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Old 04-18-2014   #2521
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by bah007 View Post
So it's not fair to think that his behavior will stay the same and he will continue to look out for #1 but it is fair to assume that he is just going to up and change that behavior when he gets drafted? What about his contract? The second contract is bigger than the rookie contract. He's going to have to protect himself if he doesn't want to blow that knee and get lowballed on that big contract.

The reason coaches protect players is because the players will not protect themselves. They will go 100% for their teammates when they are on the field. The only way to protect them is to get them off of the field. If a guy is only worried about his pro future then that is a huge red flag to me. That says he is a me first guy and will always put himself above his team.

As a player, there is nothing worse than looking at the guy next to you and not knowing if you can count on him or not, regardless of how much physical talent he has.

Players get injured all the time in every way imaginable. Half assing it out there isn't going to protect you from something you can't see coming.

You can tell the people judging to suck it if you wish. But with millions of dollars on the line, the people making the decisions are judging everything. If they don't care about this then it's obviously no big deal. If they do care, then Clowney only has himself to blame.
Not true, he is not going to be offered a large second contract unless he performs on his rookie contract. That was my point. He was not going to be picked any higher than #1, so what was the point of risking injury by going all out in his final season of college?

Obviously it is not bothering the people who make those decisions, because no matter who might be picking #1 overall this year had it not been the Texans, they too would be selecting Clowney so it seems like the only people who have issues are those who like other players better, but from my point of view, that is not anyone in the pro's. If the Texans fail to draft Clowney, the Rams will get all kinds of trade offers for the chance to get him, on that you can bet.

While there are no guarantees you will not get injured going half speed, it certainly reduces the chances. If I drive to work every day at 120MPH, what are the chances I am going to have an accident as opposed to if I drive at half that speed? Nothing in life is guaranteed, but you can mitigate much of the risk by taking precautions.

If Clowney were the kind of guy you describe him as, I am sure his teammates would shun him, and surely there would be rumors of players saying he is selfish and cannot be counted on, but that is not the case, so you are injecting that in an attempt to devalue the player you do not want drafted. In fact all of the issues that are supposed to be Clowney's warts seem to be more propaganda than facts, and our own head coach said he has no issues with Clowney's work ethics.
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Old 04-18-2014   #2522
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

Clowney, Mingo, Aldon Smith


How do you rank those three players?
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Old 04-18-2014   #2523
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by powda View Post
Here however pundits will continue to act as if their sh*t dont stink. Plenty of people here moonlight as experts. Truth is many don't watch film or know thing one about any of these guys. So why fight tooth and nail about it? I have my favorites but I dont pretend to be an expert.
It's all good.... we're just hanging, having fun. Being guys.
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Old 04-18-2014   #2524
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
It's all good.... we're just hanging, having fun. Being guys.
That's cool. I get it. Having an opinion and defending a stance is natural. I know some posters here who have proven again and again they watch game film. I lend an ear to all common sense opinions but I value the opinions of those I know watch film just a bit more. At the end of the day all I expect is accountability. Let history prove right and wrong. Let's revisit this thread in a few years.

In the meantime I dont expect the conversation to stop. I only hope the pissing matches and people talking down to one another slows down. We're all subject to mistake...and no one knows sh*t.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2525
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

Here's the question I would need answered before considering drafting Clowney?:

If the Texans were willing to draft a difference-maker on defense that would require some schematic adjustment by Romeo Crennel with 1.1, why wouldn't they take the best player in the draft, with the best attitude and work ethic?: that's Aaron Donald (not Clowney), by the way.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2526
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
Here's the question I would need answered before considering drafting Clowney?:

If the Texans were willing to draft a difference-maker on defense that would require some schematic adjustment by Romeo Crennel with 1.1, why wouldn't they take the best player in the draft, with the best attitude and work ethic?: that's Aaron Donald (not Clowney), by the way.

Do you really want to run a 4-3?

That's the only defense Donald fits in.

I think it's debatable that Donald is the best defensive player in this draft. This is a very good defensive draft. Mosley for instance is going to be a steal for somebody.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2527
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by steelbtexan View Post
Do you really want to run a 4-3?

That's the only defense Donald fits in.

I think it's debatable that Donald is the best defensive player in this draft. This is a very good defensive draft. Mosley for instance is going to be a steal for somebody.
No, I don't. However, drafting Clowney would ensure that we would run much more 1 gap defense that Crennel believes in or ever intended to run... I see no other way to make effective use of both Clowney and Watt. So, my point is, if we are going to change the defensive system, let's get the low risk stud and not some physical freak that only had 3 sacks this year and is below average vs. the run... occupying an elephant position which could already be filled by two other great athletes: Mercilus and Watt.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2528
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
Here's the question I would need answered before considering drafting Clowney?:

If the Texans were willing to draft a difference-maker on defense that would require some schematic adjustment by Romeo Crennel with 1.1, why wouldn't they take the best player in the draft, with the best attitude and work ethic?: that's Aaron Donald (not Clowney), by the way.
Aaron Donald is a stud, and I think he'll be a real impact player for whoever drafts him. But he's not an edge rusher, he's a defensive lineman who plays on the inside, whether it's in a 4-3 or 3-4, just as JJ does and we've got to get more pressure from the outside/edge because the production by Mercilus and
Reed have fallen short of whats needed.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2529
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
Here's the question I would need answered before considering drafting Clowney?:

If the Texans were willing to draft a difference-maker on defense that would require some schematic adjustment by Romeo Crennel with 1.1, why wouldn't they take the best player in the draft, with the best attitude and work ethic?: that's Aaron Donald (not Clowney), by the way.
Bingo! It doesn't take a genius to do the simple arithmetic:

Jadevon Clowney: http://espn.go.com/college-football/...deveon-clowney (see 2011,12, 13)

vs

Aaron Donald: http://espn.go.com/college-football/...3/aaron-donald (see 2010,11,12,13)

vs

Jeremiah Attaochu: http://espn.go.com/college-football/...emiah-attaochu (see 2010,11,12,13)

It doesn't take long to call the roll, Clowney gets beat in almost every instance.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2530
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texian View Post
Bingo! It doesn't take a genius to do the simple arithmetic:

Jadevon Clowney: http://espn.go.com/college-football/...deveon-clowney (see 2011,12, 13)

vs

Aaron Donald: http://espn.go.com/college-football/...3/aaron-donald (see 2010,11,12,13)

vs

Jeremiah Attaochu: http://espn.go.com/college-football/...emiah-attaochu (see 2010,11,12,13)

It doesn't take long to call the roll, Clowney gets beat in almost every instance.
So stats at all that matters?
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Old 04-19-2014   #2531
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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So stats at all that matters?
Nah what matters is Clowney played in the SECSECSEC -- the toughest conference of all.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2532
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Originally Posted by Dan B. View Post
Nah what matters is Clowney played in the SECSECSEC -- the toughest conference of all.

I'm sure there's a Manziel argument to be made in there somewhere...


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Old 04-19-2014   #2533
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by powda View Post
I don't want to speak for cak as he will SURELY go out of his way to correct anyone he thinks is wrong , but I dont believe he's attacking the player...only the concept presented which suggests since Watt is a high effort player he can instill that in Clowney. EVERY team has high effort players and athletically gifted players who are lazy. If those effort players dont stop people from being lazy on other teams, why should it work here? Why would Watt who plays a different position then Clowney's here (de vs olb) be anymore effective then putting Clowney second string to an undrafted free agent who plays 100 miles an hour? I like Clowney and prefer us to draft him over one of the qb's , but I dont subscribe to the ideal of Watt's presence effecting Clowney's effort. Could it happen? Sure. But I wouldn't argue for one guy based on another players effort.
The BIG difference between Watt and the College high effort guys is that Watt is the MAN in Houston and Clowney won't be unless he gives the High Motor effort. He'll either get with the program or get traded to some other desperate team like Buffalo. The expectation of professionalism in the training and on the field varies with every team. The Great teams have the great habits away from the field as well as on it.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2534
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by IDEXAN View Post
Near as I can tell Clowney is the only player in this Draft that one or more teams might consider moving up for ? If that's the case and assuming the Texans would like the opportunity to entertain offers for their 1.1, shouldn't the Texans by all appearances/reports (including "leaks") have every intention of drafting Clowney ?
I love a guy who thinks like a GOOD GM.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2535
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by Playoffs View Post
Which member shall we hold "accountable" for drafting Clowney? Which one is writing his name on the draft card?

I'm pretty sure no one at 2 Reliant Park will be consulting anyone here on TexansTalk before selecting TB or Bortles or Manziel or Mack or Clowney..... no matter how "loud" they type.
I don't know if McNair will hold anybody accountable. His track record says he wont.

I'm almost positive Smith wont be held accountable again.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2536
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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I don't know if McNair will hold anybody accountable. His track record says he wont.

I'm almost positive Smith wont be held accountable again.
The signs are beginning to show that the person to be held MOST ACCOUNTABLE is none other than Bob McNair himself.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2537
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by mussop View Post
So stats at all that matters?
I'm sure you will quickly dismiss all stats or have convenient excuses readily available to discount any and all stats, as is your tendency. You certainly have those prerogatives to do so.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2538
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Talk on 790 that TB could fall out of the 1st round. Clowney followed by TB at 2.1 would have sounded like an impossibly good haul a month ago. Sounds like a distinct possibility now and to my mind would be potentially amazing.
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Old 04-19-2014   #2539
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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So stats at all that matters?

In college where you play against future lawyers,barbers,and bartenders, id imagine you could produce at an average level. We've never had a guy rated so high with such a piss poor last yr. That doesn't bother anyone but me?
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Old 04-19-2014   #2540
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Default Re: Clowney, then what?

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Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
No, I don't. However, drafting Clowney would ensure that we would run much more 1 gap defense that Crennel believes in or ever intended to run... I see no other way to make effective use of both Clowney and Watt. So, my point is, if we are going to change the defensive system, let's get the low risk stud and not some physical freak that only had 3 sacks this year and is below average vs. the run... occupying an elephant position which could already be filled by two other great athletes: Mercilus and Watt.
Mercilus s a great athlete?

I get that you don't want Smith to pick Clowney but either

A. Your making stuff up to support your case
b. Have an unhealthy infatuation with Mercilus.

I do believe Mercilus would be more effective on 3rd and longs with Watt/Clowney.
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