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View Poll Results: You make the call!
Keep Kubiak & Smith 13 11.21%
Fire Kubiak & Smith 77 66.38%
Fire Kubiak & keep Smith 22 18.97%
Keep Kubiak & fire Smith 2 1.72%
Other 2 1.72%
Voters: 116. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-13-2013   #61
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Goatcheese:

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Old 11-14-2013   #62
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Here's the way I see it and this is not going to be popular. But it's where I'm at.

Regarding Smith:
1. He has drafted well and he's found some absolute gems off the street. He finds players, gives the coaches options, and allows them a voice in the draft process. This has led to Duane Brown, Brian Cushing, J. J. Watt, and Ben Tate as well as Arian Foster and Case Keenum.
2. Regardless of what some people on this board believe, I don't think he's screwed up wrt contracts and the cap. I think he's done a pretty good job. We are not and have not been in Cap Hell.
3. I think his biggest problem in FA is listening to people he SHOULD have been able to trust: Sherman on Ahman Green and Andre on Ed Reed.

I don't see any reason to ditch him. We've got a talented team.

Regarding Kubiak:
1. His offense works. As long as the QB running it doesn't start smoking crack. Many coordinators that become head coaches fail on the side of the ball that they were coordinators for. Unlike guys like Billick (who was never able to recreate his Minnesota offense in Baltimore), Kubiak has been able to put together an offense that's pretty freaking potent.
2. We have not had 7 years of horrid football. The past two seasons bordered on awesome. We won our division, went to the playoffs, and we won playoff games. I remember when I just wanted a team that was relevant in November.
3. I don't hold Arian Foster and Case Keenum and their late starts against him. From everything I've heard, Case doesn't look that great in practice and Kubiak believes in guys performing in practice as well as in the games. And Arian Foster has himself said that he wasn't really prepared to play until late in his rookie season.

Like the 2010 meltdown, I expect Kubiak to be gone after this. I realize that I'm much, much more patient than the average fan. I'm like that in most things (except driving in LA traffic). It has always seemed to me that most teams and owners pull the plug on coaches too soon. I think McNair is like me in that regard BUT... I'm not sure how he's going to take this season when the expectations were so high.
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Old 11-14-2013   #63
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
Here's the way I see it and this is not going to be popular. But it's where I'm at.

Regarding Smith:
1. He has drafted well and he's found some absolute gems off the street. He finds players, gives the coaches options, and allows them a voice in the draft process. This has led to Duane Brown, Brian Cushing, J. J. Watt, and Ben Tate as well as Arian Foster and Case Keenum.
2. Regardless of what some people on this board believe, I don't think he's screwed up wrt contracts and the cap. I think he's done a pretty good job. We are not and have not been in Cap Hell.
3. I think his biggest problem in FA is listening to people he SHOULD have been able to trust: Sherman on Ahman Green and Andre on Ed Reed.

I don't see any reason to ditch him. We've got a talented team.

Regarding Kubiak:
1. His offense works. As long as the QB running it doesn't start smoking crack. Many coordinators that become head coaches fail on the side of the ball that they were coordinators for. Unlike guys like Billick (who was never able to recreate his Minnesota offense in Baltimore), Kubiak has been able to put together an offense that's pretty freaking potent.
2. We have not had 7 years of horrid football. The past two seasons bordered on awesome. We won our division, went to the playoffs, and we won playoff games. I remember when I just wanted a team that was relevant in November.
3. I don't hold Arian Foster and Case Keenum and their late starts against him. From everything I've heard, Case doesn't look that great in practice and Kubiak believes in guys performing in practice as well as in the games. And Arian Foster has himself said that he wasn't really prepared to play until late in his rookie season.

Like the 2010 meltdown, I expect Kubiak to be gone after this. I realize that I'm much, much more patient than the average fan. I'm like that in most things (except driving in LA traffic). It has always seemed to me that most teams and owners pull the plug on coaches too soon. I think McNair is like me in that regard BUT... I'm not sure how he's going to take this season when the expectations were so high.
I completely agree. It's nice to read a post from someone that can see beyond the emotion.
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Old 11-14-2013   #64
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
Here's the way I see it and this is not going to be popular. But it's where I'm at.

Regarding Smith:
1. He has drafted well and he's found some absolute gems off the street. He finds players, gives the coaches options, and allows them a voice in the draft process. This has led to Duane Brown, Brian Cushing, J. J. Watt, and Ben Tate as well as Arian Foster and Case Keenum.
2. Regardless of what some people on this board believe, I don't think he's screwed up wrt contracts and the cap. I think he's done a pretty good job. We are not and have not been in Cap Hell.
3. I think his biggest problem in FA is listening to people he SHOULD have been able to trust: Sherman on Ahman Green and Andre on Ed Reed.

I don't see any reason to ditch him. We've got a talented team.

Regarding Kubiak:
1. His offense works. As long as the QB running it doesn't start smoking crack. Many coordinators that become head coaches fail on the side of the ball that they were coordinators for. Unlike guys like Billick (who was never able to recreate his Minnesota offense in Baltimore), Kubiak has been able to put together an offense that's pretty freaking potent.
2. We have not had 7 years of horrid football. The past two seasons bordered on awesome. We won our division, went to the playoffs, and we won playoff games. I remember when I just wanted a team that was relevant in November.
3. I don't hold Arian Foster and Case Keenum and their late starts against him. From everything I've heard, Case doesn't look that great in practice and Kubiak believes in guys performing in practice as well as in the games. And Arian Foster has himself said that he wasn't really prepared to play until late in his rookie season.

Like the 2010 meltdown, I expect Kubiak to be gone after this. I realize that I'm much, much more patient than the average fan. I'm like that in most things (except driving in LA traffic). It has always seemed to me that most teams and owners pull the plug on coaches too soon. I think McNair is like me in that regard BUT... I'm not sure how he's going to take this season when the expectations were so high.
this is more or less what I always felt, but I thought it was just me.

If I'm not mistaken the 2009 draft pool is known to be the worst in recent years, and we got a lot of nice players that year...

And I like the idea of having a football team that doesn't require a "prima donna" type of QB.
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Old 11-14-2013   #65
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf View Post
... If it weren't for injuries. Case never would have had a shot. He has done better than matt and yates combined. How is that not noticed? (Poor practice player?)

Foster wouldn't have sniffed the field a few years ago if it weren't for injuries. We see what happened so far.

How do players like that not move up depth chart? Does he just stink at evaluating or just too loyal to what he has?
I only go to one practice a year, Case looked the best of the 3 at that practice. Yates didn't throw one catchable ball at that practice. I thought Case looked the best of the three in preseason games.

Several years ago in an interview, Jason Babin said he asked Kubiak what he had to do to start. Kubiak told Babin, there is nothing you can do, I have my guy.
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Old 11-14-2013   #66
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

some seem to forget that we have struggled in red zone offense, 3rd downs, in game adjustments, stuck on stubbornness and unwilling to move on from bad players. lots of players dont improve here especially on defense. and we still cant beat indy....thats all on gary kubiak and the crap coaching staff he assembled time to move on from them all.

rick smith gets one more try imo.....some also forget how bad our cap was until he arrived and sure he over paid some vets, but no one wanted to play here because we sucked.....our team is loaded with talent, the coaches fail to improve their skill level
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Old 11-14-2013   #67
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Kubiak - keep.
Smith - adios.
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Old 11-14-2013   #68
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
Here's the way I see it and this is not going to be popular. But it's where I'm at.

Regarding Smith:
1. He has drafted well and he's found some absolute gems off the street. He finds players, gives the coaches options, and allows them a voice in the draft process. This has led to Duane Brown, Brian Cushing, J. J. Watt, and Ben Tate as well as Arian Foster and Case Keenum.
2. Regardless of what some people on this board believe, I don't think he's screwed up wrt contracts and the cap. I think he's done a pretty good job. We are not and have not been in Cap Hell.
3. I think his biggest problem in FA is listening to people he SHOULD have been able to trust: Sherman on Ahman Green and Andre on Ed Reed.

I don't see any reason to ditch him. We've got a talented team.
This is my reasoning for keeping Smith. As others who even voted to remove both Kubiak and Smith said themselves, the team is talented. That is what you have to expect for your GM. It's up to the coaches and players to take it from there. He does have some misses but every GM will have hits and misses so can't expect a perfect score. The question becomes has he done enough for the team to win and it's hard to say he didn't otherwise we wouldn't be disappointed in the product we have on the field. We expected more because we see the potential of the roster.

Plus any new GM most likely will be someone who has never had the position or experience so no guarantee it would be anything new or better in that situation. At least with a new coach you can get someone with experience that is worthwhile. How many worthwhile GM's are sitting there waiting for phone calls?

I disagree on the Kubiak reasoning because of what has been already stated. This is a talented roster. It is up to the coaches do get production from it. The fact we seem to disappear against elite teams too often and go stretches of quarters of not even being able to put the ball in the endzone is very telling in my opinon. To add the lack of discipline we have displayed this year on the field, slow starts and poor adjustments and it just seems this coaching staff has hit that 'stale period' that many say take place in locker rooms. Have to add the stubborness with the loyalty factor like he seems to have with Marciano.

Though in the end I expect both to remain in any case, heh.
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Old 11-14-2013   #69
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Smith has destroyed this team that had tons of potential a few years back with bad contracts and re-upping mediocre players like Schaub and Walter while getting rid of the entire right side of the line at one time. Our greatest draft ever and we don't have our first pick or DeMeco (who is playing well in a 3-4 thankyouverymuch). Signing Foster before he needed to be signed is another problem. We could have tagged him next season. We've locked up players before they needed to be locked up and released guys who were a big part of our "potential". This team has been mismanaged from top to bottom. Rick Smith is no capologist.
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Old 11-17-2013   #70
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Why cut any slack concerning getting rid of Smith. Either he has put this team in this position or he is nothing but a YES man or a puppet. Either way he needs to go.
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Old 11-17-2013   #71
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

over these past 5 years I forget who weilds the power KUBES or SMITH ..????



Did kubes get hired first then rick or vise versa I forget

if uhhh we don't win these next 6 games I think the decision for Bob will be pretty easy

I think we gotta sweep the jags and titans and split with the colts and go 1-1 with either Denver or Pats if kubes has any chance I think rick is has good has gone
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Old 11-17-2013   #72
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Today if I was McNair Kubiak would have been fired before he got to the locker room. He likely would have left Reliant Stadium shirtless too, I wouldn't have let him walk out the door with a Texans logo on his shirt.
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Old 11-17-2013   #73
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
Smith has destroyed this team that had tons of potential a few years back with bad contracts and re-upping mediocre players like Schaub and Walter while getting rid of the entire right side of the line at one time. Our greatest draft ever and we don't have our first pick or DeMeco (who is playing well in a 3-4 thankyouverymuch). Signing Foster before he needed to be signed is another problem. We could have tagged him next season. We've locked up players before they needed to be locked up and released guys who were a big part of our "potential". This team has been mismanaged from top to bottom. Rick Smith is no capologist.
So the point of all this hyperbole is that you think Smith should be held responsible for things that were entirely or near-entirely un-foreseeable.
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Old 11-17-2013   #74
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
Smith has destroyed this team that had tons of potential a few years back with bad contracts and re-upping mediocre players like Schaub and Walter while getting rid of the entire right side of the line at one time. Our greatest draft ever and we don't have our first pick or DeMeco (who is playing well in a 3-4 thankyouverymuch). Signing Foster before he needed to be signed is another problem. We could have tagged him next season. We've locked up players before they needed to be locked up and released guys who were a big part of our "potential". This team has been mismanaged from top to bottom. Rick Smith is no capologist.
Where did Smith get the idea to do these bad contracts? If not for Kubiak, there's no way to tell where Smith might have gone.
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Old 11-17-2013   #75
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

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Originally Posted by bhsman View Post
So the point of all this hyperbole is that you think Smith should be held responsible for things that were entirely or near-entirely un-foreseeable.
Schaub and cushing were all coming off injury. Is it "un-forseeable" to expect 1 or both of them not to perform up to pre injury status? We were so focused on creating a rep and good will among the players that we sacraficed the product on the field. FAIL RICK FAIL.
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Old 11-17-2013   #76
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

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Where did Smith get the idea to do these bad contracts? If not for Kubiak, there's no way to tell where Smith might have gone.
One's the head the others the tail but it's still the same dog .
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Old 11-17-2013   #77
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

Quote:
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Schaub and cushing were all coming off injury. Is it "un-forseeable" to expect 1 or both of them not to perform up to pre injury status? We were so focused on creating a rep and good will among the players that we sacraficed the product on the field. FAIL RICK FAIL.
Cushing was playing very well before the new freak injury, so I'm not sure what you're going for there. For Schaub, people seem to think we signed him to a Flacco-esque deal.
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Old 11-17-2013   #78
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

I want new everything from gm to towel boys. This firing should of happened years ago.
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Old 11-17-2013   #79
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

I think Bob's a nice guy. I think he's close to Gary & Wade and can't see firing them after what they've been through this season. I wish he was the cold blooded person I pretend to be on the internet, because I'd really like to hear that Kubiak has been let go tonight.

But that ain't going to happen.

I voted for other. I think Bob will hire a guy to put between himself & his employees, Rick Smith & Gary Kubiak.

The only problem with that, is we'll just be looking for a new head coach next year, or the year after. So with that in mind, in light of Kubiak's stroke, & in appreciation of everything Gary has done right for pro football in Houston, I hope he promotes Kubiak to VP of football operations, or something, tomorrow & name Dennison interim head coach.

In my dream world, Gary won't pick his replacement. The group will... Cal, Rick, McNair, & Gary... but we'll have a new HC next year.



& he can fire his VP of football operations mid-season 2014... he's paying him through 2014 anyway.
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Old 11-17-2013   #80
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Default Re: Kubiak/Smith: Keep them or fire them?

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Originally Posted by powda View Post
Schaub and cushing were all coming off injury. Is it "un-forseeable" to expect 1 or both of them not to perform up to pre injury status? We were so focused on creating a rep and good will among the players that we sacraficed the product on the field. FAIL RICK FAIL.
We gave ourselves an out with Schaub's contract. It was at a bargain compared to Romo, Ryan, & Flacco's... we were picking 20 last draft, wouldn't have got our QB of the future anyway.
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