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Old 05-30-2013   #41
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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There's an old saying that the most popular man on any team is the 2nd string QB. That's because the fans often blame all the teams problems on the 1st string QB and think the 2nd stringer would be better.
Right on Right on Right on. And it's always been that way.
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Old 05-30-2013   #42
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
There's an old saying that the most popular man on any team is the 2nd string QB. That's because the fans often blame all the teams problems on the 1st string QB and think the 2nd stringer would be better.
Considering how much he is payed and how he performs, I don't think it's unfair. It comes with the job. The QB is the general of the offense and Schaub is our highest paid player. AJ and Foster, while great offensive weapons, cannot throw the ball. Until Schaub shows he can carry the Texans consistently when needed, it will be in the Texans best interest to finding his replacement. Hopefully that is either Yates or Keenum so we wont have to look far.
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Old 05-30-2013   #43
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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How mobile is Keenum? I'm sick of seeing Schaub unable to make ANY kind of play once the called play breaks down
Very!
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Old 05-30-2013   #44
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
There's an old saying that the most popular man on any team is the 2nd string QB. That's because the fans often blame all the teams problems on the 1st string QB and think the 2nd stringer would be better.
Except no one is saying Keenum will be better. After last preseason, no one is even saying Yates will be better. There are people who want to see what both of these guys can do in training camp and preseason. That's a far cry from saying they will be better. But we know what we have in Schaub. Preseason is the time to find out what we have in the other guys.
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Old 05-30-2013   #45
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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Yikes, the off-season, where verbal battles occur over two mediocre backup QBs.
well, yeah, there really is not much to talk about, so I kinda give this a pass. the only thing i find funny is the people using some form of replacemnt or future starter when talking about either of them.
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Old 05-30-2013   #46
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

When Yates' questionable performance last year comes up, Kubiak refers to him being injured last year. He appeared on the Injury Report first in week 9. His preseason performance was lackluster to say the least during which he was sacked 8 times in 3 games. He appeared in week 6 with a 2 of 5 40% completion rate, 1 interception and a QB rating of 15. Then while on the Injury List, he appeared in week 14 with a 2 of 4 50% completion rate for a 59.4 QBR. And he appeared last in week 16 with a 0 of 1 0% completion rate with taking a sack and earning a 39.6 QBR. Certainly, a small sample size, but nothing that you could explain away by injury alone. Maybe it's just me, but this doesn't exactly lead me to wanting to clamor to have his name called on Sundays as that supposedly "most popular man on the team."
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Old 05-30-2013   #47
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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Originally Posted by chenjy9 View Post
Due to complete lack of faith by most fans in our starting QB.
Sounds very subjective. How do you quantify "most fans"? Forums? Sports talk radio? That accounts for maybe 1% of our fanbase.

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If Schaub could carry the team worth a damn, we wouldn't even care about Yates or Keenum.
Ahhh, the old "Texans went 22-10 over the last two seasons in spite of their starting QB and his 6500 passing yards" routine.

If you honestly believe that either Yates or Keenum could carry this team better than Schaub in 2013, the only thing I can say is that I am really glad you are a fan and not part of this coaching staff.
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Old 05-30-2013   #48
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Matt Flynn, LSU 50
That's why he gets so much love around here.... I couldn't figure it out. I'm not seeing special when I see the guy, but he's got to be the most hyped back-up since SageRosenfels.
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Old 05-30-2013   #49
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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Absolutely.

We will never know unless they get game time, which hopefully we can avoid and keep our starter healthy, and he doesn't make too many mistakes and we improve this season. However, seeing as both of them have stronger arms and more mobility than Matt, I wouldn't panic if either of them had to take the reigns.

Accuracy comes with making good decisions, which should improve with game experience.

Hope this proves to be a great year for Schaub, but we have some decent back-ups if it doesn't.
I pretty much feel the same way. This is a QB friendly system & as long as Yates/Keenum can keep from being stupid.... we can win some games, we've got a lot of talent, for what we want to do.

I'm not dying to see either of them mind you, but I am intrigued.
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Old 05-31-2013   #50
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

Don't see competition as Case vs Yates until something happens to Schaub. Kubiak did not insert TJ even when there were plenty opportunities. I really think Yates can play, in fact he gives Texans harder offense to game plan against. Case however maybe the future post Schaub.
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Old 05-31-2013   #51
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

I'm hoping Case is the guy, but I don't care who the starting QB is as long as he's good. Schaub is going to have to be replaced at some point anyway.
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Old 05-31-2013   #52
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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I'm hoping Case is the guy, but I don't care who the starting QB is as long as he's good. Schaub is going to have to be replaced at some point anyway.
If we can develop starting QB and corners from our roster that would sure help our next draft plan.
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Old 05-31-2013   #53
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

I think Case could easily be a better QB than Schaub if given time. I'm not sure about Yates. He has the tools, but he makes some head scratching decisions sometimes. I'd like for him to be a little more reserved at times.

I think Case if very smart, reads defenses fast and is very accurate.

I'm interested in seeing them both compete for the back up job.

If something happened and one of them had to take some time being the number 1 QB, I would not panic. It might be a little bumpy here and there, but I don't think Schaub brings so much to the table that if you lose him your season outlook significantly changes.

The offense doesn't revolve around what he brings to the table as the QB like in some other offenses.

Don't get me wrong....I'd rather have Schaub. But I honestly don't believe the team greatly suffers when he's out. I think we are a bit worse overall...But I think we are about the same.
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Old 05-31-2013   #54
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
I pretty much feel the same way. This is a QB friendly system & as long as Yates/Keenum can keep from being stupid.... we can win some games, we've got a lot of talent, for what we want to do.

I'm not dying to see either of them mind you, but I am intrigued.
It should be telling when we see who gets the most snaps in preseason. Like you, I'm intrigued.

As to another post that stated that we didn't see Yates even when there were opportunities to play him, I say that's kinda smart by Kubiak (barring Schaub getting injured in garbage time) because it never lets a real QB controversy start. If Yates came in and did some really good things, the next time Schaub had a bad game, people would be screaming for Yates.
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Old 05-31-2013   #55
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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If something happened and one of them had to take some time being the number 1 QB, I would not panic. It might be a little bumpy here and there, but I don't think Schaub brings so much to the table that if you lose him your season outlook significantly changes.
The only reservation I have about drafting Schaub's replacement now, is that I don't think we're ready for it. I don't want to be in a position where we have to give up an entire draft to get our starter.

Even though Washington had a good draft in 2012, & 2013 I would've been uncomfortable with that. After watching RG3 his rookie year, not so much. But they still had a crap load of picks in both years.

I liked how Denver was able to move up & get Cutler, I would have been fine with a move like that.

I'd have liked to have seen RickSmith start stockpiling future picks the last couple of years so we would be able to do something like that, if we saw our guy somewhere in the 5 to 15 range.

At the same time, I like how Holmgren was able to get Hasselbeck, who I've always liked as a starting QB, when he was in Seattle. Payton wanted to bring Romo with him when he went to N.O. that would have been interesting. Them getting Brees, that was a "stars aligning" kind of thing, you usually don't see that kind of player available in FA. & we've done pretty good with Schaub and that only cost us two 2nds.... & with QBs like Kolb, Flyn, Palmer, & the like out there, I think our options will probably extend beyond the draft.

But no, I'm not worried about starting Yates/Keenum if it comes down to it. We'll win some, we'll lose some but at the end of the day, we'll move forward... I think.
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Old 05-31-2013   #56
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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The only reservation I have about drafting Schaub's replacement now, is that I don't think we're ready for it. I don't want to be in a position where we have to give up an entire draft to get our starter.

Even though Washington had a good draft in 2012, & 2013 I would've been uncomfortable with that. After watching RG3 his rookie year, not so much. But they still had a crap load of picks in both years.

I liked how Denver was able to move up & get Cutler, I would have been fine with a move like that.

I'd have liked to have seen RickSmith start stockpiling future picks the last couple of years so we would be able to do something like that, if we saw our guy somewhere in the 5 to 15 range.

At the same time, I like how Holmgren was able to get Hasselbeck, who I've always liked as a starting QB, when he was in Seattle. Payton wanted to bring Romo with him when he went to N.O. that would have been interesting. Them getting Brees, that was a "stars aligning" kind of thing, you usually don't see that kind of player available in FA. & we've done pretty good with Schaub and that only cost us two 2nds.... & with QBs like Kolb, Flyn, Palmer, & the like out there, I think our options will probably extend beyond the draft.

But no, I'm not worried about starting Yates/Keenum if it comes down to it. We'll win some, we'll lose some but at the end of the day, we'll move forward... I think.
The thing about QBs is , how many frogs do you have to kiss before you get a prince ? I'm not sure how long it takes to figure this out but after a couple of years you'd think they have an idea .
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Old 05-31-2013   #57
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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The thing about QBs is , how many frogs do you have to kiss before you get a prince ? I'm not sure how long it takes to figure this out but after a couple of years you'd think they have an idea .
Unless you're the Packers or the Colts, it can be very frustrating. I remember reading an interesting bit somewhere that the Bears had 17 different starting QB's during Favre's years in GB.
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Old 05-31-2013   #58
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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The thing about QBs is , how many frogs do you have to kiss before you get a prince ? I'm not sure how long it takes to figure this out but after a couple of years you'd think they have an idea .
The problem is that "they" is the NFL as a whole.

Upgrading the QB position when you've got a good QB is hard thing to do. There's some luck and some chance involved.

People sometimes forget this but the Packers were all set with Don Majkowski. He led the league in passing one year and then had a couple of years shortened by injury. When the Packers traded for Favre, Favre wasn't expected to be The Guy, Majkowski was supposed to be it.

Brian Billick was the "offensive mastermind" who put together the awesome Minnesota offense that looked great with all sorts of QBs at the helm (Moon, Cunningham, Culpepper, Johnson, etc.) Then he goes to Baltimore and... he can't EVEN figure out drafting the QB position. The Dolphins are still looking for Marino's replacement.

I'm fine with upgrading any position on the team, especially the QB. I'm not married to Schaub and I realize he's got limitations. If we can get a guy better than him at running this offense, great. I just don't believe it's as easy to do as some people on this board think. Over the years, I've seen too many teams swing and miss on drafting QBs to have any level of comfort that ANY FO, including this one, can hit on drafting one at will. And I don't think there are any other guys out there I'd be willing to trade for that are available for trade that would be an upgrade over Schaub. I think we could probably find an upgrade for TJ/Case but I think even then the price would be too steep.
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Old 05-31-2013   #59
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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Over the years, I've seen too many teams swing and miss on drafting QBs to have any level of comfort that ANY FO, including this one, can hit on drafting one at will.
I agree. I'd like to add that though it appears Harbaugh figured it out, or Carol, or Pagano, or Shanahan figured it out, remember when Romo took the league by storm, or when Sam Bradford flashed, or Stafford, or Cam Newton.

I know it's only going on year three for Cam, & there's still hope for Bradford & Stafford, & Romo is putting up Schaub like numbers..... but whatever type of QB you're looking for those guys provide examples that shows you're going to need a team, regardless. Phillip Rivers is another one.

& if you believe every year is unique, Schaub got us as far as Peyton got his team, as far as Rogers got his team, as Russell Wilson got his team. That doesn't mean that Schaub is good enough to get us to a SuperBowl, but at the very least it shows that sometimes the QB isn't enough, even when you're looking at Peyton, Rogers, & Wilson.
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Old 05-31-2013   #60
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Default Re: TJ Yates vs Case Keenum (Training Camp/Pre season 2013)

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...Kubiak did not insert TJ even when there were plenty opportunities...
I'm a firm believer in giving your backup QB quality playing time with the first team, when game situations allow it. It just doesn't happen, though. I think coaches think it is disruptive to the team and players.
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