Chronicle story on Vince Young

[nunusguy]

""He's as feared with the ball in his hands as any quarterback in the history of the game," Kiper said. "He's a righthanded Michael Vick. Had there been no Michael Vick, Vince Young would have been the greatest multidimensional quarterback to ever play college football."
http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/sports/3271782
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Sounds like Mel likes him. I dunno...who he play for and what position he plays in the NFL remains a mystery, but if Matt Jones is a first rounder I'm confidant VY goes somewhere in the top round, just a question of how high.

[Huge]

It depends on what Young wants to do. If he wants to leave early but refuses to play WR, then he's not going in the first round. If he stays for his senior season and improves his passing, he could be taken in the first round as a QB in '07.

[Texas_Thrill]

If he improves his passing he will be the FIRST player taken period.

[Huge]

He would have to improve his passing by leaps and bounds for a team to take him as a QB over Matt Leinart.

Unless you're talking the '07 draft. That'd give him two more years to work on his passing. I still don't think that's enough time to go #1 overall but it'd certainly help his stock.

[El Tejano]

He needs to concentrate on becoming a better passer because alot of teams will be looking for QBs by the time he is ready for the draft.

[BuffSoldier]

OK, I will tell you right now that I am a little bias on the situation because I yahe met VY personally, and my best friend of 10 years, Keith Young, is VY's first cousin, so I have met him personally 4 or 5 times.

But my opinion is, VY has the talent to be the top player taken in the draft period. Vince has shown a rocket arm, but has questionable accuracy and decision making, but so did Vick, and Vince will have the best o-line in the NCAA this year and tons of time, a good RB in selvin young and a legitimate deep threat in Jordan Shipley, who has, as ive heard, had a very good spring. He will also have an improved Limas Sweed who can also stretch the field and make plays underneath. VY has the ability and he has so much set up around him for success, now it all boils down to will he execute.



But I wish he had Roy BJ and Sloan back.

[TexansCanes]

no one has ever questioned this guy's talent, but he isn't going to be the first player taken this year, this is the nfl not the nba. i have alwaysed liked vince (even though he went to ut) and have followed him since his days at madison. vick might not have been a great passer but he was able to get it done when it was needed and didn't make many mistakes, which is what i think vince needs to improve on along with accuracy. he showed some of that in the rose bowl, plus his receivers dropped a few. we will see how well he has improved early this year when they play osu, which should be a great game, i think it will be a defensive struggle.

[kbourda]

Originally Posted by TexansCanes

no one has ever questioned this guy's talent, but he isn't going to be the first player taken this year, this is the nfl not the nba. i have alwaysed liked vince (even though he went to ut) and have followed him since his days at madison. vick might not have been a great passer but he was able to get it done when it was needed and didn't make many mistakes, which is what i think vince needs to improve on along with accuracy. he showed some of that in the rose bowl, plus his receivers dropped a few. we will see how well he has improved early this year when they play osu, which should be a great game, i think it will be a defensive struggle.

I'll put it to you like this, if Young has a great season, he will be the 1st pick. Correct me if i'm wrong but didn't he complete 60% of his passes last year? But this is a very telling year for him and the Longhorns. If he goes to the Horseshoe and pulls a win out of his arm and turn around and beat Oklahoma, look out.

[kbourda]

Originally Posted by Huge

He would have to improve his passing by leaps and bounds for a team to take him as a QB over Matt Leinart.

Unless you're talking the '07 draft. That'd give him two more years to work on his passing. I still don't think that's enough time to go #1 overall but it'd certainly help his stock.

This is just me talking but i'd take him over Leinart right now.

[TexansCanes]

Originally Posted by kbourda

This is just me talking but i'd take him over Leinart right now.

yeah it is just you talking, especially if leinart wins another title this year. not that matt is a can't miss prospect, but more so than vince. the only way he can be the number one player is as qb and i don't think he has shown enough to be a qb in the nfl. yeah he has completed 60% but that doesn't always tell the whole story. he needs to cut down on the mistakes and stay in the pocket. he had a great rose bowl but a lot of plays were just a drop back and run situation.

[Huge]

Originally Posted by BuffSoldier

OK, I will tell you right now that I am a little bias on the situation because I yahe met VY personally, and my best friend of 10 years, Keith Young, is VY's first cousin, so I have met him personally 4 or 5 times.

But my opinion is, VY has the talent to be the top player taken in the draft period. Vince has shown a rocket arm, but has questionable accuracy and decision making, but so did Vick, and Vince will have the best o-line in the NCAA this year and tons of time, a good RB in selvin young and a legitimate deep threat in Jordan Shipley, who has, as ive heard, had a very good spring. He will also have an improved Limas Sweed who can also stretch the field and make plays underneath. VY has the ability and he has so much set up around him for success, now it all boils down to will he execute.

I agree he has the talent to be the top player in the draft. But he's not going to be. Teams don't take QBs just because they can run the ball better than any other QB (Vince in nowhere near Vick's league in terms of passing).

And his accuracy isn't questionable, it's bad.

Originally Posted by kbourda

I'll put it to you like this, if Young has a great season, he will be the 1st pick. Correct me if i'm wrong but didn't he complete 60% of his passes last year? But this is a very telling year for him and the Longhorns. If he goes to the Horseshoe and pulls a win out of his arm and turn around and beat Oklahoma, look out.

Define a "great" season.

His completion percentage is not a telling sign of his accuracy. Especially not in the offense Texas runs where so many passes are short dump-offs. If you want, I've got a clip of Texas' last drive before the 2nd half against Oklahoma State this past season. I believe Vince was 5-6 passing on that drive. But none of his passes were on target. Sure the WRs/TEs caught the ball but all of them either had to stop their route or reach back to catch it. Shoot me a PM with your email address and I'll send it over to you. Believe me when I say that pro scouts look at a helluvalot more than just completion percentage when they're looking at a QBs ability to put the ball where it should be.

Originally Posted by kbourda

This is just me talking but i'd take him over Leinart right now.

Well this is just me talking, but there's no way in hell you'd ever be the GM of my NFL team.

[BringItOn]

Originally Posted by Huge

I agree he has the talent to be the top player in the draft. But he's not going to be. Teams don't take QBs just because they can run the ball better than any other QB (Vince in nowhere near Vick's league in terms of passing).

To not be in Vick's 'league' when it comes to passing could be misconstrued as a compliment. The Falcons had the 3rd worst passing offense last season. Yes, they can run the heck out of the ball (and why throw when you can run), but Vick has not proven himself to even be an average passer yet.

I completely agree that Young's accuracy is mediocre. Further, while he can throw the ball deep, I've really not seen him throw the ball hard. Vick didn't have a great reputation himself, though. I remember speculation when Vick was drafted that he might not be chosen to play QB which shows how little confidence people had in his passing ability.

Barring injury, I think best case Young gets a high draft pick as QB, worst case a not quite-as-high pick as a WR.

[Youngstown Colt]

Originally Posted by BringItOn

To not be in Vick's 'league' when it comes to passing could be misconstrued as a compliment. The Falcons had the 3rd worst passing offense last season. Yes, they can run the heck out of the ball (and why throw when you can run), but Vick has not proven himself to even be an average passer yet.

But in college, he was far better than Vince, and that's all that mattered.

[Huge]

Yeah, I should've worded differently. Vince is not in Vick's league throwing the ball since neither of them should be considered "passers".

He doesn't have Vick's arm strength (not saying much given Vick's ample arm strength). And his accuracy is not as good as Vick's either (saying quite a bit given Vick's lack of much).

[Panther5407]

Originally Posted by kbourda

I'll put it to you like this, if Young has a great season, he will be the 1st pick. Correct me if i'm wrong but didn't he complete 60% of his passes last year? But this is a very telling year for him and the Longhorns. If he goes to the Horseshoe and pulls a win out of his arm and turn around and beat Oklahoma, look out.

Lets look at that 60%, out of the 148 completions vince had, 88 of those passes where to none wr people (TE, RB, FB) or in other word alot of dump off passes. That means 60% of his completions where not to a reciever. vince gets alot of his completions off of boot leg passes because of people worrying more about his legs than than his arm. He has so much talent but to become the #1 overall pick, he has to have some sort of pocket pressence which should be easy under one of the top rated lines in the nation.

[kbourda]

Originally Posted by Panther5407

Lets look at that 60%, out of the 148 completions vince had, 88 of those passes where to none wr people (TE, RB, FB) or in other word alot of dump off passes. That means 60% of his completions where not to a reciever. vince gets alot of his completions off of boot leg passes because of people worrying more about his legs than than his arm. He has so much talent but to become the #1 overall pick, he has to have some sort of pocket pressence which should be easy under one of the top rated lines in the nation.

Since when has moving the ball "by any means necessary" a bad thing. I see Tom Brady do it all the time. But I guess Young should be placed on a higher bar though, right? And furthermore Phil Simms, who has the highest completion percentage in SB history, for his whole career nickle and dimed his way down the field. By the way, much like Tom Brady does. I know the sexy thing is to chuck 50 yard bombs for TD's. But the way I see it it's all about wins, matter not how it gets done.

[Panther5407]

Originally Posted by kbourda

Since when has moving the ball "by any means necessary" a bad thing. I see Tom Brady do it all the time. But I guess Young should be placed on a higher bar though, right? And furthermore Phil Simms, who has the highest completion percentage in SB history, for his whole career nickle and dimed his way down the field. By the way, much like Tom Brady does. I know the sexy thing is to chuck 50 yard bombs for TD's. But the way I see it it's all about wins, matter not how it gets done.

I thought we were talking about vince's passing ability, not wins.

[Huge]

Racking up a lot of wins in college sure didn't do much for the NFL careers of Scott Frost and Eric Crouch.

[kbourda]

Originally Posted by Huge

Racking up a lot of wins in college sure didn't do much for the NFL careers of Scott Frost and Eric Crouch.

Neither did Klingler, Ware, Detmer (take your pick), Toretta, Grossman, Leaf, Huepel, White, Richardson, Kosar, Testaverde, Wuerfel, and on and on.

[Huge]

So your point ("But the way I see it it's all about wins, matter not how it gets done.") is relevant, how?