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Old 03-14-2014   #41
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

I'm ok with re-signing Graham now that we know he'll be used as an H-back. He's below average in blocking and is penalized way too much.
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Old 03-14-2014   #42
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

Value of a TE can come with many faces.

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When the Carolina Panthers take the field against the San Francisco 49ers on Sunday, there will be a lot of talent on the field at the tight end position. Greg Olsen is one of the best receiving tight ends in the league and Vernon Davis is probably the best all-around player at the position outside of Rob Gronkowski. Those players are great, but the Panthers’ Ben Hartsock may be the most vital to the outcome of the game.

Hartsock hasn’t caught a pass all season—he hasn’t even been targeted, actually—but Pro Football Focus has graded him as the top tight end in the league, based largely (OK, entirely) on his run-blocking. That might be more of a condemnation of the site’s grading system than a commendation for Hartsock, but the former Ohio State Buckeye has been a key to the Panthers’ running game in 2013.

Hartsock has played 222 snaps this season and gone out for a pass only 35 times. Of his 187 snaps spent blocking, only 41 have been on passing plays (some of which were undoubtedly packaged plays with a run/pass option), so when Number 84 is in the game for the Panthers, it’s usually a run.

But Hartsock is so good at run-blocking, it doesn’t matter that the defense knows it’s coming.
link

Could be that over the years, our RBs have been dropping like flies because we've never really specifically had a strong blocking TE.
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Old 03-14-2014   #43
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

I should have specified run blocking in my above post...

PFF 2014 Free Agency Deal Grader
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0.0: Color us indifferent

Garrett Graham (TE) to HST: 3-year, $11.25m with $4.5m guaranteed

There are two seasons with Graham playing a representative number of snaps for the Texans and they mirror the team’s fortunes. In 2012 he played well above average but his most recent body of work was like that of the team – dodgy at best. Last year Graham’s biggest issue was run blocking, earning a -7.8 grade over the season. The Texans haven’t committed huge money to him but will be hoping that he can bounce back along with the team in 2014.
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Old 03-14-2014   #44
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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Originally Posted by HOU-TEX View Post
I'm ok with re-signing Graham now that we know he'll be used as an H-back. He's below average in blocking and is penalized way too much.
Penalties commonly come to factor in when players try to overcompensate their lack of strength or abilities.
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Old 03-14-2014   #45
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

So that makes Griffin and Graham on our roster right? I think Pettigrew would be a grea addition. We need an inside blocker who can help the run game and be great in the redzone. I feel our team missed Dreesen in those areas.
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Old 03-14-2014   #46
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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Originally Posted by El Tejano View Post
So that makes Griffin and Graham on our roster right? I think Pettigrew would be a grea addition. We need an inside blocker who can help the run game and be great in the redzone. I feel our team missed Dreesen in those areas.
He already resigned with the Lions
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Old 03-14-2014   #47
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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He already resigned with the Lions
Thanks goodness. They call him Pettidrop in Detroit.
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Old 03-14-2014   #48
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

I get that we are all bored cause there is nothing to talk about, but I feel like I've said enough on this issue and will now bow out.

I respect all of your opinions and if you believe Ben Hartsock is as valuable as PFFs metrics makes him out to be I respect that.

Maybe we will meet again down the road in another thread.

Garrett Graham 4 President!
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Old 03-14-2014   #49
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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Originally Posted by El Tejano View Post
So that makes Griffin and Graham on our roster right? I think Pettigrew would be a grea addition. We need an inside blocker who can help the run game and be great in the redzone. I feel our team missed Dreesen in those areas.
We've got:
  • Zach Potter
  • Brad Smelley
  • Phillip Supernaw
  • Ryan Griffin
  • Garrett Graham
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Old 03-14-2014   #50
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
We've got:
  • Zach Potter
  • Brad Smelley
  • Phillip Supernaw
  • Ryan Griffin
  • Garrett Graham
I would expect Graham and Smelley to man the H-Back position with Graham also sliding out in the slot sometimes and Smelley playing some FB. Potter is your blocking TE and Griffin is your in-line TE. Supernaw will compete with a draft pick or vet for a roster spot to be Griffin's backup.
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Old 03-14-2014   #51
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

Graham is just a guy and according to PFF ranks close to the bottom of all TE's in 2013. Graham's new salary replaces 80% of what Daniels salary would've been. That's for the next 3 years. I'm not sure Graham is 80% the player. I'd would've preferred if the Texans had kept Daniels for another year, drafting ASJ or Amaro and then reaping the full amount of salary cap space of Daniel's salary with his departure in 2015.
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Old 03-14-2014   #52
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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Graham is just a guy and according to PFF ranks close to the bottom of all TE's in 2013. Graham's new salary replaces 80% of what Daniels salary would've been. That's for the next 3 years. I'm not sure Graham is 80% the player. I'd would've preferred if the Texans had kept Daniels for another year, drafting ASJ or Amaro and then reaping the full amount of salary cap space of Daniel's salary with his departure in 2015.
This is what is at least MY problem with this contract is. We didn't get significant cap savings or dramatically upgrade what OD brought to the table vs this signing. I don't really care what PFF says much as on the field.

Not really sure if this is a Smith call or O'Brien. If Smith, i'm becoming more inclined to say BOTH Smith and Kubiak were big problems in talent evaluation and cap management.
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Old 03-14-2014   #53
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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Graham is just a guy and according to PFF ranks close to the bottom of all TE's in 2013. Graham's new salary replaces 80% of what Daniels salary would've been. That's for the next 3 years. I'm not sure Graham is 80% the player. I'd would've preferred if the Texans had kept Daniels for another year, drafting ASJ or Amaro and then reaping the full amount of salary cap space of Daniel's salary with his departure in 2015.
I agree. Would much rather have Daniel than Graham next year. I also don't see why we cut him if we weren't planning on chasing any FA's. Once Schaub is gone, we will have plenty of cap to sign filler FA's and draft picks.
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Old 03-14-2014   #54
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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I agree. Would much rather have Daniel than Graham next year. I also don't see why we cut him if we weren't planning on chasing any FA's. Once Schaub is gone, we will have plenty of cap to sign filler FA's and draft picks.
I couldn't think of any reason to cut OD, unless we were planning to bring Schaub back next season.


Then Doc posted that OD failed his physical... hopefully that's all there is to it & one has no bearing on the other.
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Old 03-14-2014   #55
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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I couldn't think of any reason to cut OD, unless we were planning to bring Schaub back next season.


Then Doc posted that OD failed his physical... hopefully that's all there is to it & one has no bearing on the other.
That's true. I forgot that he failed it.
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Old 03-14-2014   #56
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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I would expect Graham and Smelley to man the H-Back position with Graham also sliding out in the slot sometimes and Smelley playing some FB. Potter is your blocking TE and Griffin is your in-line TE. Supernaw will compete with a draft pick or vet for a roster spot to be Griffin's backup.
I have a difficult time seeing Graham fitting the H-back role.........and even a more difficult time seeing any characteristics his has shown in the past to make a decent slot receiver.
From a 2012 Profootbalfocus piece:
Shaping the Slot
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Old 03-14-2014   #57
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
I have a difficult time seeing Graham fitting the H-back role.........and even a more difficult time seeing any characteristics his has shown in the past to make a decent slot receiver.
From a 2012 Profootbalfocus piece:
Shaping the Slot
I agree. Athletically, I like him as an H-Back. However, his run blocking is awful and negates his receiving ability in that role. As for being in the slot, it's all about matchups. Line him up in the backfield and motion him into the slot against a LB. NE did it with Hernandez all the time.

He did say that he was going to be an H-Back when he re-signed and that's how O'Brien has utilized his 'move TE' in the past.
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Old 03-14-2014   #58
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

Graham's deal is basically a 1 year deal with little dead money in 2015. If something changes we can get out from it after this season just the same as if we had OD still on the roster. And still saved money overall between releasing OD and signing Graham.

If Graham posts a great season then hey he is a great deal.

Win win in my book from the contract standpoint.
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Old 03-14-2014   #59
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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Originally Posted by Texian View Post
Graham is just a guy and according to PFF ranks close to the bottom of all TE's in 2013. Graham's new salary replaces 80% of what Daniels salary would've been. That's for the next 3 years. I'm not sure Graham is 80% the player. I'd would've preferred if the Texans had kept Daniels for another year, drafting ASJ or Amaro and then reaping the full amount of salary cap space of Daniel's salary with his departure in 2015.
Th thing about Daniels is staying on the field. He just hit IR too often for what he was payed. Cushing needs a full season for the same reason. He's been on IR most of the last two seasons and he's got a huge contract. He's safe for now, but will be a prime candidate to be cut in 2016 without playing time.
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Old 03-14-2014   #60
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Default Re: Garrett Graham wants to remain with Texans: (*UPDATE/SIGNED 03/13/14*)

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I agree. Athletically, I like him as an H-Back. However, his run blocking is awful and negates his receiving ability in that role. As for being in the slot, it's all about matchups. Line him up in the backfield and motion him into the slot against a LB. NE did it with Hernandez all the time.

He did say that he was going to be an H-Back when he re-signed and that's how O'Brien has utilized his 'move TE' in the past.
He's not quick enough for the slot. When you get a guy that is too fast for a linebacker to cover one-on-one and too big for defensive backs to control, you've got a player that you want in more than just the traditional tight end's role, especially since defenses align to personnel. I don't see Graham fulfilling that role any better. I guess we'll see if OB can pull off what I would consider a small miracle.
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