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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #1
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Default JJ Watt - MVP

I want to start a discussion on this. It seems the Wisconsin boys are in the lead for the MVP vote, one on offense and one on defense. Offense appears to be running away with the vote. The argument is that as the quarterback, Aaron Rodgers is more "valuable" ... literally defining the award. He is the driving force of the team while Watt is a phenom, but merely a contributor.

Doesn't that end this and all future conversations? The quarterback is the cog for every team. The league is built that way. Valuable to the team is ended with 1 position.

HOWEVER!!! I think Deadspin touched on something that I think should be explored in their piece describing each drive that Watt deterred. Aaron Rodgers to this point is the next in line of quarterbacks having a standout season. He's scored 33 touchdowns already - 32 passing and 1 rushing - for a total of 198 points. Watt only has 5 touchdowns for 30 points. Deadspin knocked out 5 drives in the first half that Watt directly took points off the board versus the Titans - is that not potentially 30 points that Watt directly influenced? In that way Rodgers gets 6 for a touchdown, Watt gets 6 for the third down stop.

What do the numbers look like when the offensive player's touchdowns are compared to Watt's singular marks taking points off the board? Who has the highest total? Rodgers gets credit for an amazing catch and run by Jordy Nelson, does Watt get credit for the touchdown when his pressure results in an INT or punt or return touchdown? How many points has each player REALLY accounted for?
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #2
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

I love watt and what Texans fan doesnt. But the Texans would probably be 4-8 without JJ instead of 6-6. I think that they would have lost the Skins and Bills game without him. But on the other side, Packers are probably 3-9 instead of 9-3 if their back up qb was playing.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #3
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

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Originally Posted by stingray View Post
But on the other side, Packers are probably 3-9 instead of 9-3 if their back up qb was playing.
is having a shitty backup an excuse? the patriots and colts fight for the first 2 seeds every year. brady goes out and cassell wins 10 games because belichick is famous for constantly grooming the next guy. manning goes out and the colts dont win. 2 years later the colts have regained dominance with a kid, and manning's going to the superbowl on another team. who is the right system and player?

does the same happen with the texans' defense? is there another player in the league that can step into watt's role? justin smith is an all-pro monster, but he'd at best be matt cassell in this scenario. what would we look like with curtis painter at LDE? how many points and wins would that single substitution cost us?
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #4
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

We should have, could have, would have won those three games against the Cowboys, Colts and Steelers in consecutive fashion. We'd be sitting pretty at 9-3 right now instead of 6-6. J.J. Watt would be a lock for the MVP if we had those three extra wins.

Better yet, what if Jadeveon Clowney never tore his meniscus and had played in those three games? Who knows. We always seem to be a day late and a dollar short. But hopefully we win out and finish 10-6. And maybe, just maybe, we'll make the playoffs.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #5
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

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Originally Posted by stingray View Post
I love watt and what Texans fan doesnt. But the Texans would probably be 4-8 without JJ instead of 6-6. I think that they would have lost the Skins and Bills game without him. But on the other side, Packers are probably 3-9 instead of 9-3 if their back up qb was playing.
In the end J.J. Watt will not win the 2014 NFL MVP because at best we'll go 10-6. But if we make the playoffs he may earn a few extra votes. I just think losing some heartbreakers we probably could have won cost us a chance to go 14-2 or 13-3 which would have given him a better chance. Just for kicks, Bill O'Brien should allow Watt to throw a TD pass if we blow out the Jaguars this Sunday and have a goal line situation late in the game. He's done everything else he may as well play quarterback for one play. Heck, it's not like freakin' Tom Savage is going to throw a pass in garbage time late in the game. What a joke that was the last game. We could have put 52 points on the board.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #6
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

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Originally Posted by Bulls on Parade View Post
In the end J.J. Watt will not win the 2014 NFL MVP because at best we'll go 10-6. But if we make the playoffs he may earn a few extra votes. I just think losing some heartbreakers we probably could have won cost us a chance to go 14-2 or 13-3 which would have given him a better chance. Just for kicks, Bill O'Brien should allow Watt to throw a TD pass if we blow out the Jaguars this Sunday and have a goal line situation late in the game. He's done everything else he may as well play quarterback for one play. Heck, it's not like freakin' Tom Savage is going to throw a pass in garbage time late in the game. What a joke that was the last game. We could have put 52 points on the board.
No JJ Watt will not when the MVP because they no longer consider anything outside of an offensive player the most valuable player. And it amazes me, in a league where you cant even touch a WR, it is QBs who get all the glory.

This is one reason i don't generally care for the awards, because they have and will always be biased.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #7
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

Watt may be deserving of the award, but he won't get it. Since 1957, only three times has the award not gone to a QB or an RB.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationa...e_Player_Award
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #8
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

eriadoc nailed it in the other thread. Call it the most valuable QB award and stop the sham of considering the whole league.

The award has been ruined just like the Heisman with making it essentially a QB award and almost only from a winning team.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #9
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

Yup, it's a "QB driven league" now. Add that with how good Rodgers is playing, the Pack are going to the playoffs and the Texans aren't. End of story

Most know I'm a huge defense kinda guy, so I'd be tickled to death if he won it. He deserves it

He's got DPOY, Pro Bowl, All Pro all but wrapped up
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #10
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

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Originally Posted by HOU-TEX View Post
Yup, it's a "QB driven league" now. Add that with how good Rodgers is playing, the Pack are going to the playoffs and the Texans aren't. End of story

Most know I'm a huge defense kinda guy, so I'd be tickled to death if he won it. He deserves it

He's got DPOY, Pro Bowl, All Pro all but wrapped up
This displays the problem. Rodgers is not doing anything special. Every year the best QBs put up years like his. It isn't even his best year.

What JJ is doing is having an epic season, the kind that would be in the debate for best season by a DLmen ever.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #11
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Default

I think JJ has a legit shot IF he continues his dominance AND if Texans gets in the playoffs. The key thing is the playoffs because however they get in will be so miraculous and dramatic that the voters cannot simply ignore such a story.

This country LOVES a good underdog story especially coming from such a good likable guy like JJ Watt. Believe me voters will lay aside the "this is QB league" prerequisite and will make an exception because of the improbable story behind it.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #12
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

Quote:
Originally Posted by EllisUnit View Post
No JJ Watt will not when the MVP because they no longer consider anything outside of an offensive player the most valuable player. And it amazes me, in a league where you cant even touch a WR, it is QBs who get all the glory.

This is one reason i don't generally care for the awards, because they have and will always be biased.
All the more reason to spit in the sportswriters faces, the ones who vote for the NFL MVP, and play J.J. Watt at quarterback for at least one goal line play at Jacksonville on Sunday (only if the Texans are up big) just to throw for one TD pass. Make it extra unique and special what he's doing this year. Heck, maybe even allow Watt to kick an extra point and a short-yardage field goal (under 30 yards). To go along with his blocked extra point and field goals, sacks, QB knockdowns, batted pass deflections, TD receptions, fumbles forced, fumbles returned for touchdown and pick six interception. Just to name a few. Whatever he can do in these final four games to impress people and the Texans finish 10-6 to make the playoffs and maybe even make a surprise Super Bowl run. If that happens we'll know he was the real MVP. At any rate J.J. Watt is going to win his second defensive player of the year award which is also special. I sort of consider Watt an offensive player as it is. He's a fine tight end. The best we have on the team.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #13
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

Aaron Rodgers is the MVP and it's not even close.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #14
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

John Lopez @LopezonSports
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Here is the J.J. Watt video, perhaps, of him talking noise, perhaps, and Jujubes, Sno Cones, etc. Mic'd up: https://t.co/dDKP79KglT
JJ Watt mic'd up for second Titans game.

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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #15
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

What are snowcaps?
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #16
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

Quote:
Originally Posted by jaayteetx View Post
Aaron Rodgers is the MVP and it's not even close.
JJ Watt is the MVP and it's not even close.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #17
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

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What are snowcaps?
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #18
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
This displays the problem. Rodgers is not doing anything special. Every year the best QBs put up years like his. It isn't even his best year.

What JJ is doing is having an epic season, the kind that would be in the debate for best season by a DLmen ever.
I agree with your overall stance, but take issue with the Rodgers comment. He's on pace to finish the year with 42 TD's and 4 INT's. It's not quite as good as his historic 2011 season, but it is special. The guy has redefined the modern QB position as far as I'm concerned.

Totally agree on the Watt comment. What he's doing is basically unheard of and if he doesn't win it this year it basically determines the MVP award as an offensive award and diminishes the overall importance of it.

I think the point to make is that both players have had special seasons, but Rodgers is in charted territory while Watt is in uncharted territory. Which player should be rewarded?
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #19
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

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Originally Posted by WolverineFan View Post
I think the point to make is that both players have had special seasons, but Rodgers is in charted territory while Watt is in uncharted territory. Which player should be rewarded?
Yes. I don't want to get bogged down about Rogers. What you said is the bottom line.
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #20
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Default Re: JJ Watt - MVP

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Originally Posted by WolverineFan View Post
The guy has redefined the modern QB position as far as I'm concerned...
He's the offensive equivalent of JJ Watt... almost.
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