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Old 11-09-2013   #221
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Originally Posted by TheMatrix31 View Post
I can't believe I have to read about this tanking **** on THIS board too. Already deal with it with moron basketball and hockey fans. And the meaning of "tanking" is not understood. "Tanking" is losing games on purpose. If you are an advocate of such actions, you are a loser. Just GTFO.

Look, you can find a contributor anywhere. And look, there are 32 ****ing teams in this league. Not everyone can be in the playoffs and not everyone can be in bottom 5. We are very clearly not the worst team in the league or close to it. It's a down year with lots of bad luck. That doesn't mean we're perpetually worthless like some other teams that are perpetually worthless. You cannot breed a winning culture by losing. Look at the Browns and Bills. They're perpetual LOSERS.

I am SO SICK of this damn argument INFECTING every single sport. I don't know where it came from and why it started getting more popular in recent years but it's as infuriating as people who use the word "hater" "hating on", etc. All I know is that it needs to die a painful death.
It comes from he namby panby "redistribution of wealth" approach of giving failing teams the best players in the next year's batch. It is all a business decision to create parity in the league and keep fan interest high everywhere, other than just winning teams. Abysmal failure is rewarded more than playing average.

In a lot other sports outside of the USA, you lose and finish bottom of he standings, guess what, you are relegated to a lower tier of the sport, big name players leave the team, and thus there is incentive to keep playing 100% every single week.

The talk of "tanking" is absolutely absurd. We are half way through the year. We aren't at the "lose his game and get top pick" junction (not that would justify wanting to lose anyway!). Plus if we has got the 2nd pick back when we took Mario #1, we would have saved some coin for not having to sign him as a #1 pick.

So, um, in conclusion regarding tanking half the season, when we're really obviously no where near the worst team in the league - bad idea.
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Old 11-09-2013   #222
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

And just to add, my main contention is that they're not "SB winning quality." I thoroughly understand assessment based on hard results thus far. You can say "okay, it's been _ years, they haven't won so time to cut bait" and that would be totally fine and I'd agree. But to say it like they're not "SB winning quality" is ridiculous because in the NFL, you need luck to be successful too and lots of coaches aren't "SB winning quality" then. John Fox? Hasn't won a Super Bowl yet. Chuck Pagano? Hasn't won a Super Bowl yet. Pete Carroll? Hasn't won a Super Bowl yet. Mike Smith? Hasn't won a Super Bowl yet.

And I'd bet my balls that everyone who hates Kubiak would rather have one of those four guys instead. And before you come to me with the inevitable "none of those guys have been there as long as Kubiak's been here", let me say that the comparison is not length of tenure but rather "echelon" of coaching, and three of those four coaches coach teams that people LOVE this year and see as legitimate candidates to win the Super Bowl.

So are Rick/Gary, who transformed this team from the Casserly/Capers/Carr years into a stable, respected organization, merely "one Jacoby Jones catastrophe away from AFC Championship Game"-quality? The point is that Kubiak may not get it done here, and his time should be up here because it HASN'T happened, but that doesn't mean that Smith and Kubiak can't do it here or anywhere else because some arbitrary garbage like "SB winning quality."
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Old 11-09-2013   #223
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

Fox made a SB with Delhomme as his QB and made several NFC championship games.

Rick/Gary?
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Old 11-09-2013   #224
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by TheMatrix31 View Post
I can't believe I have to read about this tanking **** on THIS board too. Already deal with it with moron basketball and hockey fans. And the meaning of "tanking" is not understood. "Tanking" is losing games on purpose. If you are an advocate of such actions, you are a loser. Just GTFO.

Look, you can find a contributor anywhere. And look, there are 32 ****ing teams in this league. Not everyone can be in the playoffs and not everyone can be in bottom 5. We are very clearly not the worst team in the league or close to it. It's a down year with lots of bad luck. That doesn't mean we're perpetually worthless like some other teams that are perpetually worthless. You cannot breed a winning culture by losing. Look at the Browns and Bills. They're perpetual LOSERS.

I am SO SICK of this damn argument INFECTING every single sport. I don't know where it came from and why it started getting more popular in recent years but it's as infuriating as people who use the word "hater" "hating on", etc. All I know is that it needs to die a painful death.
We dont agree with much, but we agree on this kudos !
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Old 11-09-2013   #225
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by EllisUnit View Post
i think a shiny new QB can make all the difference, we all saw how we took KC down to the wire, and how we were crushing the colts until Kubiak has his mini stroke. Sure we are 0-2 since Keenum took over but the play calling has changed, the overall mindset of the team has changed. After seeing how this team is coached with Keenum at QB i am more than confident in Kubiak, i wasnt before when Schaub was QB. But i am now with how i see how he calls games with Keenum running the Offense.
The play calling on offense hasn't changed at all, neither has the scheme, outside of using some pistol. Same plays, different result.
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Old 11-09-2013   #226
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

He's dead, Jim.
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Old 11-09-2013   #227
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by steelbtexan View Post
Fox made a SB with Delhomme as his QB and made several NFC championship games.

Rick/Gary?
And he couldn't get it done. It's obvious John Fox is not "SB winning quality" then, right?
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Old 11-09-2013   #228
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by steelbtexan View Post
Fox made a SB with Delhomme as his QB and made several NFC championship games.

Rick/Gary?
He made one NFC Championship appearance while coaching the Panthers, and that was the one that got him to the SB.
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Old 11-09-2013   #229
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by TheMatrix31 View Post
You mean you didn't have any hope we could have seen the Texans in a Super Bowl last year or the year before, even though we were playing in the Divisional Round, two games away from being in the Super Bowl? Especially in 2011 where we were one muffed punt/arguably the dumbest thing I've ever seen a player do in the playoffs away from making it to the AFC Championship Game?

I get saying Kubiak's had enough time and all that, but to say things like "I don't see any hope of ever seeing the Texans in a Super Bowl as long as he is here" especially given the insane obstacles we were facing in 2011/12 is asinine at best.
Well the Texans didn't make it in either of those years. Who did they play that 2010/2011 season? Super soft schedule. And 2012 was an epic fail. Elite teams exposed the Texans and they blew the number 1 seed and home field throughout. Horrible coaching. Players can say what they want about Kubiak but their on field performance speaks louder than words. Kubiak constantly gets out coached in critical big games. So it seems asinine at best to me to assume they can make it under Kubiak when it is those type of games you have to win to get there. He keeps proving to you he can't. They lose to the elite teams when it matters. It seems the only team they can beat in the playoffs is the Bengals which is another poorly coached team.

It would take a qb like Peyton Manning that really coaches his own offense at the los and/or an elite defense like the 2000 Ravens or 85 bears to overcome the inadequacy of Kubiak's coaching ability. Then there is hope.
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Old 11-09-2013   #230
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by TexansSeminole View Post
The play calling on offense hasn't changed at all, neither has the scheme, outside of using some pistol. Same plays, different result.
NO that is not true, how many bootlegs in the last 2 seasons have we seen run by Schaub ? And how many in the past 2 games have we seen run by keenum......Different play calling and calling the games different.
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Old 11-09-2013   #231
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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He's dead, Jim.
LMAO!!!Klingon's on the starboard bow!!!!
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Old 11-09-2013   #232
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

I think Rick has made to many bone headed moves


I still think Kubes can win a SB here one day I just don't know win


but RICK has to go he made to many errors

but since they came in has a combo they might has well leave has a combo
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Old 11-10-2013   #233
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

Road to 10-6 starts tomorrow!!

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Old 11-10-2013   #234
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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NO that is not true, how many bootlegs in the last 2 seasons have we seen run by Schaub ? And how many in the past 2 games have we seen run by keenum......Different play calling and calling the games different.
Slightly more bootlegs by Keenum, because he is more effective on the move. The plays are the same though. Schaub ran bootlegs ALL the time. The overall offense hasn't changed at all really.

Last edited by TexansSeminole; 11-10-2013 at 02:16 AM.
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Old 11-10-2013   #235
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

This season is over because the Texans are gonna lose more than 2 games in the final 8. It is a given that one of those losses will be @ Indy. But just for the heck of it if by some miracle the Texans win the other 7 it is still possible to get the #6 seed, but they would need help from more than a handful of teams, with Miami and Tennessee being the biggest threats. The Jets already have 4 conference losses, so assuming that the Texans win all games except @ Indy (mission impossible) the Texans would also have only 4 conference losses. The Texans win the tiebreaker against the Jets. They already own the tie breaker againt San Diego.
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Old 11-10-2013   #236
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by steelbtexan View Post
8 yrs in NFL time is beyond patient.

How many yrs would you suggest BoB give Rick/Gary 10 yrs, 20 yrs, 50 yrs ?

It's obvious that Rick/Gary aren't SB winning quality.
What I'm saying is that 8 years is unusual in the NFL BUT that's because most owners are too impatient and give up on someone after 2-4 years. If giving someone 10+ years instead of 2-4 were more the norm, I think some teams would be (or would have been) much more successful.

The Steelers gave Cowher 14 years to win a SB and he ended up building a team that won multiple. OTOH, if they'd followed your strategy, they would have fired Cowher over and over and over throwing the baby out with the bathwater several times.

It's not obvious to me that Rick/Gary aren't SB winning quality. Quite the opposite, really. I think they're very capable of winning a SB.
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Old 11-10-2013   #237
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by ChampionTexan View Post
He made one NFC Championship appearance while coaching the Panthers, and that was the one that got him to the SB.
He actually got to the Conference Championships twice, iirc.
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Old 11-10-2013   #238
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by steelbtexan View Post
Fox made a SB with Delhomme as his QB and made several NFC championship games.

Rick/Gary?
Out of 9 seasons, Fox made the playoffs 3x.

At Denver, he was able to win as many playoff games with Peyton Manning as he did with Tim Tebow.

Just because someone doesn't win a SB doesn't mean they aren't capable of winning a SB. Just because a team has a bad year that doesn't mean that the head coach is incapable of winning it all. Unless you agree with the Browns firing Belichick.
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Old 11-10-2013   #239
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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He actually got to the Conference Championships twice, iirc.
Yep - my mistake.
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Old 11-10-2013   #240
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Default Re: We arent out of it yet...

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
What I'm saying is that 8 years is unusual in the NFL BUT that's because most owners are too impatient and give up on someone after 2-4 years. If giving someone 10+ years instead of 2-4 were more the norm, I think some teams would be (or would have been) much more successful.

The Steelers gave Cowher 14 years to win a SB and he ended up building a team that won multiple. OTOH, if they'd followed your strategy, they would have fired Cowher over and over and over throwing the baby out with the bathwater several times.

It's not obvious to me that Rick/Gary aren't SB winning quality. Quite the opposite, really. I think they're very capable of winning a SB.
Yeah, but after eight years, Cowher had at least gotten to a Super Bowl and had already made the AFC championship game three times, IIRC, and made the playoffs with regularity. The potential to win a Super Bowl was plainly there. Gary/Rick have not come close to doing that.

That's not to say they can't do it- I believe with Case, and his ability to open things up a bit, they have a chance in the upcoming years. However, comparing Cowher and Rick/Gary is a losing comparison.
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