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Old 05-17-2008   #41
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by barrett View Post
on HT.com Okam is asked who he'd like to play against the most. I love his response...

"...the Titans because I finally will have a chance to sack Vince Young. We never got to touch him in practice at Texas.”

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/St...?story_id=4324
HA! Thanks for posting that. Great quote.
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Old 05-17-2008   #42
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Default Re: Okam

no problem.

i hate vince young. i live in austin. you have no idea. i was at academy two days ago and i walked past there sports wear section and all you can see is cowboys jerseys and vince young jerseys. not one texans jersey, t-shirt, or even a {ucking hat.
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Old 05-17-2008   #43
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Lucky View Post
I couldn't remember who the Texans LB coach was prior to Holland without looking him up (Tom Olivadotti). I'm thinking those drafts would have been equally inept had these lower assistants had input. Other than the assistants the Texans kept (Marciano, Harris, Hoke), I don't know of any others still in the league (wait, Kippy Brown is with the Lions).

Here's a post-draft review of the Texans effort from Scout.com's Tom Marino. Not that I agree with Marino on much of anything he said. He thinks Duane Brown was a major reach. He thinks Molden was drafted in the 2nd round. But, Marino was a scout for 35 years. And his take on the Texans coaches' involvement in the draft is interesting.

As a former scout, Marino is complaining about coaches mucking up the draft process. Scouts watch players all season, then the coaches see them in all star games and workouts and disregard the scouts' opinions. I can see both sides. The coaches should be able to do some grocery shopping, but the scouts have followed the players more closely. Some balance between the two sides is likely needed. Who knows for sure how that plays out for the Texans? Perception is that Brown was an Alex Gibbs pick. Did Gibbs fall in love with Browns measurables, or does he know a winner when he sees one?
I take the Texans at their word on Brown. They scouted who might fit as a ZBS O linemen. Then they looked at who was likely going to be still available by the time the Texans picked. Then they really focused on those guys to see if they made sense for the team.

(And they pretty much nailed Brown's value in this particular draft given what the 49ers were planning to do next).

With only 5 picks in the draft and lots of needs, it was pretty obvious that they weren't going to have any room to move up.

And if you look at Brown's career, in some ways it is right up the alley of what the Texans like. Selfless guys who do what the coaches want and the team needs, are teachable and are leaders and good guys in the lockerroom.

I think some scouts look at players in a vacuum without figuring out how they might fit on a particular team. Through Round 5, the Texans picked a bunch of guys who you can picture in your mind as someone who fits what the Texans are looking for. That they are the type of guys they like, and fit very specific needs. Especially in lower rounds, relative worth of players is very very subjective.

I've been told by more than one person for the Texans that fit is a really important thing to Kubiak and company. That guys who don't fit the true believer, try hard, have their football priorities straight, just get it guys, really stand out in the locker room as people who don't fit in.

If getting those players who get it is a priority, a lot of players may come off your draft board.
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Old 05-17-2008   #44
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
I take the Texans at their word on Brown. They scouted who might fit as a ZBS O linemen. Then they looked at who was likely going to be still available by the time the Texans picked. Then they really focused on those guys to see if they made sense for the team.

(And they pretty much nailed Brown's value in this particular draft given what the 49ers were planning to do next).

With only 5 picks in the draft and lots of needs, it was pretty obvious that they weren't going to have any room to move up.

And if you look at Brown's career, in some ways it is right up the alley of what the Texans like. Selfless guys who do what the coaches want and the team needs, are teachable and are leaders and good guys in the lockerroom.

I think some scouts look at players in a vacuum without figuring out how they might fit on a particular team. Through Round 5, the Texans picked a bunch of guys who you can picture in your mind as someone who fits what the Texans are looking for. That they are the type of guys they like, and fit very specific needs. Especially in lower rounds, relative worth of players is very very subjective.

I've been told by more than one person for the Texans that fit is a really important thing to Kubiak and company. That guys who don't fit the true believer, try hard, have their football priorities straight, just get it guys, really stand out in the locker room as people who don't fit in.

If getting those players who get it is a priority, a lot of players may come off your draft board.
I believe you're exactly right . It seems like the good fit guys can play a bit also , hopefully good enough to go to a super bowl .
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Old 05-17-2008   #45
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
And if you look at Brown's career, in some ways it is right up the alley of what the Texans like. Selfless guys who do what the coaches want and the team needs, are teachable and are leaders and good guys in the lockerroom.
And in the classroom/smart. How many guys were captains of their college teams? At least four from this class alone.

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
I think some scouts look at players in a vacuum without figuring out how they might fit on a particular team. If getting those players who get it is a priority, a lot of players may come off your draft board.
Good article in the draft issue of ProFootballWeekly about understanding draft value and the difference between grading for the league (more media and workout influenced) and grading for the scheme. I think one of Casserley's big problems was he didn't know how to pick players to fit their scheme, most glaringly the 3-4, and probably why he undervalued middle-round picks. He was grading for the league. But he did say that Kubiak was extremely good at articulating exactly the type of player he wanted for the 06 draft.

Interestingly, in the book The Draft: A Year Inside the NFL's Search for Talent, the Atlanta Falcons took TJ off their board because he didn't pass their character filter. Of course, that didn't really help them a whole lot with Ron Mexico.
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Old 05-17-2008   #46
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Rex King View Post
Of course, that didn't really help them a whole lot with Ron Mexico.
Sorry to disrupt the flow of the conversation but who is Ron Mexico? I don't get the name? I did a search and it only came up with a Michael Vick. What's the correlation?
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Old 05-17-2008   #47
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Default Re: Okam

From wiki:

"In March 2005 a woman named Sonya Elliott filed a civil lawsuit against Vick alleging she contracted genital herpes from Vick, in the autumn of 2002, and that he failed to inform her that he had the disease.[25] Elliot further alleged that Vick had visited clinics under the alias "Ron Mexico" to get treatments and thus he knew of his condition. On April 24, 2006 Vick's attorney, Lawrence Woodward, revealed that the lawsuit had settled out of court with an undisclosed amount.[26] Many fans bought custom jerseys from NFL.com with Vick's number 7 and the name "MEXICO" on the back, as a reference to his lawsuit. The NFL has since banned customizing jerseys with the name Mexico."

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Old 05-17-2008   #48
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by NitroHonda View Post
Sorry to disrupt the flow of the conversation but who is Ron Mexico? I don't get the name? I did a search and it only came up with a Michael Vick. What's the correlation?
ron mexico is the alias michael vick used at a clinic getting an STD test
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Old 05-22-2008   #49
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Default Re: Okam

5 16(151) Frank Okam DT TEXAS
Okam is a classic underachiever. Although he has outstanding size and flashes great lateral mobility, he's extremely inconsistent. He takes far too many plays off and appears to wear down. There are also questions about his work ethic and love for the game.


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Old 05-22-2008   #50
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Default Re: Okam

I don't know where they got that from.

But after reviewing the UT-OU game, I was very impressed with Okam. Especially in the fourth quarter. He definitely did not take any play off the whole game. He was fighting through double teams about 2/3 of the times.

If he plays like that fourth quarter, I would see him as our starter on day one.

If he plays like he did through that whole game and also the first half of the 06 Rose Bowl (I haven't reviewed the 2nd half yet), I see him in the rotation on day one and eventually compete for the starting job.

Maybe I need to see more of him before I think so highly of the guy!
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Old 05-22-2008   #51
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
I take the Texans at their word on Brown....

if you look at Brown's career, in some ways it is right up the alley of what the Texans like. Selfless guys who do what the coaches want and the team needs, are teachable and are leaders and good guys in the lockerroom.

If getting those players who get it is a priority, a lot of players may come off your draft board.
one of the main reasons why i love this team. they get guys that get it. guys that are good people and hard working members of something great.
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Old 05-22-2008   #52
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Default Re: Okam

Great breakdown of Okam's career opposed to other DT's taken here.
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Old 05-22-2008   #53
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Dan B. View Post
Great breakdown of Okam's career opposed to other DT's taken here.
Well worth the read.

Hopefully AO and Big Frank will form a bond and feed off of each other. They would make an awesome duo.
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Old 05-22-2008   #54
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Dan B. View Post
Great breakdown of Okam's career opposed to other DT's taken here.
Everybody here should read that article. It is great.
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Old 05-22-2008   #55
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
I don't think they reached at all...Mayo was one of my favorite front7 players in this draft. People tend to praise NE because they draft so well. People tend to not praise us since we had such a miserable draft record leading up to the new management and coaching staff. For the record, NE was reamed up and down for their first draft in the Belicheck era....people were giving them F's and D's and hammered them for "reaching" and passing on "proven talent"...but it turned out to be an outstanding draft.
Mayo was a great pick, but I feel they reached on their other picks. I think they could have gotten more value with their 2nd and 3rd rounders than they did IMO.
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Old 05-22-2008   #56
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by barrett View Post
on HT.com Okam is asked who he'd like to play against the most. I love his response...

"...the Titans because I finally will have a chance to sack Vince Young. We never got to touch him in practice at Texas.”

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/St...?story_id=4324

He is not just saying that because he is with the Texans. That was his response in interviews before the draft.
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Old 05-22-2008   #57
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
He is not just saying that because he is with the Texans. That was his response in interviews before the draft.
Mmm, that's kind of interesting. I suspect that there may be a bit of resentment in Frank that VY was treated that way and may really want to smack him around. I thought he was just saying to play to the Texans fans. Go big Frank!
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Old 05-22-2008   #58
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Default Re: Okam

From the article above linked by Dan B.
This is a case where a high wonderlic score might have hurt a prospect. I can see the coaches & scouts thinking "We want D-linemen who react, not think." I realize that I'm pretty much alone in this opinion. I know the NFL disagrees with me. But I think the Wonderlic is worthless is determining a prospect's ability to play in the NFL.

"Lucky, you must have flunked the Wonderlic yourself. NFL playbooks are huge and complex, and the Wonderlic helps teams identify players who can absorb that information and utilize it in a timely manner."

OK, then give these guys a football test. The playbook doesn't have anything about two trains leaving Chicago. It has formations and plays. That there are teams out there using this test to make football decisions is just plain nutty. If I were a NFL GM, I'd use the test results to line the birdcage.

So I think Okam's Wonderlic score probably played into the notion that he lacked passion for the game. But, so did showing up at the combine in the 340 lb range. If Frank paid for one of these draft prep camps, he should ask for his money back.
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Old 05-22-2008   #59
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Dan B. View Post
Great breakdown of Okam's career opposed to other DT's taken here.
I think that's a good article to read and I really do like Okam. He could be such a perfect fit next to Okoye.

But... I really dislike when people/articles/commentators/etc. focus their entire thoughts or article on stats. Stats, stats, stats... you can only read into them SO much. Obviously, you want a player to have better stats than the next but there are SOOO many different variables that go into how a player got those stats (or didn't) that are rarely ever talked about.

I understand the point of the article was addressing how Okam had just as good or better stats than any other DT in the draft... and that's awesome, it really opened up my eyes about that- but I think you can find a lot of players like that at other positions too.

Take Colt Brennan for example, you could probably compare his passing stats and everything and he may come out very near the top of the QB's. Just using that as an example, I really don't feel like looking up the stats- but the point being is that most players on every team are asked to do different things and take on certain responsibilities to make THAT team the best it can be. A coach can easily put a player in a situation to go after the QB more which may in turn lead to more sacks, but if they have a better chance of winning by focusing on the run, then that's what is going to happen.

Not trying to take away anything from Okam because I absolutely love the pick and think he's a steal in the 5th round, but just trying to play devils advocate.
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Old 05-22-2008   #60
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Default Re: Okam

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Originally Posted by Ole Miss Texan View Post
I think that's a good article to read and I really do like Okam. He could be such a perfect fit next to Okoye.

But... I really dislike when people/articles/commentators/etc. focus their entire thoughts or article on stats. Stats, stats, stats... you can only read into them SO much. Obviously, you want a player to have better stats than the next but there are SOOO many different variables that go into how a player got those stats (or didn't) that are rarely ever talked about.

I understand the point of the article was addressing how Okam had just as good or better stats than any other DT in the draft... and that's awesome, it really opened up my eyes about that- but I think you can find a lot of players like that at other positions too.

Take Colt Brennan for example, you could probably compare his passing stats and everything and he may come out very near the top of the QB's. Just using that as an example, I really don't feel like looking up the stats- but the point being is that most players on every team are asked to do different things and take on certain responsibilities to make THAT team the best it can be. A coach can easily put a player in a situation to go after the QB more which may in turn lead to more sacks, but if they have a better chance of winning by focusing on the run, then that's what is going to happen.

Not trying to take away anything from Okam because I absolutely love the pick and think he's a steal in the 5th round, but just trying to play devils advocate.
I can see where you are going with that but the difference is once Colt Brennan played against top college talent he looked like garbage paste and Okam played against top talent for the majority of the season. That being said, Okam didnt ever seem to dominate a game like Glenn Dorsey did so I dont think that there is much of a comparison between the two.

I will say this I think the Texans will put him in a position to succeed with the other talent that we already have on the line. And the line minus Okam wasnt the strength of the Texas defense.
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