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Old 10-15-2013   #81
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
Koch & Kalu are my favorites as well. But... they have no more insight to the Texans than you or I do. Other than the fact that they've played in the NFL & that Kalu played for Kubiak....

For instance, they both believe some of the players have lost faith & confidence in their coach/qb, but they clearly say it's their supposition, no one has told them as much.
I understand that, but most other radio hosts on houston sports radio seem to go 1 of 3 ways. They either:

Are straight up homers or try to steer clear of overtly calling a spade a spade - Lopez, Vandemeer, Lord....

They try too hard to be "critical" so as not to appear like they're homers - Innes, Nick Wright, LZ & Clanton...(have never liked this dude)

Or they try too hard trying to get laughs & entertain you with all kinds of other crap...LZ, Clanton mostly but Innes, Payne & Meltzer do that alot too.

When i listen to Cooke & Kalu, i feel like i'm just sitting at a bar talking shop with 2 guys who know & love the game....They're genuinely themselves on the radio. The fact that they played on the NFL level is an added bonus.....you get less BS like "SEC guy" or "celebrity birthdays". Apart from that, they look at things largely the same way i do in regards to the Texans & the NFL in general..i find myself agreeing with them alot.
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Old 10-15-2013   #82
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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Yeah, name all our other great players we've gotten with a 2nd rounder in our franchise history, which is why I said "hardly".
Because of trades, the Texans have not drafted in the second round in five of the 11 years in their history, but when they did make a pick, they usually nailed it. The 2nd round has been one of their most successful rounds in the draft.

As far as naming other players, there's plenty to choose from.

2011: Brooks Reed, OLB, Arizona (42); Brandon Harris, CB, Miami (Fla.) (60)
2010: Ben Tate, RB, Auburn (58)
2009: Connor Barwin, OLB, Cincinnati (46)
2006: DeMeco Ryans, LB, Alabama (33)
2003: Bennie Joppru, TE, Michigan (41)
2002: Jabar Gaffney, WR, Florida (33); Chester Pitts, T, San Diego State (50)

Out of the 8 players selected, I see only two obvious flops.. Joppru and Gaffney (who went on and had a decent NFL career as a journeyman WR), Brandon Harris is a possible third, but to say the Texans hardly ever find talent in the 2nd round isn't true.
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Old 10-15-2013   #83
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

You're supposed to hit on your first and second round players. The %'s start getting rougher at finding starters after this round. Texans have a mixed bag when it comes to drafting. Most teams are similar. It's not a science, it's more of an art.
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Old 10-15-2013   #84
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
Because of trades, the Texans have not drafted in the second round in five of the 11 years in their history, but when they did make a pick, they usually nailed it. The 2nd round has been one of their most successful rounds in the draft.

As far as naming other players, there's plenty to choose from.

2011: Brooks Reed, OLB, Arizona (42); Brandon Harris, CB, Miami (Fla.) (60)
2010: Ben Tate, RB, Auburn (58)
2009: Connor Barwin, OLB, Cincinnati (46)
2006: DeMeco Ryans, LB, Alabama (33)
2003: Bennie Joppru, TE, Michigan (41)
2002: Jabar Gaffney, WR, Florida (33); Chester Pitts, T, San Diego State (50)

Out of the 8 players selected, I see only two obvious flops.. Joppru and Gaffney (who went on and had a decent NFL career as a journeyman WR), Brandon Harris is a possible third, but to say the Texans hardly ever find talent in the 2nd round isn't true.
DeMeco and maybe Pitts are the only ones you listed who I'd consider good. Barwin had one good season and none of the rest outside of Pitts and Ryans even got offered a contract extension. I'd hardly call that successful but I guess we have different ideas of success, and I'd call both Reed and Harris flops but that's just me.
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Old 10-15-2013   #85
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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Originally Posted by TheIronDuke View Post
DeMeco and maybe Pitts are the only ones you listed who I'd consider good. Barwin had one good season and none of the rest outside of Pitts and Ryans even got offered a contract extension. I'd hardly call that successful but I guess we have different ideas of success, and I'd call both Reed and Harris flops but that's just me.
Drafting NFL starters is what I consider "successful".. of the 8 second round picks that the Texans have selected, 5 start/have started and the only reason why it isn't 6 is because Tate plays behind Arian Foster (so you don't think he's a good player?) and the reason why more of these players weren't offered a extension had more to do with Houston's cap situation than anything else.

As far as Conner Barwin's one good year.

J.J. Watt.. 28 tackles and 3.5 sacks
Conner Barwin.. 25 tackles and 3 sacks (already matched last year's total)

Did he only have one good year or did he just have a off year? Because he's on pace to have around double digit sacks.

Sorry, but I'm not buying the argument that the Texans don't hit on their second round picks.
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Old 10-15-2013   #86
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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Drafting NFL starters is what I consider "successful".. of the 8 second round picks that the Texans have selected, 5 start/have started and the only reason why it isn't 6 is because Tate plays behind Arian Foster (so you don't think he's a good player?) and the reason why more of these players weren't offered a extension had more to do with Houston's cap situation than anything else.

As far as Conner Barwin's one good year.

J.J. Watt.. 28 tackles and 3.5 sacks
Conner Barwin.. 25 tackles and 3 sacks (already matched last year's total)

Did he only have one good year or did he just have a off year? Because he's on pace to have around double digit sacks.

Sorry, but I'm not buying the argument that the Texans don't hit on their second round picks.
That's fine, I'm not buying that they draft good players in the second round because they've only drafted one Pro Bowl player in their history of second round picks and a lot of busts, including Reed and Harris who is a complete bust who can't even beat out McCain for God's sake.

And no, I don't think Tate is good and I've always expressed my dislike for Tate and will be glad when he's gone. I just hope he doesn't drop the pen when he signs with the Browns then hurts himself picking it up.
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Old 10-15-2013   #87
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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That's fine, I'm not buying that they draft good players in the second round because they've only drafted one Pro Bowl player in their history of second round picks and a lot of busts, including Reed and Harris who is a complete bust who can't even beat out McCain for God's sake.

And no, I don't think Tate is good and I've always expressed my dislike for Tate and will be glad when he's gone. I just hope he doesn't drop the pen when he signs with the Browns then hurts himself picking it up.
So unless they get a pro bowler they're failures? ooookay.

And who the hell thinks that a RB who has a career average greater than 5 YPC isn't good? There's a reason why he's going to have a opportunity to "drop the pen"... because he'd start on most other teams. Hell if Ben Tate is a bad 2nd round pick, I hope we always draft bad players in the 2nd round.
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Old 10-15-2013   #88
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

I said that they've drafted a single Pro Bowler in the second round in the history of the franchise. That doesn't mean that every player should be a Pro Bowler but 1 Pro Bowler from a draft position that's pretty important to a franchise isn't that great in my opinion. The rest of the 2nd rounders were used for Matt Schaub and the great Phillip Buchanon. Soooo, yeah, we haven't had much success where it comes to using second rounders and getting talent.

YPC doesn't mean much when you fumble in critical moments and can't be trusted by your HC to hold onto the damn ball and it also doesn't keep you out of the training room because you get hurt all the time.
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Old 10-15-2013   #89
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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I said that they've drafted a single Pro Bowler in the second round in the history of the franchise. That doesn't mean that every player should be a Pro Bowler but 1 Pro Bowler from a draft position that's pretty important to a franchise isn't that great in my opinion. The rest of the 2nd rounders were used for Matt Schaub and the great Phillip Buchanon. Soooo, yeah, we haven't had much success where it comes to using second rounders and getting talent.

YPC doesn't mean much when you fumble in critical moments and can't be trusted by your HC to hold onto the damn ball and it also doesn't keep you out of the training room because you get hurt all the time.
LOL, Ben Tate has just 7 career fumbles, let not over-exaggerate the situation.. and the same can be said for your assessment on his injury situation.. The guy has only had one significant injury in his career that caused him to miss significant time.

1 pro bowler out of 8 picks isn't bad. (you need to go pull up other team's draft history.. it's pretty much par for the course. Go pull up what the Pats have gotten from their bazillion 2nd round picks they've had over the years) Getting 6 starting caliber players isn't bad.

And Brooks Reed is not a bust, that's just more hyperbole you use to prove some misguided point. Is he a hit.. no, a bust? nope. He's a serviceable NFL player. Seth Wand, Tony Hollings, David Carr, Travis Johnson, Amobi Okoye.. those are busts.
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Old 10-15-2013   #90
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

Drafting in the 2nd round you'd ideally want to get a player who is capable of starting on most NFL teams. That is, if you want to win super bowls via the model of building through the draft. On this list I see Pitts, Demeco and Tate as guys who could start on most NFL teams while they were with us. Due to Tate's injury history he may arguably be in the second tier JAG category below. We'll see when he has a starter's role on his next team.

The next tier is guys like Barwin and Reed. They are "just a guy". You can get that production from 4th rounders if that's what you're into. Enjoy your 8-8 seasons while you're at it.

Gaffney, Joppru and Brandon Harris are in the dubious "bust" category. You don't have winning football teams by drafting busts in the 2nd round.


2011: Brooks Reed, OLB, Arizona (42); Brandon Harris, CB, Miami (Fla.) (60)
2010: Ben Tate, RB, Auburn (58)
2009: Connor Barwin, OLB, Cincinnati (46)
2006: DeMeco Ryans, LB, Alabama (33)
2003: Bennie Joppru, TE, Michigan (41)
2002: Jabar Gaffney, WR, Florida (33); Chester Pitts, T, San Diego State (50)
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Old 10-15-2013   #91
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

Yeah Tony Hollings was a bust, who we got by using a 2nd round pick in the supplemental draft.

Defend Tate all you want. His fumble against the Seahawks is what changed the momentum in that game. He missed his rookie season due to injury and then in 2012 he missed 5 games due to another injury. By the way, he's lost one less fumble than Foster has in their careers. He fumbles a lot and he gets hurt a lot and I don't see how you can argue that but I know you like to argue on the Jags message boards and here so whatever.
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Old 10-15-2013   #92
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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Yeah Tony Hollings was a bust, who we got by using a 2nd round pick in the supplemental draft.

Defend Tate all you want. His fumble against the Seahawks is what changed the momentum in that game. He missed his rookie season due to injury and then in 2012 he missed 5 games due to another injury. By the way, he's lost one less fumble than Foster has in their careers. He fumbles a lot and he gets hurt a lot and I don't see how you can argue that but I know you like to argue on the Jags message boards and here so whatever.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure Schaub's hand grenade to the flat is what changed momentum against the Seahawks.

And what does any of my posts on a Jags message board have to do with this thread? Are you stalking me or something? Now you just sound butt hurt.
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Old 10-15-2013   #93
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

If Tate doesn't fumble on our side of the field and instead holds onto the rock, we run a lot of clock against the Seahawks. But he also fumbled against Denver last year on their side of the field and let them back in the game then as well. So he does have a history of fumbling and usually at the most inopportune time which is why Kubes doesn't use him as much and instead runs Arian into the ground.

And no I don't stalk you dude and I'm not butt hurt, I just don't think it's worth arguing about if we're good with second round picks when we're obviously not. I even agreed that Hollings was a bust and just as an aside pointed out that we suck with 2nd rounders anyway. Didn't think it'd be a whole thing.
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Old 10-15-2013   #94
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Default Re: Travis Johnson on sports radio 610

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...and Harris who is a complete bust who can't even beat out McCain for God's sake.
A little off topic, but why hasn't he replaced McCain?

If Jjo goes out, they bring Harris in. If Kj goes out, they bring Harris in. But if McCain plays like crap...... I've got this conspiracy theory that I'm working on.
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