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View Poll Results: Who gets the start at QB after the buy?
Keenum 162 88.52%
Schaub 21 11.48%
Voters: 183. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-30-2013   #461
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

In response to the "Keenum went undrafted for a reason" argument - that's true. The reason is a lot simpler than y'all mental contortionists would like to admit. The reason is stunningly simple - you were WRONG.
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Old 10-30-2013   #462
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Published scouting reports are humorous. They are often filled with miscalculations and thrown together without much thought. In that business, respect is essential. So, those publications tend to organize their analysis to fit in with conventional wisdom instead of actually representing an isolated perspective on a player.

Clearly, though, more than just the publications were turned off by Keenum. The question is "why" and are the issues legitimate and unsurmountable.

I think his size is what most likely dismissed him in the eyes of the NFL scouts... coming in below that minimum bar of 6 ft. 2 inches, without any eye-catching skills to supplement the lack of heighth was probably a deal-breaker.

I have no idea if he will become a good NFL QB. I hope so. What seemed clear is that he did not lack necessary arm strength, accuracy, or have any mechanical issues with his delivery. I also did not see his heighth as an issue.

Here is my biggest concern: his ability to throw in the pocket, from under center... He has to overcome footwork issues from a lack of experience under center and teams scheming for him and preparing to clutter the middle throwing lanes with bodies and arms... will he be able to see and also get passes away without being knocked down? I think that will be the biggest physical test.
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Old 10-30-2013   #463
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

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Originally Posted by leebigeztx View Post
Are u being serious or are u playing?
What about that makes you think I'm playing?
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Old 10-30-2013   #464
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Keenum holds the highest QB rating at Arrowhead this season.
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Old 10-30-2013   #465
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

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Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
Keenum holds the highest QB rating at Arrowhead this season.
Keenum is the best QB on the Texans right now. When you consider Schaub and Yates though, that's not exactly high praise. But until he proves it to me otherwise, I'm going to continue to believe that Keenum is the future of the Texans.
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Old 10-30-2013   #466
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

NFL has keenum at 6'1".
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Old 10-30-2013   #467
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Joe Montana
official height: 6 ft 2 in (1.88 m)
official weight: 205 lb.

Case Keenum
official height: 6 ft 1 in (1.85 m)
official weight: 205 lb.

I doubt 3 hundredths of a meter will completely make or
break a quarterback's career.

And just for you guys jonesing for him:

Johnny Manziel (from draft scout)
official height: 5 ft 11.5 in
official weight: 210 lb.

One should never make more out of the numbers than
what they really are..

TJ
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Old 10-30-2013   #468
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
Published scouting reports are humorous. They are often filled with miscalculations and thrown together without much thought. In that business, respect is essential. So, those publications tend to organize their analysis to fit in with conventional wisdom instead of actually representing an isolated perspective on a player.

Clearly, though, more than just the publications were turned off by Keenum. The question is "why" and are the issues legitimate and unsurmountable.

I think his size is what most likely dismissed him in the eyes of the NFL scouts... coming in below that minimum bar of 6 ft. 2 inches, without any eye-catching skills to supplement the lack of heighth was probably a deal-breaker.

I have no idea if he will become a good NFL QB. I hope so. What seemed clear is that he did not lack necessary arm strength, accuracy, or have any mechanical issues with his delivery. I also did not see his heighth as an issue.

Here is my biggest concern: his ability to throw in the pocket, from under center...
Quote:
He has to overcome footwork issues from a lack of experience under center and teams scheming for him and preparing to clutter the middle throwing lanes with bodies and arms... will he be able to see and also get passes away without being knocked down? I think that will be the biggest physical test.


I think that sums it up nicely.

Throwing on the move should be his strong suit, teams will scheme to minimize that.

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Old 10-30-2013   #469
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leebigeztx View Post
So why did shannahan give up 2 #1s and a 2nd for rg3? Lienhart was a bum and 3yrs later jets moved up to get sanchez.
RG3 didn't excel in Conference USA.

Lienart appeared to be on track in 2008.

Kolb was meh..... in 2011.

However, if you don't think Keenum's draft status was related to Kolb's performance, what's your theory? He's as tall as Wilson & Kaepernick, so it couldn't have been his height.
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Old 10-30-2013   #470
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/stor...hrowing-drills

Not the end all be all.
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Old 10-30-2013   #471
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooter View Post
there are several reasons he went undrafted -

his age. he was 2 years too old coming out of college.
I do believe it's as you stated, several reasons stacked against him. However, this one may end up working in our favor. Being a little more mature than you're average kid straight out of college... hopefully he'll improve by leaps & bounds as he sees NFL defenses in games that count.
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Old 10-30-2013   #472
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

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Originally Posted by leebigeztx View Post
Neither is that.

Quote:
For the 24-year-old, Monday was about showcasing his true abilities after being hampered by a hamstring injury at the NFL scouting combine in February. The Abilene native revealed that he strained his right hamstring running his second 40-yard dash at the combine and that it affected his throwing during drills. On Monday, there were no ill effects from the injury, as Keenum whizzed pass after pass to receivers on a variety of patterns, showed capable arm strength and displayed his athleticism with a 4.31-second time in the 20-yard shuttle and 6.89 seconds in the three-cone drill.
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings...2012&genpos=QB
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Old 10-30-2013   #473
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leebigeztx View Post
If NFL teams based their evaluation of his arm strength on an injured performance, then they're as stupid as anyone who believes he doesn't have NFL caliber arm strength. And that is the reason he wasn't drafted. People are stupid when it comes to groupthink situations. They just parrot what the other guy said. The Texans were at least smart enough to take a look at him once he healed up and decided he was worth taking a flier on.
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Old 10-30-2013   #474
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

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Originally Posted by Vance87 View Post
It's amazing how a right-handed QB's throwing can be affected by a right lower limb plant side problem.................just amazing............
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Old 10-30-2013   #475
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

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Originally Posted by eriadoc View Post
If NFL teams based their evaluation of his arm strength on an injured performance, then they're as stupid as anyone who believes he doesn't have NFL caliber arm strength. And that is the reason he wasn't drafted. People are stupid when it comes to groupthink situations. They just parrot what the other guy said. The Texans were at least smart enough to take a look at him once he healed up and decided he was worth taking a flier on.
Part of it is simply the human condition. I don't think it is possible for people, even for their own self-interest, to avoid developing bias. I see sentiment and attitudes develop out of a mob mentality in the NFL all the time.

One example that comes to mind is the prejudice related to size of running backs. I have heard, since the late 1980s, RBs get devalued coming out of college because they are too small. Even after the years of success of guys like Emmett Smith, I remember MJD falling into the 2nd round because of "size' questions. Really? Did anyone bother to look at him? How can pro scouts in the modern era believe that a RB who is 6'2" and 240 lbs will be more durable than a RB who is 5'6" and 215 lbs? Yet, that has been the attitude for many years and caused a lot of NFL teams to make big draft day mistakes.

Certain schemes fall in and out of favor all the time- for offense and defense, etc...

Usually, the great organizations and coaches are defined by their ability to break outside of the mob mentality and risk doing things a different way, or evaluating players differently.

Still, though, it is hard to sit on the outside and conclude scouts of all 32 teams were so wrong when they have so much more information than we do... Yet, those examples exist throughout the NFL. I hope Case is one.
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Old 10-30-2013   #476
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eriadoc View Post
If NFL teams based their evaluation of his arm strength on an injured performance, then they're as stupid as anyone who believes he doesn't have NFL caliber arm strength. And that is the reason he wasn't drafted. People are stupid when it comes to groupthink situations. They just parrot what the other guy said. The Texans were at least smart enough to take a look at him once he healed up and decided he was worth taking a flier on.
Naaaa, the coaches and management folks are too stupid and clueless for that. It was strictly a PR move, just like letting him start.
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Old 10-30-2013   #477
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
Part of it is simply the human condition. I don't think it is possible for people, even for their own self-interest, to avoid developing bias. I see sentiment and attitudes develop out of a mob mentality in the NFL all the time.

One example that comes to mind is the prejudice related to size of running backs. I have heard, since the late 1980s, RBs get devalued coming out of college because they are too small. Even after the years of success of guys like Emmett Smith, I remember MJD falling into the 2nd round because of "size' questions. Really? Did anyone bother to look at him? How can pro scouts in the modern era believe that a RB who is 6'2" and 240 lbs will be more durable than a RB who is 5'6" and 215 lbs? Yet, that has been the attitude for many years and caused a lot of NFL teams to make big draft day mistakes.

Certain schemes fall in and out of favor all the time- for offense and defense, etc...

Usually, the great organizations and coaches are defined by their ability to break outside of the mob mentality and risk doing things a different way, or evaluating players differently.

Still, though, it is hard to sit on the outside and conclude scouts of all 32 teams were so wrong when they have so much more information than we do... Yet, those examples exist throughout the NFL. I hope Case is one.
This is true, but I think there is another variable in play when it comes to players slipping. Let's say there is a team that values a player as having a 1st round talent. Let's say the consensus on the player is that he's a 3rd rounder due to whatever arbitrary characteristics are put onto the position he plays as being required (size, speed, arm, vertical, etc. etc. etc). If the team that values the player knows (within a reasonable margin of error) that no one will take this guy until the 3rd round, it makes no sense for them to take him in the 1st, but they might take him with a late 2nd pick.

And when that happens a lot of people like us a boards like this one will complain about how they reached and how they could have had this guy probably in the 4th round.
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Old 10-30-2013   #478
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

at the end of the day, the draft worked out for the Texans. we have case and he's up for another big test sunday. a lot of fans in Houston are hopeful about this team and its future regardless of the injuries because of case.

I've watched case since his freshman year and he just gets better with age. There's a reason why Kubiak is risking putting it all on a young QB when his million dollar starter can play and will be sitting on the bench.

you're going to see some slinging on sunday night. book it.
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Old 10-30-2013   #479
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

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at the end of the day, the draft worked out for the Texans. we have case and he's up for another big test sunday. a lot of fans in Houston are hopeful about this team and its future regardless of the injuries because of case.

I've watched case since his freshman year and he just gets better with age. There's a reason why Kubiak is risking putting it all on a young QB when his million dollar starter can play and will be sitting on the bench.

you're going to see some slinging on sunday night. book it.
I have no doubt we'll see Case sling it...I just hope he slings it to the guys in red...
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Old 10-30-2013   #480
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Default Re: Who gets the start at QB after the bye?

Dalemurphy, I agree players are mis judged,but how does a qb go undrafted? I mean they said ryan fitzpatrick had one of the best chalkboard sessions ever. He stuck around,got his chance under gailey,played well early and turned it into a big payday. Then teams found out he couldn't push the ball to certain quads of the field. He's still getting a great. Nfl check as a backup,but he was undrafted For a reason also. Could case be like this? Could. Should Keenum continue to be the starter? Yes. Would or should the texans pass a qb in the 1st rd? No!
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