: Excels in man coverage. Is physical, aggressive and confident. Will smother receivers at the line and is great at taking them out of their routes early. Can turn and run without losing much in transition; has explosive speed and can make up for mistakes. Has excellent closing burst when the ball is in the air. Has surprising change-of-direction skills. Has tremendous ball skills, including exceptional hands and leaping ability. Is a superb return specialist and a threat with the ball.
Weaknesses: Must improve his concentration and recognition skills. Loses focus at times and does not pay attention to detail. Relies on his physical tools and speed too much. Takes too many chances.
Bottom line: If Clements shows focus and cuts down on his mental lapses, he could become one of the league's top two corners. Grade: 8.4

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slu...=tsn&type=lgns
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Old 09-09-2005   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gr8slayer
You must not have watched much of that game. There happened to be five Bills in the area when that happened and one of them was not Nate, it was actually Coy Wire who got beat on coverage. Wire is a back up SS who was only in the game because of an injury to Lawyer Milloy, Preilou was in on the other side because of an injury to Vincent. This game both Milloy and Vincent are perfect. There is a reason why Clements is about to become the highest paid CB in the league.
my bad.
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/...26/1007/SPORTS
Your right Jimmy Johnson muscled the ball away from Nate.
Their rookie out jumped three players - safeties Izell Reese and Coy Wire along with linebacker Takeo Spikes.

But expect to see Andre get a jump ball in the corner. The monster paycheck Clements is going to get(which he deserves) isn't going to save him.

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Old 09-09-2005   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gr8slayer
Nate Clements

4.33 in the 40-yard dash...38-inch vertical jump.

http://www.jsonline.com/packer/rev/a...teclements.asp

Andre Johnson

4.3 in the 40-yard dash 41-inch vertical jump

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/johnson_andre

So explain to me again, where the huge difference is?

One is six feet tall and one is six two, who cares?
Andre Johnson is 6 foot - 3 inches
Nate Clements is 5 foot-11 1/4 inches

add the height difference to the vertical jump difference and you get....

7 inches higher jump. That is freakin huge.
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Old 09-09-2005   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LBC_Justin
my bad.
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/...26/1007/SPORTS
Your right Jimmy Johnson muscled the ball away from Nate.
Their rookie out jumped three players - safeties Izell Reese and Coy Wire along with linebacker Takeo Spikes.

But expect to see Andre get a jump ball in the corner. The monster paycheck Clements is going to get(which he deserves) isn't going to save him.

It is impossible to be perfect on every play. If you want to talk about the Texans players and bad play we would be here all night. Keep in mind that you have done nothing to earn the respect of any team in the NFL.
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Old 09-09-2005   #26
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Originally Posted by gr8slayer
It is impossible to be perfect on every play. If you want to talk about the Texans players and bad play we would be here all night. Keep in mind that you have done nothing to earn the respect of any team in the NFL.
I wasn't blaming him. He made it mistake it happens to the best. But the point is even a highly skilled cover corner can't cover a guy on a jump ball if the reciever is his much taller,and has a higher vertical (unless there is pass interference)
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Old 09-09-2005   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LBC_Justin
Andre Johnson is 6 foot - 3 inches
Nate Clements is 5 foot-11 1/4 inches

add the height difference to the vertical jump difference and you get....

7 1/2 inches higher jump. That is freakin huge.
Funny, he is 6'2 on some web pages and 6'3 on others. BTW, this wont be the first big WR Nate has faced. Larry Fitzgerald was no problem, Randy Moss (alittle injured sure but still Randy) did poorly. Justin McCarens (SP?) not the smallest WR in the league.

I might also add that Johnson did poorly against poor Secondaries.

Indy x2

Tenn x2

Chicago

Jax (second game)

Cleveland
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Old 09-09-2005   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro
If I were Palmer I would throw right at him on some short routes and have AJ just barrell into him.

I think that would set a nice tone for the season.

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/...509080338/1021

Clements HT: 6-0, WT: 209
Johnson HT: 6-2, WT: 221
not so fast, there's more to it than size...the receiver's head, arms, and eyes are looking back for the ball, but the defender has the luxury of playing a little soft if he wants to, giving a little cushion and timing the hit with the delivery of the ball in an attempt to catch the receiver in a vulnerable position...not a pretty sight
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Old 09-09-2005   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LBC_Justin
I wasn't blaming him. He made it mistake it happens to the best. But the point is even a highly skilled cover corner can't cover a guy on a jump ball if the reciever is his much taller,and has a higher vertical (unless there is pass interference)
Im curious to know what you think of the person actually throwing the ball to Johnson?

Do you honestly think that he is going to have time to let Johnson get open? We were the number two Defense in the NFL (number three the year before), we were third in the NFL in sacks, number one for scoring on Defense, we were amongst the leaders when it came to yards, we had the number one ST's.

How are you going into this game this confident about your Offense against the number two defense?
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Old 09-09-2005   #30
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Originally Posted by gr8slayer
All smack talk aside I relaly want to know why you all think you are going to have this huge rushing game against us? We were amongst the best in the league last year when it came to yards against the rush. Just give me a valid reason why, make me understand what makes you so different from the other rushing teams we have faced.

Last year, last year, last year. Big deal about last year. The day after tomorrow the 2005 football season starts for us (and you) and while I'm impressed with what your team did last year I'm not going to start worrying about you stopping Domanick Davis until you do it this year.

I am not about to hope for an injury to anyone on your team (this is merely an example I'm throwing out here) but in one play a guy can go down (Say for instance Seth Payne of the Texans going down in 2003) and your run-stuffing defense can turn into a turnstile defense in an instant. Players don't always come back the next year playing like they did the year before (Say for instance Gary Walker playing 2002 like a man posessed and then being almost non-existent in 2003 because of nagging injuries). You had a great defense in 2004 but it doesn't mean you automatically get one in 2005 even if you return the exact same players.

Simple enough to understand?

What I want to know is why a Bills fan has so much trouble comprehending opening day optimism on another teams board. I know the past few years haven't been anything spectacular for you guys but I find it hard to believe that you don't remember what it's like to feel really good about your teams chances prior to the season starting.

Dude I believe in our guys and I think they're ready for a breakout kind of season starting at your house at your teams expense. Come back and laugh at me if I'm wrong (I'll be here) but also come back and acknowledge it if I'm right too.
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Old 09-09-2005   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LBC_Justin
Your right Jimmy Johnson muscled the ball away from Nate.
Wrong again. Clements had perfect coverage and wen't for the pick instead of knocking it down. The ball went through his hands and they picked up the fourth down. A mental lapse for sure, but Clements is as strong as almost every WR in the league.
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Old 09-09-2005   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hervoyel
Last year, last year, last year. Big deal about last year. The day after tomorrow the 2005 football season starts for us (and you) and while I'm impressed with what your team did last year I'm not going to start worrying about you stopping Domanick Davis until you do it this year.

I am not about to hope for an injury to anyone on your team (this is merely an example I'm throwing out here) but in one play a guy can go down (Say for instance Seth Payne of the Texans going down in 2003) and your run-stuffing defense can turn into a turnstile defense in an instant. Players don't always come back the next year playing like they did the year before (Say for instance Gary Walker playing 2002 like a man posessed and then being almost non-existent in 2003 because of nagging injuries). You had a great defense in 2004 but it doesn't mean you automatically get one in 2005 even if you return the exact same players.

Simple enough to understand?

What I want to know is why a Bills fan has so much trouble comprehending opening day optimism on another teams board. I know the past few years haven't been anything spectacular for you guys but I find it hard to believe that you don't remember what it's like to feel really good about your teams chances prior to the season starting.

Dude I believe in our guys and I think they're ready for a breakout kind of season starting at your house at your teams expense. Come back and laugh at me if I'm wrong (I'll be here) but also come back and acknowledge it if I'm right too.
We were also the number three Defense the year before so we reserve the right to be more than confident that our Defense can get the job done.

I will be back here to either feed the crow or eat it.

And if we lose Ill wish you a great season and accept that you were the better team on that day. If we win Ill still come back and wish you a great season knowing that we were the better team that day.
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Old 09-09-2005   #33
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LBC I must know who this Jimmy Johnson guy you speak of is? I dont recall him being with the Jags last year. Do you mean Jimmy Smith? Not trying to be a smart ***, just wondering cause I seriously dont remember a Jimmy Johnson.
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Old 09-09-2005   #34
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Oh yeah and gr8slayer, once this week is over would you guys please beat down the Patriots for everyone in this country who's thinking "That was great really but if I hear the words "Belichick" and "Genius" together in the same sentence one more time I'm going puke.

Thanks for that in advance.

It's like "Ok, we get it. Dynasty. Cool. Thank You, That was an entertaining few years. Yes, please , let's move along now"

Know what I mean?
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Old 09-09-2005   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hervoyel
Oh yeah and gr8slayer, once this week is over would you guys please beat down the Patriots for everyone in this country who's thinking "That was great really but if I hear the words "Belichick" and "Genius" together in the same sentence one more time I'm going puke.

Thanks for that in advance.
Oh man trust me, we want blood when we face the Patriots any year. Hoping for no injuries is off when that week comes.
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Old 09-09-2005   #36
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Originally Posted by gr8slayer
Oh man trust me, we want blood when we face the Patriots any year. Hoping for no injuries is off when that week comes.
LOL, please just blitz that freakin Brady every play, I'd concede a few points in the first half to knock him out of the game
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Old 09-09-2005   #37
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LOL, please just blitz that freakin Brady every play, I'd concede a few points in the first half to knock him out of the game
I would love to see TKO get a free shot at pretty boy. Man that would be a beautiful thing.
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Old 09-09-2005   #38
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grrrrrrr..... I know Im going to get some flak for this but do you all realize that AJ only has ten TD's in his career? Thats not good for a "big WR play WR." Hell our rookie (Lee Evans) who no one in the NFL seems to know had nine last year alone.

IF I was going only by number I would say AJ is another Keyshawn, all yards no TD's. Anyway, just found those stats interesting and Keyshawn was the first person to come to mind.
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Old 09-09-2005   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gr8slayer
Funny, he is 6'2 on some web pages and 6'3 on others. BTW, this wont be the first big WR Nate has faced. Larry Fitzgerald was no problem, Randy Moss (alittle injured sure but still Randy) did poorly. Justin McCarens (SP?) not the smallest WR in the league.

I might also add that Johnson did poorly against poor Secondaries.

Indy x2

Tenn x2

Chicago

Jax (second game)

Cleveland
Everyone in the AFC South has bad secondary stats. Want to know why? We have to face Peyton Manning twice a year and almost every high powered offense in the league. Not good for your pass protection stats.

You mentioned the AFC South teams as having bad secondary stats.
The Texans(and most of the AFC South) had to played the following teams:
Colts (Twice) - #1 offense in the league
Chiefs - #2 offense in the league
Chargers - #3 offense in the league
Packers - #5 offense in the league
Vikings - #6 offense in the league
Broncos #9 offense in the league

The AFC South has some great DBs - last year the Titans had - Samari Rolle, Andre Rolle (Hardly Poor Secondary)
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Old 09-09-2005   #40
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Originally Posted by LBC_Justin
Everyone in the AFC South has bad secondary stats. Want to know why? We have to face Peyton Manning twice a year and almost every high powered offense in the league. Not good for your pass protection stats.

You mentioned the AFC South teams as having bad secondary stats.
The Texans(and most of the AFC South) had to played the following teams:
Colts (Twice) - #1 offense in the league
Chiefs - #2 offense in the league
Chargers - #3 offense in the league
Packers - #5 offense in the league
Vikings - #6 offense in the league
Broncos #9 offense in the league

The AFC South has some great DBs - last year the Titans had - Samari Rolle, Andre Rolle (Hardly Poor Secondary)
I was basing my statement on a game by game basis for Andre, not on how good the Offenses in the South were.
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